[Mechanics] Davlok's Random Testing Shack

Monk
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05/11/2016 03:40 AMPosted by Davlok
don't drink potions


wtf this will be annoying
If both Rainment bonus are multiplicative, wouldn´t it be better to use the full set for a generator build? its x8 instead of x6 for Innas, and you can cube Depth Diggers instead of Crudest, making it x16 rainment vs x12 innas + 2p rainment. Sure you lose a ton of defensive bonuses, but you can keep your rorg and use the cyclone strike dmg reduction shoulder, and string of ears as belt. I think 50% reduc + 30% melee reduc might even be better than 40% armor and 80% life, or at least comparable considering you are doing x16 vs x12

Unless the use of mystic ally to get spirit or stun is really important, or they actually help dps without innas weapon and binding bracers? I don´t know, haven´t played generator this season because can´t find ancient shenlongs even though im gambling weapons for days and upped 200+ rare fists
^^ Inna's generator doesn't use MA on skill bar.

Davlok, thx for this thread! Can you plz answer few questions:

Does 2p raiment and Alacrity passive provide multiplicative AS bonus?
So if it is true, can monk punch with generator more than 5 APS ? 5*1.25*1.15=7+ APS ?

This is important for current supp monk, I think. Does 2p raiment and Alacrity help to heal you party faster? If Smoothing Mist has ICD = 1/APS, does this count only you sheet APS or increased APS of you generators too? If not, you can just drop raiment for support for smth more usefull.

Waiting for answer ;-)
Does the damage reduction from the (relatively) new crippling light rune for blinding flash work on elite affixes?
05/13/2016 02:02 PMPosted by Tubs
If both Rainment bonus are multiplicative, wouldn´t it be better to use the full set for a generator build? its x8 instead of x6 for Innas, and you can cube Depth Diggers instead of Crudest, making it x16 rainment vs x12 innas + 2p rainment. Sure you lose a ton of defensive bonuses, but you can keep your rorg and use the cyclone strike dmg reduction shoulder, and string of ears as belt. I think 50% reduc + 30% melee reduc might even be better than 40% armor and 80% life, or at least comparable considering you are doing x16 vs x12

Unless the use of mystic ally to get spirit or stun is really important, or they actually help dps without innas weapon and binding bracers? I don´t know, haven´t played generator this season because can´t find ancient shenlongs even though im gambling weapons for days and upped 200+ rare fists

I was having the same idea as you in PTR, collected everything for it, when 2.4.1 went live, I tested it. Its a disappointment, not enough spirit for sustain damage, weaker than inna gen, the worst comes when you are lack on spirit and cannot CS (due to dash), you are see hell in front of you.

05/13/2016 03:34 PMPosted by Zt1mQ
^^ Inna's generator doesn't use MA on skill bar.

Davlok, thx for this thread! Can you plz answer few questions:

Does 2p raiment and Alacrity passive provide multiplicative AS bonus?
So if it is true, can monk punch with generator more than 5 APS ? 5*1.25*1.15=7+ APS ?

This is important for current supp monk, I think. Does 2p raiment and Alacrity help to heal you party faster? If Smoothing Mist has ICD = 1/APS, does this count only you sheet APS or increased APS of you generators too? If not, you can just drop raiment for support for smth more usefull.

Waiting for answer ;-)

Raiment is there for more FD proc, more spirit, smoothing mist doesn't really benefit from it.
09/13/2015 08:26 PMPosted by Davlok
Uliana 2pc with MR:
Applies a "fresh EP" to all targets without EP. ONE of those targets without a previous EP will have a MR-buffed-EP applied to them. MR is consumed in this case.


Short question and it might have already been answered(so I don`t have to go through 20 pages):
- am I correct to assume U2 will still automatically apply a MR EP onto a non-EP`d target on the 3rd hit? OR do I have to manually apply an EP after the 3 hits on a different/non-EP`d target and spread that using SSS?
Thanks!
05/13/2016 02:02 PMPosted by Tubs
If both Rainment bonus are multiplicative, wouldn´t it be better to use the full set for a generator build?

It's going to take someone investing 13xGems to prove how far R6 gen can go. I know on PTR a high paragon Monk was able to do as high as Inna-gen had, but by then the PTR had died down. Like Bahamut said, the toughness is the problem with R6-gen, but maybe we'll see some APD-centric variation popup over 90, but probably only after PTR opens again and folks and tests stuff freely.

05/13/2016 03:34 PMPosted by Zt1mQ
Does 2p raiment and Alacrity passive provide multiplicative AS bonus?
So if it is true, can monk punch with generator more than 5 APS ? 5*1.25*1.15=7+ APS ?

This is important for current supp monk, I think. Does 2p raiment and Alacrity help to heal you party faster? If Smoothing Mist has ICD = 1/APS, does this count only you sheet APS or increased APS of you generators too? If not, you can just drop raiment for support for smth more usefull.

Alacrity and R2 don't show up on the stat sheet so they are multiplicative.. but for generators only. Soothing Mist's ICD is not affected by either, only sheet APS modifiers like STI.

Or you could give Serenity: Tranquility a shot if your wiz is too squishy!

05/13/2016 07:05 PMPosted by Fyodor
Does the damage reduction from the (relatively) new crippling light rune for blinding flash work on elite affixes?

I have never really done much testing with elite damage reduction, but the last word looks like Crippling Light would not work on : Molten, Fire Chains, or Electrified.

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/12673259125?page=8#154

05/18/2016 02:07 AMPosted by Gr0v3
I correct to assume U2 will still automatically apply a MR EP onto a non-EP`d target on the 3rd hit? OR do I have to manually apply an EP after the 3 hits on a different/non-EP`d target and spread that using SSS?

Essentially, you no longer care is U2 applies a MR-EP anymore since none of them allow AD to proc. So just get in the habit of manually applying and SSS to spread during solo progression.
As far I know
a) Soothing Mist has icd = 1 / (sheet aps)
b) Soothing Mist heals only on skill cast
c) Alacrity and R2 do not affect sheet aps

Does it mean, that :
1) Time between generator casts is shorter than Soothing Mist icd?
2) Soothing Mist icd is up only for every second generator cast?
3) With Alacrity and/or R2 and without FD monk heals ~2 times less?

Can :
4) Alacrity / R2 cover this heal loss via higher FD uptime?
5) This "only on every second cast" problem be solved by mantra spam?

Am I :
6) Totally wrong?

Thanks ^_^
Alacrity and R2 don't show up on the stat sheet so they are multiplicative.. but for generators only. Soothing Mist's ICD is not affected by either, only sheet APS modifiers like STI.


dang i just checkd and there def is an icd on it..

there's nothing about ICD on d3planner.com/powers

http://d3planner.com/powers/X1_Monk_Epiphany

weird.. anyway,

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!MORE IMPORTANTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>. I've had a weird issue with MR testing ... I am getting a steady white #..

*** Rewritting this I just figured out something..

DoT on Palm either Crits or doesnt crit for its entire duration (have not checked with broken promises), but its definitely not like each time it ticks it rolls for chc

^ Isnt this not supposed to happen -- I thought all DoT's were changed to be compiled w/ chc chd
05/19/2016 05:56 AMPosted by Davlok
Essentially, you no longer care is U2 applies a MR-EP anymore since none of them allow AD to proc. So just get in the habit of manually applying and SSS to spread during solo progression.


But regardless of AD, does U2 apply the Mythic Rhythm +40% dmg to its EP? I'm assuming it does, since it also consumes the buff.
Please read back http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/16527322731?page=22#436

Its mentioned there, it applies only to 1 monster if its a FRESH application (no EP before) and consume MR. Anyway, do not underestimate the power of AD.
05/20/2016 03:13 AMPosted by Strike
5) This "only on every second cast" problem be solved by mantra spam?

Funnily enough, I am putting together a post on support monk as I just spent some time grouping and yep, Mantra Spam can help allievate the generator vs icd "misalignment", but timing a mantra spam to fit exactly between 3 frames is probably impossible.

05/21/2016 02:12 PMPosted by Darth
DoT on Palm either Crits or doesnt crit for its entire duration

Yea, I also noticed that too as well, for a few patches at least but didn't bother looking into it much because we have no rune diversity ^_^

05/23/2016 06:29 AMPosted by Bahamut
Anyway, do not underestimate the power of AD.

Yea, MR is like 2 GR levels, AD is like...5+ if you fish the perfect rift... and fish.. and fish... and fish.
So as a primarily non-season solo player, I usually spend one week a patch pugging support monk in 4p groups to level some gems. Just spent the last few days ( before #Overwatch! ) grinding some gems for solo and figured I would compile some support monk healing mechanics together to share and discuss. (I'm not claiming to be an expert on the nuisances of what it takes to push GR120+). Back in the glory days of afk passive monk healing, we could push out 1 million HP/sec healing and monster shields, but these days.. it is all about "active healing" with a little bit of passive heals/shields. Definitely found more enjoyable than being a globe dispenser. If any monks who have ground GRs since day 1 of 2.4.1 see any error or have some tips, please share!

Support Base Skill Mechanics
- Epiphany: Soothing Mist has an ICD of 1/APS (this is sheet APS and not generator APS)
- Sheet APS caps at 5. Generator APS can go above that due to it's innate speed bonus (CW = ~1.3x), Raiment 2pc (1.25x), and Alacrity (1.15x).
- Crippling Wave's 3 hit combo's frame lengths (@ 5APS) Base = 8/8/12, R2 = 7/7/10, Alacrity = 7/7/11, R2+Alacrity = 6/6/9
- Crippling Wave's 3 hit combo goes from Radius 10 yard 90° frontal sweep > 10 yard 180° frontal sweep > 11 yard 360° sweep. (Tsunami increases to 17 for only the 3rd)
- Cyclone Strike's APS = Sheet APS (so at 5 APS, you cast 5 Cyclone Strikes per second)
- Cyclone Strike: Soothing Breeze's Heal is significant. EDIT: animation is 62 frames, actual heal is not.
- Breath of Heaven: Circle of Life has no ICD (15s cooldown.. so can't be spammed anyway)
- Mantra of Healing's Active Shield can reach ~275k HP with max +Globe and be spammed twice a second.
- Mantra of Healing - Boon of Inspiration just buffs every party member's LoH stat
- Resolve/Crippling Light/Concussion likely does NOT work on Molten, Fire Chains, or Electrified affixes. (unconfirmed for 2.4.1)
- Seize the Initiate and Alacrity are both good passives to increase Flying Dragon uptime, but STI reduces Cyclone Strike cast animation and reduces Soothing Mist ICDs whereas Alacrity does not.

Quick Videos showing ICD of Soothing Mist desync with Spirit Generators
- Easily seen de-sync @ 1.2/2.4 Sheet APS
https://gfycat.com/DetailedDeadlyArgali
- Not so easily seen @ 5 Sheet APS (~8.4 generator APS)
https://gfycat.com/ElectricVainDaddylonglegs

- ICD of Soothing Mist @ 5APS = 12 frames
- Cyclone Strike @ 5APS = 12 frames per cast (APS Mod = 1) = 100% Soothing Mist ICD alignment
- Crippling Wave @ 5APS = 8,8,12 frames per combo = ~86% Soothing Mist ICD alignment
- Crippling Wave @ 5APS w/ R2 = 7,7,10 frames per combo = ~75% Soothing Mist ICD alignment
- Crippling Wave @ 5APS w/ Alacrity = 7,7,11 frames per combo = ~72% Soothing Mist ICD alignment
- Crippling Wave @ 5APS w/ R2+Alacrity = 6,6,9 frames per combo = ~86% Soothing Mist ICD alignment

Support Mechanics Item Basics
- Bonus Health Globe Healing bonus only rolls as a secondary affix on - Shoulders, Chest, Boots, Shield, Amulet, and Rings. (Ancient items roll 30% higher)
- Prioritize Ancient +globe rolls on armor slots, and focus on the IAS/CDR/Socket/passive on jewelry before globes. (suggest 6x globes rolls for GR110+ )
- Istvan's Pair Blade's IAS is additive and shows up on your sheet APS. (Cap @ 5)
- Flying Dragon proc effectively doubles your current weapon's APS and ends up in the same additive bucket (Cap @ 5)
- Strongarms only works if the monster is actually 'displaced' by your Cyclone Strike, just damaging them does not apply the debuff.
- Band of Rue Chambers does not increase the bonus spirit from BoH: Infused with Light.
- Obsidian Ring of the Zodiac's ICD = 1/APS. CS should reduce a random cooldown each cast.)
- Oculus Ring Mechanics - http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/16527322731?page=21#409

Common Support Legendary Gems Used
- Gogok of Swiftness's IAS is additive and shows up in Sheet APS. No longer capped at Rank 50, and can be leveled above 100.
- Pain Enhancer's secondary effect is fantastic for staying at 5 APS cap in density (5APS w/o FD proc with ~35 mobs heh)
- Esoteric Alteration is multiplicative. (caps at Rank 100)
- Gem of Efficacious Toxin - 2.4.1 added an additional -10% damage reduction in addition to +10% additive damage. Multiple Toxins 2ndary effects do stack.
- Iceblink's secondary's 10% crit does affect the entire party's crit stat but requires the use of CW: Tsunami or CS: Wall of Wind.

Soft Healing Caps per second - max ancient +globes/+LoH @5APS, DW setup
- Epiphany Soothing Mist Baseline = 201k HP/s
- Cyclone Strike Soothing Breeze Baseline = 155k HP/s
- Soothing Mist + Soothing Breeze Concurrent Baseline = 356k HP/s
- Epiphany Soothing Mist MAX Globes = 317k HP/s
- Cyclone Strike Soothing Breeze MAX Globes = 352k HP/s
- Soothing Mist + Soothing Breeze Concurrent Max Globes = 669k HP/s
- Breath of Heaven: Circle of Life = 236k HP heal = ~67k HP/s @ 75% effective CDR
- Mantra of Healing - Boon of Inspiration = +35k LoH to group = ~70k HP/s @ 2aps, ~175k HP/s @ 5aps (this your party member's APS, not the monk's)
- Mantra of Healing - ACTIVE Shield @ 2x per second = ~194k shield/s

General Tips for Healing Support -Work in Progress, open for discussion!
- Selecting CS: Soothing Breeze is up to 105% more total healing. (you do lose Implosion's 34yd range)
- Selecting Mantra of Healing + Chant of Resonance and spamming Mantra will provide a 97k+ HP shield that can be refreshed twice a second.
- Spamming Cyclone Strike is actually better "burst" healing than spamming generator because Soothing Mist's ICD lines up exactly with the APS of Cyclone Strike, but has ~15% lower FD uptime, so return to generator once group is healed. (looking for feedback on this conclusion)
- GeneratorAPS is not capped at 5 due to innate APS mod, R2, and Alacrity - and using your generator is the best way to maximize Flying Dragon proc uptime.
- No "ideal" CDR or IAS caps, just adjust your gameplay to maintain 100% Soothing Mist uptime. (less CDR = more Zodiac spam)
- STI > Alacrity if you have to make a choice between the 2.
- All Mantra Actives (as well as Breath of Heaven and Blinding Flash) are not on the GCD (global cooldown) and can be cast while using generator (this can help slightly with the desync/misalignment mentioned above)

Disclaimer - regardless, whenever you are in a group just stop arguing and just equip/spec into whatever the Wizard tells you to so you can get to rifting! ^_^v
05/23/2016 06:29 AMPosted by Bahamut
Please read back http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/16527322731?page=22#436

Its mentioned there, it applies only to 1 monster if its a FRESH application (no EP before) and consume MR. Anyway, do not underestimate the power of AD.


Right, but then will that MR'ed EP will be spread to other targets after you hit 7SS?
Thanks davlok again, for the marvellous explanation in detail.

I didn't know about soothing breeze ICD and sometimes wondered why my spammed spirit doesn't equivalent to my HP recovery. So from now on, only spamming more than 1/second, except zodiac proc.

But another thing is BoH, its spammable (depends on definition of spam). there is alternative BoH build which abandon raiment set to equip Peshkov, so its pretty short cooldown (1-2s realistic including zodiac) and its very useful for.... transient boost like tanking explosive (molten/grotesque), electrified, anything that hurts alot.

Its around 2.2 second cooldown with good CDR stat, then with zodiac you can get it down to 1.2 second cooldown. but I think its huge chunk of healing is more useful in some situation, like half/quarter of potion.
05/24/2016 12:30 AMPosted by hong
Right, but then will that MR'ed EP will be spread to other targets after you hit 7SS?


Yes, according to Davlok and other pro, yes it is. (because I didn't play uliana for long time)
If you spread Manual EP w/ MR on it (only 1 target with palmed in vicinity) using SSS w/ uliana, havoc MR + AD effect will wreak the battleground if use correctly.

Ideally you do the above thing, then accumulate monster (group them from all direction) into screen full density (in open map, yay). Wait just before cold rotation comes, make your assimilation stack freaking high, then SSS when cold rotation just here, wait for screen clear (lagging for some PC)
I'm not talking about AD really. What I'm talking about is: use Uli 2pc to cast palm. One of them will have the MR buff on it. Then detonate with Uli 6pc. Will the MR-buffed EP spread to other targets? I'm guessing it will. The downside is that you won't be able to tell, since all the non-buffed EPs will also get spread.
05/23/2016 04:10 PMPosted by Davlok
General Tips for Healing Support -Work in Progress, open for discussion!
- GeneratorAPS is not capped at 5 due to innate APS mod, R2, and Alacrity - and using your generator is the best way to maximize Flying Dragon proc uptime.
- No "ideal" CDR or IAS caps, just adjust your gameplay to maintain 100% Soothing Mist uptime. (less CDR = more Zodiac spam)
- STI > Alacrity if you have to make a choice between the 2.
- Selecting CS: Soothing Breeze is ~15% more total healing if used every 62 frames. (doesn't seem quite worth it when you consider Implosion's 34 yard range for resolve/sa)
- All Mantra Actives (as well as Breath of Heaven) are not on the GCD (global cooldown) and can be cast while using generator (this can help slightly with the desync/misalignment mentioned above)
- Spamming Cyclone Strike is actually better "burst" healing than spamming generator because Soothing Mist's ICD lines up exactly with the APS of Cyclone Strike, but has ~15% lower FD uptime, so return to generator once group is healed. (looking for feedback on this conclusion)


1. For CDR & IAS, there is no caps, but there is certainly best and requirement. CDR is almost everywhere possible. (2x 10% wep, 8% glove shoulder 2xring amulet) because sometimes RG fight you need to avoid attack/near RG, so no/less zodiac proc thus need minimize downtime. (avoid twister Wiz death)

2. Might have to re-evaluate soothing breeze usage, should be able to change if using another healing source (BoH / MoH)

05/23/2016 04:10 PMPosted by Davlok
Disclaimer - regardless, whenever you are in a group just stop arguing and just equip/spec into whatever the Wizard tells you to so you can get to rifting! ^_^v


This is so true
05/24/2016 01:26 AMPosted by hong
I'm not talking about AD really. What I'm talking about is: use Uli 2pc to cast palm. One of them will have the MR buff on it. Then detonate with Uli 6pc. Will the MR-buffed EP spread to other targets? I'm guessing it will. The downside is that you won't be able to tell, since all the non-buffed EPs will also get spread.


yes, top doesn't use uliana 2, they will skip to another group of monster to CAST EP (U2 doesn't cast, its apply) to have AD & MR, provided you didn't consume MR when hitting last group.
05/24/2016 01:29 AMPosted by Bahamut
05/24/2016 01:26 AMPosted by hong
I'm not talking about AD really. What I'm talking about is: use Uli 2pc to cast palm. One of them will have the MR buff on it. Then detonate with Uli 6pc. Will the MR-buffed EP spread to other targets? I'm guessing it will. The downside is that you won't be able to tell, since all the non-buffed EPs will also get spread.


yes, top doesn't use uliana 2, they will skip to another group of monster to CAST EP (U2 doesn't cast, its apply) to have AD & MR, provided you didn't consume MR when hitting last group.


...

I'm not talking about "top". What I'm talking about is: use Uli 2pc to cast* palm. One of them will have the MR buff on it. Then detonate with Uli 6pc. Will the MR-buffed EP spread to other targets? I'm guessing it will. The downside is that you won't be able to tell, since all the non-buffed EPs will also get spread.

* or apply or use whatever word you want

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