The Devs' Thoughts on Realm of Trials

General Discussion
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it is so convenient to get measured with the measuring stick every time we go on the ride, am i right travis?
02/10/2015 12:13 PMPosted by zarquon
It was designed to be a convenience, because before Trials you started at Greater Rift level 1 and advanced from there every time. Trials were designed as a way to skip this process.


Exactly
02/10/2015 12:13 PMPosted by zarquon
It was designed to be a convenience, because before Trials you started at Greater Rift level 1 and advanced from there every time. Trials were designed as a way to skip this process.

That's exactly right. When Greater Rifts were first added to the game, players were able to start at Greater Rift 1 and jump up in difficulty quickly. However, this often led to them overshooting their mark and biting off more than they could chew difficulty-wise.

Although Rifts of Trials were intended to solve this problem (by helping players gauge the best Greater Rift level for them more quickly), they ended up becoming tedious for many players. As Travis mentioned during yesterday's Tavern Talk, we agree with players that it's silly to have to go through the Realm of Trials each time you want to do a Greater Rift. After all, that's like having to "measure up" each time you go on the same ride at a theme park (versus only the first time), right?

At any rate, we agree the Realm of Trials is flawed, which is why the development team is looking at other options for how to structure Rifts and Greater Rifts.

Edit: The Twitch VOD for yesterday's Tavern Talk is now available. You can hear where the developers talked about Rifts of Trials at around 1:14:12. Hope that helps!
02/11/2015 02:17 PMPosted by Tyvalir
At any rate, we agree the Realm of Trials is flawed, which is why the development team is looking at other options for how to structure Rifts and Greater Rifts.

thank you
02/11/2015 02:17 PMPosted by Tyvalir
At any rate, we agree the Realm of Trials is flawed, which is why the development team is looking at other options for how to structure Rifts and Greater Rifts.


Why not just forget trials...just let us pick what level we want to go to...if we pick too high then allow us to drop down the greater rift level similar to lowering game difficulty
02/11/2015 02:36 PMPosted by huntermanz
just let us pick what level we want to go to.


i keep making that suggestion. maybe they will implement it.
The best and most fair way imo would be to let us choose in tiers of 5.

For example, my best greater rift is level 42

Thus when I put in a grift key I can chose the following levels from a dropdown menu in the grift pylon window:

    40
    35
    30
    25
    20
    15
    10
    5
    1


From high to low to avoid people constantly having to scroll down. People who wish to start a bit easier can start lower. People who enjoy doing it from 1 have that option to. People who got very lucky and did a high grift they may find too tedious/hard to 'farm' have the option to chose close to their best level.

The reason to keep it on a per 5 level basis rather than put your max level at the top is to ensure people don't burn out by trying to do their best level over and over again. You'll start a bit lower but that ensures players have more fun getting loot from a few level lower grift guardian.

This also gives players a goal: reach the next "save" grift level (45, 50, 55 etc).
You could be starting on level 1.
02/11/2015 02:17 PMPosted by Tyvalir
which is why the development team is looking at other options for how to structure Rifts and Greater Rifts.


I feel they need to overhaul the weightings of mobs/maps/rgs in greater rifts.

If you get rid of trials, players will just keep restarting the game at their highest difficulty until they get zombies.

At high level, zombies are easy to corral and avoid damage and nuke them down altogether. Sand wasps for example are much tougher since they fly away, won't kite, all the while, you have to avoid moving targets (bees) that can kill you. Even if you could kite 25 sandwasps, it be nigh impossible to avoid that many bees! Why aren't those worth much more towards your progress bar per kill? You can't base the worth of a mob purely on HP.

One reason GRifts get tiring to play is because there is only a subset of maps available. Its understandable why a Fields of Misery map wouldn't be a GR map, cause you could just round up the whole map. So why not assign a multiplier that makes an open map worth less, and tight corridor maps being worth more?

Rift Guardians have less variance, but still significant variance the higher up in levels you get. So give them different weightings.

So if you can give mobs, maps, rift guardians each a weighting that allow you to better score rift performance, you won't have to "fish" for certain conditions, you'll be able to have reason to see how well you can do against a winged assasin greater rift, while also being able to enjoy more maps.
I mean, why does there have to be talk about how to improve it? Just make it so we can pick any GR level we've completed and below that with a simple trade in for Keystone of Trials right now and then you can talk on how to make it better after that.
02/11/2015 02:17 PMPosted by Tyvalir
02/10/2015 12:13 PMPosted by zarquon
It was designed to be a convenience, because before Trials you started at Greater Rift level 1 and advanced from there every time. Trials were designed as a way to skip this process.

That's exactly right. When Greater Rifts were first added to the game, players were able to start at Greater Rift 1 and jump up in difficulty quickly. However, this often led to them overshooting their mark and biting off more than they could chew difficulty-wise.

Although Rifts of Trials were intended to solve this problem (by helping players gauge the best Greater Rift level for them more quickly), they ended up becoming tedious for many players. As Travis mentioned during yesterday's Tavern Talk, we agree with players that it's silly to have to go through the Realm of Trials each time you want to do a Greater Rift. After all, that's like having to "measure up" each time you go on the same ride at a theme park (versus only the first time), right?

At any rate, we agree the Realm of Trials is flawed, which is why the development team is looking at other options for how to structure Rifts and Greater Rifts.

Edit: The Twitch VOD for yesterday's Tavern Talk is [url="http://www.twitch.tv/diablo/b/623026202"]now available[/url]. You can hear where the developers talked about Rifts of Trials at around 1:14:12. Hope that helps!


Why not remove the gating from rifts and GRs all together? You can enter rifts any times. GR get saved by single player and team number (2,3,4) and allow you to enter any level you cleared before without the timer expiring.
My suggestion is to let people go wherever they want, keep leaderboards under 15 minutes, make rifts autoclose after 45 minutes to prevent people from spending 2-3 hours in a rift just to have insane level gems, and remove conduits from GRs to prevent conduit fishing. I don't really see how being able to choose your level would be a problem with these changes.
02/11/2015 02:58 PMPosted by OttO
02/11/2015 02:17 PMPosted by Tyvalir
...
That's exactly right. When Greater Rifts were first added to the game, players were able to start at Greater Rift 1 and jump up in difficulty quickly. However, this often led to them overshooting their mark and biting off more than they could chew difficulty-wise.

Although Rifts of Trials were intended to solve this problem (by helping players gauge the best Greater Rift level for them more quickly), they ended up becoming tedious for many players. As Travis mentioned during yesterday's Tavern Talk, we agree with players that it's silly to have to go through the Realm of Trials each time you want to do a Greater Rift. After all, that's like having to "measure up" each time you go on the same ride at a theme park (versus only the first time), right?

At any rate, we agree the Realm of Trials is flawed, which is why the development team is looking at other options for how to structure Rifts and Greater Rifts.

Edit: The Twitch VOD for yesterday's Tavern Talk is [url="http://www.twitch.tv/diablo/b/623026202"]now available[/url]. You can hear where the developers talked about Rifts of Trials at around 1:14:12. Hope that helps!


Why not remove the gating from rifts and GRs all together? You can enter rifts any times. GR get saved by single player and team number (2,3,4) and allow you to enter any level you cleared before without the timer expiring.


Keys have to have a cost. Gold is my vote. A couple mill per key.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/16285589061

This guy had a good idea for trial woes.
02/11/2015 02:17 PMPosted by Tyvalir

At any rate, we agree the Realm of Trials is flawed, which is why the development team is looking at other options for how to structure Rifts and Greater Rifts.


02/11/2015 02:38 PMPosted by Morogoth
02/11/2015 02:36 PMPosted by huntermanz
just let us pick what level we want to go to.


i keep making that suggestion. maybe they will implement it.


Picking whichever level you want would work great for solo grifting. Might result in complications for multiplayer grifts though, especially with random people. Maybe for multiplayer grifts go through the trial process once per session? That way if a team of 30+ers gets someone who can barely handle 15, the 30+ folks won't have dead weight to haul around and the 15er can still contribute somewhat meaningfully.

Something else that would entail is to enable people to set specific teams, so if a group regularly runs grifts together they can just go to whichever they want without the trial.

As for the keystones, still have them drop from regular rift bosses I guess. But instead of opening a trial rift, it opens the interface you select which level you want to go to including the trial level for those who feel like doing it again.

02/11/2015 02:17 PMPosted by Tyvalir

Edit: The Twitch VOD for yesterday's Tavern Talk is [url="http://www.twitch.tv/diablo/b/623026202"]now available[/url]. You can hear where the developers talked about Rifts of Trials at around 1:14:12. Hope that helps!


Was hoping this would be up soon. Cheers!
02/11/2015 02:49 PMPosted by Guilliman
The best and most fair way imo would be to let us choose in tiers of 5.

For example, my best greater rift is level 42

Thus when I put in a grift key I can chose the following levels from a dropdown menu in the grift pylon window:

    40
    35
    30
    25
    20
    15
    10
    5
    1


From high to low to avoid people constantly having to scroll down. People who wish to start a bit easier can start lower. People who enjoy doing it from 1 have that option to. People who got very lucky and did a high grift they may find too tedious/hard to 'farm' have the option to chose close to their best level.

The reason to keep it on a per 5 level basis rather than put your max level at the top is to ensure people don't burn out by trying to do their best level over and over again. You'll start a bit lower but that ensures players have more fun getting loot from a few level lower grift guardian.

This also gives players a goal: reach the next "save" grift level (45, 50, 55 etc).


Naturally, I always skip Trails and go straight to GR1....
But what you are saying is the first time i get to lets say Gr43 that GR lev will register with my chr.
And as long as I use that chr....lets say Monk it will prompt a pop up window......!

Dude that is Awesome!
The Angry Monk!
02/11/2015 02:58 PMPosted by OttO
Why not remove the gating from rifts and GRs all together? You can enter rifts any times.


My stash and IRL time constraints say:

OMG PLS DO THIS

You could use trials for another purpose/reward. Stick some bosses/elites in there. Stick some gobs in there. Let 6-8 players play in them. Lot's of room to use the trials for a better purpose!!!
My suggestion for greater rifts\trials

Rift Guardian drop Greater Rift Keystone instead of Key of Trial
Player can exchange Greater Rift Keystone to a vendor for Key of Trial(atleast to start)
Trial could work just like it does now
Let's say you obtain greater rift key level 25 from Trial then you successfully clear the rift level 25 it unlock that greater rift key level to the greater rift key vendor.

A little twist could be if you clear GR25 every key between 1-25 get unlocked..and so on if you clear GR38 afterward it unlock every key lower than your better clear.

So once you cleared a greater rift you can repeat this level as long as you have greater rift keys and you don't have to go throught the pain of trial all over again unless you really want to get a higher key instead of working your way up with your previous one.
Honestly, is it even a convenience to them? Sure they can do Trials better than any other class, but it's still not a convenience.

The trials are also completely incompatible with Hardcore as it gauges Hero strength by death. To do three, four waves and then artificially abandon the trial is not exactly convenient or very accurate, it's actually rather stupid.

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