GGG has 40 employees. Why is POE more popular than D3?

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12/26/2014 10:51 PMPosted by Amira
12/26/2014 08:12 PMPosted by Monsta
Blizzard doesn't have to do this, they already have our money. But they do it anyways because they do want to make their game better for players.


Otherwise, no one's gonna buy their expansions or D4.


Don't be surprised when you see another expansion for this game that outsells the last one or D4 that outsells D3.

12/26/2014 05:08 PMPosted by Relentless
12/26/2014 05:01 PMPosted by Ambush
You do understand most people manually download POE and play it without steam..... right?


Yes I do, but if D3 lost over 90% of it's playerbase since they last quarterly report from Activision/Blizzard it would have a larger playerbase. So if 90% of PoE players avoid Steam than they might have an equal base.


Please stop pulling numbers out of your butt. We know that Blizz never releases the number of active players for D3 or how much they gained or lost per quarter. The only game that they do that for is WoW and that is only because it is a subscription game.

If what you said is true then you would see the end of spamming in chat. Because with less than a million players it would no longer be profitable to do such a thing.

12/27/2014 04:55 AMPosted by Taiga
POE fails at graphics

D3 fails at everything else

So you have to decide. Do you want a mindlessly shallow game with good graphics?

Or do you want a game that doesn't look too great but has quality mechanics?

Personally I'll take good mechanics and game balance over graphics any day of the week.

D3 is too dumb once you hit max level. And getting to max level is equally mindless since you don't get to do any meaningful quests or make any real character building decisions on the way. So why aren't we able to start the game at level 70 if the only thing to do in D3 is rift?


Each game has it's own niche, D3 is a casual laid back sort of game. Where you don't mind just hoping on and grinding for character levels (new or trying out a new class), paragon levels, legendary gem levels, gear to try out new builds, etc...

Path of Exile is for those that like to theorycraft about a lot of things and get under the hood of the mechanics so they can come up with a build that really shines. A build that does take some planning and thought.

It is good that there are different types of games for different types of players or players that love playing different types of games for different reasons. I might kick back with D3 for a couple of hours just to kill some time and relieve some stress. Then get serious when I play Path of Exile
12/26/2014 05:22 PMPosted by Relentless
12/26/2014 05:09 PMPosted by Malphaxis
The downward trend continued.. Diablo III down nearly 45%


Yeah this definitely true. Same with PoE unfortunately. The ARPG market just isn't as strong as it used to be. The once mighty Daiblo franchise has definitely took a beating. I'm just optimistic about the future of D3 still. Maybe a bigger budget PoE 2 might bring the genre back? Maybe because of there not being an Esport aspect to these types of games they will never compete with games like LoL.


except PoE bills itself as am mmorpg. Different genre. Someday that pile of dung will implode from them heaping dung on it.

I like d3 I play it when I have time, never cared for Poe. Poe simply has no focus on it'd genre. They will for sure add anything they think will bring quick buck in. That will turn around and bite them someday.
My list of arpgs and rank:
9-Fate series
8-Torchlight series
7-Marvel Hero's
6-Diablo 3
5-Diablo 1
4-Path of Exile
3-Titans Quest
2-Diablo 2
1-Grim Dawn
12/27/2014 05:31 AMPosted by DeadRu
except PoE bills itself as am mmorpg. Different genre. Someday that pile of dung will implode from them heaping dung on it.

I like d3 I play it when I have time, never cared for Poe. Poe simply has no focus on it'd genre. They will for sure add anything they think will bring quick buck in. That will turn around and bite them someday.


Well the game certainly doesn't feel as lonely as D3 does. Having those hub towns easily conveys the feeling you're not alone in the world, even if you happen to be a solo player. What's wrong with adding stuff to attract more customers, and why would that come and bite them in the !@# if the community deems them worth investing into?

I'd like you to do this exercise: Take your claims, evaluate them next to every greedy corporate-based triple A developer out there, understand they just overhype for initial sales, and then come back to tell us how you pretend to substantiate the claim that adding new features without having to pay for DLC/Expansions periodically to keep their audience invested into the game is a bad thing.
12/27/2014 05:31 AMPosted by DeadRu
PoE bills itself as am mmorpg.

No, it doesn't. Here's how they describe the game on their web site:
Path of Exile is an online Action RPG set in the dark fantasy world of Wraeclast.
I don't see anything in that sentence about being massively multiplayer game. PoE doesn't have any of the mechanics of a MMO, either.

12/27/2014 05:33 AMPosted by Gannon
My list of arpgs and rank:
9-Fate series
8-Torchlight series
7-Marvel Hero's
6-Diablo 3
5-Diablo 1
4-Path of Exile
3-Titans Quest
2-Diablo 2
1-Grim Dawn

I'd list most of the same games, but in a different order:
10 - Marvel Heroes
9 - The Incredible Adventures of Van Helsing
8 - Hellgate: London
7 - Dungeon Siege II
6 - Diablo/Hellfire
5 - Torchlight
4 - Diablo II/Lord of Destruction
3 - Torchlight II
2 - Titan's Quest/Immortal Throne
1 - Path of Exile
Notes:
  • I haven't actually played any of the Fate series, which is why I don't list them. Ditto for Dark Souls.
  • Grim Dawn isn't released yet, which is why it isn't on the list, either (although it's made by the same team that made Titan Quest, and looks to build on what they were doing with that game, so I'm expecting it to be at least as good -- I'm just not planning to make up my mind about it until I see the release version).
  • #7 - #10 all have interesting elements and try new things, and I liked aspects of them, but didn't get hooked on any of them.
  • #6 (Diablo) is the hugely addictive prototype which all the others use as their basic template.
  • #5 (Torchlight) is essentially the same game, although TL benefits from a couple of decades of lessons learned from Diablo's imitators, and implements them well.
  • #4 (Diablo II) redefine Diablo's genre is ways that have been imitated by every ARPG since.
  • #3 (TL2) and #2 (TQ/IT) both took the D2 formula and improved on it, fixing issues with attribute systems, and including respec features that encouraged experimentation which still preserving a sense of value and meaning in the player's choices.
  • And my current #1 (PoE) is the game that I'm playing most right now, and have been since their open beta. Lots of elements incorporated from the Final Fantasy series, and some new elements like their itemized/consumable currency system, along with the kind constant development and support that's normally reserved for MMOs and the like, plus plenty of communication with their player base, in both directions. Not perfect (the story, in particular, is incredibly weak), but they're doing a lot of things right.
  • 12/27/2014 05:27 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
    Each game has it's own niche, D3 is a casual laid back sort of game. Where you don't mind just hoping on and grinding for character levels (new or trying out a new class), paragon levels, legendary gem levels, gear to try out new builds, etc...


    Well it would have been nice if Blizzard had made that clear while they were marketing D3 back in the day. I would have never bought D3V in the first place. The only consolation is that they didn't trick me into buying RoS.

    You know darn well that they never marketed this game as "casual" or "laid-back" when they were hyping the game up for initial release. They only do that now to justify their lazy design and frequent bad decisions they've made over the last 2 years. They just conveniently changed their "philosophy" to try and explain the terrible game they ended up producing.

    Back when this game first came out there was no talk of "casual" design. It was marketed as a super hardcore game with "bazillions" of options. That's why inferno was so difficult at launch. They wanted to prove that they were hardcore and not casual.

    So please don't tell me the PR BS that they like to spew these days. It's nothing more than scape-goat tactics to justify their laziness and inept game design.
    12/27/2014 06:24 AMPosted by Taiga
    12/27/2014 05:27 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
    Each game has it's own niche, D3 is a casual laid back sort of game. Where you don't mind just hoping on and grinding for character levels (new or trying out a new class), paragon levels, legendary gem levels, gear to try out new builds, etc...


    Well it would have been nice if Blizzard had made that clear while they were marketing D3 back in the day. I would have never bought D3V in the first place. The only consolation is that they didn't trick me into buying RoS.

    You know darn well that they never marketed this game as "casual" or "laid-back" when they were hyping the game up for initial release. They only do that now to justify their lazy design and frequent bad decisions they've made over the last 2 years. They just conveniently changed their "philosophy" to try and explain the terrible game they ended up producing.

    Back when this game first came out there was no talk of "casual" design. It was marketed as a super hardcore game with "bazillions" of options. That's why inferno was so difficult at launch. They wanted to prove that they were hardcore and not casual.

    I'm completely in agreement. If Blizzard were just trying something new, and had been honest with us about that, then I could easily give them credit for trying something new and forgive them for failing; ofc., I probably wouldn't have rushed out on launch day to buy the game, either, which is probably why Blizzard didn't tell us what they were up to. I think that, more than anything, it's the dishonesty of that sales pitch, and the arrogance and borderline contempt that they've shown towards their customers since then, which most are going to find hardest to forgive.
    I don't see any solid prove poe is more popular than diablo. But they are almost similar in many ways.

    Poe has god awful graphics (you have to pay real money to have better graphics/transmorg), 1 build because in reality all builds needs to add tons of life nodes passive + life leech%,very little passive points left for you to be creative. You have to spend countless hours haggling over chat channel to get the things you need, RNG is 100× worst than d3 ( wtf all stats on equipments completely random + completely random gem slot+ 3L/4L/5L/6L RNG!!)

    Peace out.
    12/27/2014 05:31 AMPosted by DeadRu
    12/26/2014 05:22 PMPosted by Relentless
    ...

    Yeah this definitely true. Same with PoE unfortunately. The ARPG market just isn't as strong as it used to be. The once mighty Daiblo franchise has definitely took a beating. I'm just optimistic about the future of D3 still. Maybe a bigger budget PoE 2 might bring the genre back? Maybe because of there not being an Esport aspect to these types of games they will never compete with games like LoL.


    except PoE bills itself as am mmorpg. Different genre. Someday that pile of dung will implode from them heaping dung on it.

    I like d3 I play it when I have time, never cared for Poe. Poe simply has no focus on it'd genre. They will for sure add anything they think will bring quick buck in. That will turn around and bite them someday.


    PoE is not an mmorpg it is an online only game. In order for it to be a true mmorpg you would have to have a persistent world that is shared by a lot players. Everything outside of town hubs is instanced. For it to be an mmorpg you would have to remove the instances from just about all areas of the game. Doing that would mean that you would also have to have a respawn rate for each area because now players are competing for the same goals. Loot drops would have to change as well.

    12/27/2014 06:15 AMPosted by Bnetplayer
    Real money trading is not allowed in poe, they will ban you and other people will report you if you offer real money for currency. There is however real money trading via ebay.

    PoE right now is more populated than d3, especially feels more alive ingame than d3, that is for sure.


    It is against the rules in this game as well and players will report those that they see spamming. That phrase stands to prove that this game is more popular because there is more money to be made here in this game regardless of how alive it seems to be. Trust me, people that bot to sell items, gear, etc... will only do it if there is enough profit to be made. If there is not enough profit to be made then they wouldn't bother that game. That is all of the evidence that I need to prove that this game is more popular than PoE.
    12/27/2014 08:16 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
    That is all of the evidence that I need to prove that this game is more popular than PoE.


    Popularity has nothing to do with which game is better, sheep run with each other and Activision Blizzard is their shepherd.
    12/27/2014 06:24 AMPosted by Taiga
    12/27/2014 05:27 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
    Each game has it's own niche, D3 is a casual laid back sort of game. Where you don't mind just hoping on and grinding for character levels (new or trying out a new class), paragon levels, legendary gem levels, gear to try out new builds, etc...


    Well it would have been nice if Blizzard had made that clear while they were marketing D3 back in the day. I would have never bought D3V in the first place. The only consolation is that they didn't trick me into buying RoS.

    You know darn well that they never marketed this game as "casual" or "laid-back" when they were hyping the game up for initial release. They only do that now to justify their lazy design and frequent bad decisions they've made over the last 2 years. They just conveniently changed their "philosophy" to try and explain the terrible game they ended up producing.

    Back when this game first came out there was no talk of "casual" design. It was marketed as a super hardcore game with "bazillions" of options. That's why inferno was so difficult at launch. They wanted to prove that they were hardcore and not casual.

    So please don't tell me the PR BS that they like to spew these days. It's nothing more than scape-goat tactics to justify their laziness and inept game design.


    Diablo has always been a casual game. Blizz is known for making games that are easy to pick up and play. Show me where they market it as a game that was suppose to be hard to learn how to play and almost impossible to master. When you say that a game is easy to pick up and play then that means it is more suited for the casual player.

    Diablo 1 was extremely easy for me to make builds. I played it on the PS instead of PC since we didn't have a PC at the time I played D1. I built a flame sword warrior that used fireball to weaken the enemies then finish the job with the sword. Kind of a spell sword character that was fun to play.

    D2 did add more depth, but I can tell you that PoE has D2 beat hands down on depth IMO. I have no doubt that with a little study at the official website of D2 and some time I could put together any build that I want to for D2:LOD. Heck even Median XL Ultimative has more depth than D2:LOD has by itself.

    So you say that it was marketed as a game that would be super hard to learn how to play and almost impossible to master due to how Inferno was touted. Sorry but you would be wrong again because they said if you can beat hell difficulty then you are ready for Inferno. The only difference would be if you had the gear needed to survive Inferno. Inferno even at launch was just a big gear check. That means you probably didn't play it at launch.

    12/27/2014 06:47 AMPosted by OldSchool
    I'm completely in agreement. If Blizzard were just trying something new, and had been honest with us about that, then I could easily give them credit for trying something new and forgive them for failing; ofc., I probably wouldn't have rushed out on launch day to buy the game, either, which is probably why Blizzard didn't tell us what they were up to. I think that, more than anything, it's the dishonesty of that sales pitch, and the arrogance and borderline contempt that they've shown towards their customers since then, which most are going to find hardest to forgive.


    Do they really have to say that we are trying something new in those exact words. I wonder what your IQ is because they practically said that in so many different ways. When they were gonna have runes as drops they said that they didn't want to do rune words because in D2 you have some rune words that are so strong that they are mandatory for some classes and builds. That was what they wanted to avoid. Although they end up creating a different must have in sets which is odd.

    The pure fact that you didn't see the Horadric Cube with a ton of crafting recipes of days gone by. Instead artisans were added, that alone should've told you that they were trying something new.

    Maybe you like others just buried you head in the sand like an ostrich until it was released. All the while hoping that Blizz would've told you on the box that they were trying something new.
    POE fanboy nubs ..... lol

    POE

    Temper

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    Quite the truck load of misinformation in this thread. hahaha

    You're on the wrong forums nubs
    POE fanboy nubs ..... lol

    POE

    Temper

    Joined:
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    Your on the wrong forums nubs


    You're doing it wrong.
    12/27/2014 08:30 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
    Maybe you like others just buried you head in the sand like an ostrich until it was released. All the while hoping that Blizz would've told you on the box that they were trying something new.

    Oh, don't worry, I definitely learned a lesson about doing my research before buying any new game. But there's a difference between e.g. a rune stone system which builds on a skill point system which more-or-less resembles D2's otherwise, and a totally different skill system which eliminates skill points entirely; the first is what they showed us in development, and what had people excited; the second is what they delivered, having stripped out a lot of its depth and most interesting features. And, yes, they really needed to tell us that they were entirely reinventing Diablo at some point before the game's launch, and not after, because nothing they said in the run-up to that launch properly prepared us for the extent to which they disregarded what previous Diablo titles had built.

    Now, if you don't care about that, then that's fine, you don't have to. But 4 out of 5 people who bought the base game were either insufficiently impressed, or sufficiently disappointed, that they didn't buy the expansion pack so far as we know, so this isn't just a pet peeve of mine -- it's the reality that Blizzard now faces, and must overcome if they want to sell more than 3M copies of anything else with the Diablo brand on it.
    12/27/2014 04:55 AMPosted by Taiga
    Do you want a mindlessly shallow game with good graphics?


    I think "mindlessly shallow" is a bit melodramatic to describe D3. It sells itself short, I'll admit that. But it's not as dimwitted as some may have us believe.
    12/27/2014 08:35 AMPosted by Merc13
    POE fanboy nubs ..... lol

    POE

    Temper

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    Your on the wrong forums nubs


    You're doing it wrong.


    But I made it Wright ! =P
    12/27/2014 12:46 AMPosted by einherier
    poe is so bad i cant understand why ppl play it, rly.


    people are playing PoE because they have the freedom of choice there.

    they can choose if they play with trading or completely selffound.
    they can choose the design for their character (like spell builds, ranged builds, aura builds, attackspeed builds, crit-chance builds, dmg bonus builds and so on). variety/diversity has been removed from d3.

    they also can fine tune their character, since small upgrades via skillboards are possible.
    D3: try to get an additional +30 AR on a DEX/VIT/CC/CD Item......

    only downside at poe is graphics.....the downside at the current version of d3 is everything except graphics.....

    Edit: i'm not a PoE-fan since it is giving me eyecancer..... d3 just sucks atm, everything (especially choices) is very restricted/limited.....
    12/26/2014 04:56 PMPosted by Relentless
    This isn't an attack on PoE, it's a fun game, but a little off on some of your "facts"

    12/26/2014 04:32 PMPosted by Ambush
    POE has more players than D3


    Never has even come close to the same playerbase as D3. Not even close.

    http://store.steampowered.com/stats/

    The all time peak of PoE isn't even in the area of a bad day on D3

    http://steamcharts.com/app/238960#All

    [/quote]

    Dude... I don't play POE on Steam. And neither does the majority of its playerbase. Your numbers mean nothing.
    12/26/2014 10:06 PMPosted by Bombus
    12/26/2014 10:00 PMPosted by Herethebeef
    ...

    More flawed logic.

    Go into depth about why it is flawed. Perhaps you can teach me something?


    Whats the point? Aside the from the fact that I'm already right, if I further prove I'm right...what makes me think further proof that I'm right will change your mind? And do you even have the integrity to admit when you were wrong? I highly doubt it. Most don't. Especially on the internet.

    The fact that you already think that that someone wouldn't be here discussing something if they didn't like it, already shows how illogical you are. You cannot fathom ANY reason why someone would be discussing something they did not like. Gee, I dunno, to maybe improve it? And turn it into something they would like? That's the problem with people like you. You cannot even fathom other points of view. Or at the very least, think they are automatically wrong, because the do not coincide with yours.

    Using your own logic, if you like this game, why are you wasting your time talking about it on a forum? Especially one critical of it. Go play it.

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