I guess dmo will get nerfed in some way

Wizard
either the set, some of the supporting legs or just orbit... hopefully not OID as that can get used by all sets.

there is an 88 clear already with an orbit/oid build.
I hope DMO is not going to be nerfed or items supporting it. What I hope for is that other sets will be buffed, especially my favourite Firebird.
01/09/2016 04:55 AMPosted by RoGeR
I hope DMO is not going to be nerfed or items supporting it. What I hope for is that other sets will be buffed, especially my favourite Firebird.

With 88 cleared I think it's safe to say DMO will probably see a number tweak in the 6p bonus. It's a complete outlier compared to most of the other classes.

Having said that, I hope only the 6p bonus sees a change and the supporting items remain the same. Wizards are very behind in terms of good supporting legendaries, as evidenced by their complete lack of good LoN builds. But knowing how nerfs tend to land twice I wouldn't be surprised if The Twisted Sword and Triumvirate saw some adjustments, too.

I agree that Firebird needs a buff. I hope to see a slight bump up in that set's 6p before the patch goes live.
Isn't the orbit build abusing a bug where all the orbs can detonate at once?
We saw this coming weeks ago on PTR it's just now players have perfected the bug. It's the orbit bug that's making those clears possible, w/o it the DMO set bonus and supporting items are just fine.

Actually Twisted Sword also needs to be brought back down to 75-100% then we're squeeky clean. If you look, players are perfecting their gear, Those players with 85+ clears have 144% to in one case 187%+ Area damage (4-6 rolls). I wasn't joking around when I said the Era of Area damage has begun. It's a top stat that will see 80+ clears with all our sets once you start getting a ton of it. It just so happens the orbit build has the perfect synergy with requiring low arcane cost so that you can fit in Aquila while still maintaining the damage combination of OID and Orbit.

I saw it's damage potential to be off the charts when it first debuted but just didn't predict it to be used at the top end in solo because of the mitigation issues but with Aquila and signature spam with apoc use looks like they found away around that.
Barb and Crus are up to 86 btw too

If Firebirds goes back to 50/650 DMO might actually be fine as is.

I mean this IS the DMO and get wizard back competitive patch, maybe we should be okay with this albeit the bug. Even w/o the bug I can still see Orbit build reaching 85, especially after all Augmentations are done.

These players also have gem level 90-100's . And how do we know the Orbit thing is even a bug? It could just be a feature of Orbit that we overlooked that was changed to make it competitive but since DMO was crap we never bothered with it till now?

Also worth noting they're using Arcane Dynamo so they're not even taking full advantage of the bug (which is spamming Orbit quickly), they're waiting till they have 5 stacks of blades. So actually I'm not even sure if this is even an issue with Orbit for those clears considering they're not even spamming Orbit upon detonation.
You guys deserve to have a sh!t class if this is your reaction to a buggy skill that people are finally only using after years of neglect.
01/09/2016 04:48 AMPosted by ximae
either the set, some of the supporting legs or just orbit... hopefully not OID as that can get used by all sets.

there is an 88 clear already with an orbit/oid build.


Isnt the problem with triumvirate instead? DMO's numbers are good for other skills but that one particular skill is the outlier. They also upped the Trium damage this patch too so maybe it should be kept at 100%.
01/09/2016 09:10 AMPosted by wage
You guys deserve to have a sh!t class if this is your reaction to a buggy skill that people are finally only using after years of neglect.


What's the case with Orbit anyways?
01/09/2016 09:28 AMPosted by Feanor
01/09/2016 09:10 AMPosted by wage
You guys deserve to have a sh!t class if this is your reaction to a buggy skill that people are finally only using after years of neglect.


What's the case with Orbit anyways?


It's detonating too much, something to do with maybe the hitboxes because on some smaller targets it's just fine but then on some bigger targets sometimes it will just detonate 2-4 orbs at once (with Undead Scepter that's 4-8 explosions) making it better than any other rune by a large margin even Obliterate's 700%.

01/09/2016 09:10 AMPosted by wage
You guys deserve to have a sh!t class if this is your reaction to a buggy skill that people are finally only using after years of neglect.


Shame on us if we actually desire power and balance w/o bugs, shame on us!
01/09/2016 09:42 AMPosted by MasterJay

01/09/2016 09:10 AMPosted by wage
You guys deserve to have a sh!t class if this is your reaction to a buggy skill that people are finally only using after years of neglect.


Shame on us if we actually desire power and balance w/o bugs, shame on us!

Yes, players too stupid to realise the difference between a bugged skill and an OP set deserve a crappy class.
01/09/2016 09:54 AMPosted by wage
01/09/2016 09:42 AMPosted by MasterJay

...

Shame on us if we actually desire power and balance w/o bugs, shame on us!

Yes, players too stupid to realise the difference between a bugged skill and an OP set deserve a crappy class.

This is the first time I've heard of a bug with Arcane Orbit. What's causing the bug? As in, what is causing 2-4 of the orbs to trigger at once? I tried out a few variations of the Orbit build on the PTR but unless I was surrounded I didn't really notice multiple orbs triggering at once.

The skill does seem rather buggy, though. I couldn't tell if there were times where I actually had 5+ orbs following me or if there was just a visual glitch with the skill making it appear there were more than four orbs.

The skill may be obviously bugged to some, but it's the first I've heard of it. I don't see anything in the Bug Report forum about it, either. It's not a just matter of "stupid players" being unable to see a difference between a bugged skill and an overpowered set. Seeking set balance both within a single class and across all classes should be the priority. If a set is overpowered it should be adjusted. If a bug is causing a skill to be overpowered it should be fixed. It's as simple as that. But way to go for insulting people for just wanting to discuss balance issues in this game.
@Windgrace, a single outlying skill doesn't make the set overpowered. See how Tal Rasha also performs best when used with the same skill? Nerfing the set wouldn't change the fact it's an outlier. Unfortunately, it's quite late for serious changes, otherwise I'd say some ICD could be patched on Orbit to limit its power.
The orbits explode when they touch a monster hitbox. If this is the case, why it is considered a bug?

Sorry about the noob question but i don't understand the "buginess" of it.
01/09/2016 05:26 AMPosted by Windgrace
01/09/2016 04:55 AMPosted by RoGeR
I hope DMO is not going to be nerfed or items supporting it. What I hope for is that other sets will be buffed, especially my favourite Firebird.

With 88 cleared I think it's safe to say DMO will probably see a number tweak in the 6p bonus. It's a complete outlier compared to most of the other classes.

Having said that, I hope only the 6p bonus sees a change and the supporting items remain the same. Wizards are very behind in terms of good supporting legendaries, as evidenced by their complete lack of good LoN builds. But knowing how nerfs tend to land twice I wouldn't be surprised if The Twisted Sword and Triumvirate saw some adjustments, too.

I agree that Firebird needs a buff. I hope to see a slight bump up in that set's 6p before the patch goes live.


This mind set is so retarded, guess everyone shouldn't be playing PTR is they don't want to be gimped on live.
01/09/2016 09:54 AMPosted by wage
Yes, players too stupid to realise the difference between a bugged skill and an OP set deserve a crappy class


Okay fair enough although the OP isn't stupid he's one of the most experienced and vocal DMO testers out there. He knows of the bugged Orbit, in fact I'm pretty sure he was the first poster to notice it and he knows of all the supporting legs power levels for DMO. He's simply stating there is a possibility that a tone down could happen for DMO, the supporting legs and a fix to Orbit. Could be one, could be the other, could be all 3!

Like I've said Twisted Sword build is up to 86, that doesn't utilize Orbit at all. Again though Twisted Sword could have been one of those buffs just so we'd test it and would go back down to 75-100%. We don't know, we can't accurately predict the power levels ahead like Blizzard can.
01/09/2016 09:54 AMPosted by wage
Yes, players too stupid to realise the difference between a bugged skill and an OP set deserve a crappy class


Okay fair enough although the OP isn't stupid he's one of the most experienced and vocal DMO testers out there. He knows of the bugged Orbit, in fact I'm pretty sure he was the first poster to notice it and he knows of all the supporting legs power levels for DMO. He's simply stating there is a possibility that a tone down could happen for DMO, the supporting legs and a fix to Orbit. Could be one, could be the other, could be all 3!

Like I've said Twisted Sword build is up to 86, that doesn't utilize Orbit at all. Again though Twisted Sword could have been one of those buffs just so we'd test it and would go back down to 75-100%. We don't know, we can't accurately predict the power levels ahead like Blizzard can.


Well, 2.3 monk... No one can predict the future.
01/09/2016 01:10 PMPosted by Feanor
@Windgrace, a single outlying skill doesn't make the set overpowered. See how Tal Rasha also performs best when used with the same skill? Nerfing the set wouldn't change the fact it's an outlier.


I believe I addressed this point pretty directly with...

01/09/2016 10:18 AMPosted by Windgrace
If a set is overpowered it should be adjusted. If a bug is causing a skill to be overpowered it should be fixed. It's as simple as that.


Again, I'm not sure what bug people are experiencing. I've seen a visual glitch with 5+ orbs circling my Wizard, but I haven't seen anything else so I haven't experienced the bug. What exactly is happening? It sounds like in some circumstances an enemy will trigger all orbs to trigger instantaneously and that target will undertake all of that damage at once? Seems like it could be a problem with the monster hit boxes?
01/09/2016 01:43 PMPosted by Windgrace
01/09/2016 01:10 PMPosted by Feanor
@Windgrace, a single outlying skill doesn't make the set overpowered. See how Tal Rasha also performs best when used with the same skill? Nerfing the set wouldn't change the fact it's an outlier.


I believe I addressed this point pretty directly with...

01/09/2016 10:18 AMPosted by Windgrace
If a set is overpowered it should be adjusted. If a bug is causing a skill to be overpowered it should be fixed. It's as simple as that.


Again, I'm not sure what bug people are experiencing. I've seen a visual glitch with 5+ orbs circling my Wizard, but I haven't seen anything else so I haven't experienced the bug. What exactly is happening? It sounds like in some circumstances an enemy will trigger all orbs to trigger instantaneously and that target will undertake all of that damage at once? Seems like it could be a problem with the monster hit boxes?


I don't feel anything is overpowered.

1500 paragon Sader clear 86 with 13:15

2700 paragon wizard clear 88 with 14:37

6k primary stats...

If anything sader is at a way better place and is just sandbaging hard.
Well, Crusaders have had a strong LoN build during the entire PTR. So strong that it didn't even need a typical primary or spender...

And I just read Barbarians are at 88, as well...? Or maybe it was an 86.

My knee jerk reaction to "DMO has done 88" is it should see a final number rebalance but I'm not so sure now. Witch Doctors, Demon Hunters and Monks would seem to be the odd classes out this go-around though. At least just looking at their sets on the PTR leaderboards.

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