Epiphany

Monk
So epiphany should get some kind of damage buff associated with it in the next patch right? Monks are just the last class in line to get that change right? Because I really hope that for the next patch monks aren't, once again, the only class that doesn't get a damage buff associated with their transformative skill.

Of course there are other changes that need to be made but I feel this particular one shows a large amount of neglect on Blizzard's part

Place your bets now. Will monks get love in the next patch or the all too familiar cold shoulder?
Make Flying Dragon permanent! Then I'm happy for a full patch or even 2 ...
05/23/2016 04:14 AMPosted by Mannou
So epiphany should get some kind of damage buff associated with it in the next patch right? Monks are just the last class in line to get that change right? Because I really hope that for the next patch monks aren't, once again, the only class that doesn't get a damage buff associated with their transformative skill.

Of course there are other changes that need to be made but I feel this particular one shows a large amount of neglect on Blizzard's part

Place your bets now. Will monks get love in the next patch or the all too familiar cold shoulder?


+1
I always feel like there should be a damage buff when i use this skill.

Obviously one could make the argument that we do, in the form of spirit regen but meh, that's pretty weak.

So some quick thoughts for a buff:

1. Increase the primary element stacked on the toon by x% during epiphany. I rather quite like this one since it's not the more standard 'boring' buff we see all the time.

or

2. Increase IAS, CD, CHC, or CHD by x%. Kinda boring, but oh well.
Making flying dragon permanent would be nice but that still doesn't even touch on the issue that monks are visibly and purposefully being kept weak for whatever reason.

The different runes that epiphany has are no different, if not worse, than the runes other classes have available to them. The only rune that provides any kind of significant offensive improvement is insight simply because of the increased regen but there is absolutely no good reason why epiphany doesn't have a damage buff associated with the base skill.

As for what the buff should be, in my opinion, just make it a flat damage boost. Monks have enough caveats when it comes to damage. Just give a flat boost, instead of a stat that requires some other item to be useful.

But looking at your suggestions:

Attack speed would also be interesting but only if monks are able to go over the 5aps cap with the skill otherwise it's useless.

Cooldown would be interesting as well and may even be the most powerful of the options aside from a pure damage boost. It would allow cdr to be rolled off of gear in favor of area damage which would make builds like uliana's or raiments or inna gen, stronger.

Wouldn't mind a boost for either crits as well.

But instead of asking for an interesting damage buff to be added to the skill, just give monks what dhs got for vengeance. Anything really just to show that monks haven't been left in the dark purposefully because the more I look at this class and having played it since the game was released, the more I realize that either monks just haven't had their turn yet or someone at blizz just hates monks as a class.
Please - just fix the skill and maybe even change the two runes no one uses. fixed - why do you need damage on a skill you could easily make permanent with enough cdr? if you want that, ask for a straight damage boost and be done with it... seriously the defense on this skill is mad - can't be stunned, frozen or cc'ed in any other way, mad spirit regen and you teleport through packs of mobs if you use it right. Get it up near permanent and you might even leave out DS (as you don't need the utility) on your bar and add another skill.
All other classes got "transformative skills" - yeah but they got them pre lvl 61 - compare the skills - all of those skills are pure dmg for the other classes - that's right you can add dmg to epiphany, remove the defensive aspects and go back to use serenity every 3/4 seconds as the only real defensive skill we have - thx but no thx.
And what is all that whining about the other classes doing much more dmg - can any of them bring the utility the monk brings - No - they bring damage. So if you want to do more damage, play another class. You bought the whole game, no one is keeping you from playing wiz, wd or dh. What?! you don't like playing ranged - surprise there are two more melee classes available. And please don't start with the effort you'd have to put in to get to the endgame and collect the new items - if the dmg output of the monk is too small for you, you play grifts somewhere beyond gr75 - it'll take you no time at all to roll a different class.
...
TLDR: @ OP - bad idea
05/28/2016 06:27 AMPosted by Ruarigh
Please - just fix the skill and maybe even change the two runes no one uses. fixed - why do you need damage on a skill you could easily make permanent with enough cdr? if you want that, ask for a straight damage boost and be done with it... seriously the defense on this skill is mad - can't be stunned, frozen or cc'ed in any other way, mad spirit regen and you teleport through packs of mobs if you use it right. Get it up near permanent and you might even leave out DS (as you don't need the utility) on your bar and add another skill.
All other classes got "transformative skills" - yeah but they got them pre lvl 61 - compare the skills - all of those skills are pure dmg for the other classes - that's right you can add dmg to epiphany, remove the defensive aspects and go back to use serenity every 3/4 seconds as the only real defensive skill we have - thx but no thx.
And what is all that whining about the other classes doing much more dmg - can any of them bring the utility the monk brings - No - they bring damage. So if you want to do more damage, play another class. You bought the whole game, no one is keeping you from playing wiz, wd or dh. What?! you don't like playing ranged - surprise there are two more melee classes available. And please don't start with the effort you'd have to put in to get to the endgame and collect the new items - if the dmg output of the monk is too small for you, you play grifts somewhere beyond gr75 - it'll take you no time at all to roll a different class.
...
TLDR: @ OP - bad idea


Monks do just fine 75+. It's the 85+ where it gets tricky. Why should I have to roll another class to go dps? Why would I want to? A big part of the reason why I play this game is for the solo monk leaderboards. Giving the skill a damage buff to bring it to the level of every other class is not too much to ask for. Other classes also have ways of being cc immune so i don't see that as being a reason not to give the skill the damage it deserves. For the record I also play dh, barb, sader, a little bit of wiz when I feel the urge, I dabble in wd every once and a while, but monk is my class of choice.
as much as it would be nice to have epiphany be buffed trust me you don't want the situation that demon hunters have since dawn was introduced with "permanent vengeance or go home"

having your weapon cube slot locked up for every single DH build ever gets real old real fast
05/28/2016 10:17 AMPosted by Jalantha
as much as it would be nice to have epiphany be buffed trust me you don't want the situation that demon hunters have since dawn was introduced with "permanent vengeance or go home"

having your weapon cube slot locked up for every single DH build ever gets real old real fast


that might be an issue for dh but monks can get full up time on epiphany without a legendary affix like dawn. In fact monks don't even have a legendary affix that is in anyway related to epiphany.

The thing is, what weapon would you ever want to replace dawn with as a dh? There really isn't a better option out there so there really isn't a problem with dawn taking that cube spot. Should be happy about it :D

It wouldn't just be nice for epiphany to be buffed it would be fair, and would bring monks to a level where they can compete with other classes in the game. I don't know if you guys have seen the leaderboads this season but monks are a full 3 grift lvls below every single other class. As of writing this, the highest a monk has cleared so far this season has been 93. Wd 96, Barb 96, DH 97 Sader 98, Wiz 104. When every other class can complete a 96 or higher and we're stuck at 93, tell me again why monks shouldn't be getting a big upgrade soon?

All I'm talking about is leveling out the classes, and not even that, don't even have to nerf the others, just buff the one monk skill that is used in every single monk build ever, anyway and that should at least make up for the 3 lvl difference.
100% agree that epiphany is lacking as a major cooldown.

Would be cool if the inner fire rune was actually baseline and did elemental damage based on which rune you're using. I find it rather stale in its current state visual-wise. Change the fireball we cast when using generators to clones that mimic like the dh vengeance ice rune.

Flat % dmg increase is always welcome for more potential build variety.
I find Epiphany unintended teleports to be the most frustrating thing in D3 (if I'm holding force standstill, I really wish it wouldn't port). It's already mandatory enough. Why not throw the dps buff on a less aggravating skill?

Until they fix the Epiphany issues (unintended teleports and maybe a WoL dmg bug) I can't get behind any increase in Epiphany power.
05/29/2016 04:17 PMPosted by Vox
I find Epiphany unintended teleports to be the most frustrating thing in D3 (if I'm holding force standstill, I really wish it wouldn't port). It's already mandatory enough. Why not throw the dps buff on a less aggravating skill?

Until they fix the Epiphany issues (unintended teleports and maybe a WoL dmg bug) I can't get behind any increase in Epiphany power.


I completely understand the frustration and I'm sure anyone who has played monk for long enough will as well but Epiphany is the skill. It is the lvl 60 skill, the last and and should be the most powerful because it is monks defining skill. As for unintended teleports, if you are playing support just have your character face the wall and keep your mouse way away from any mob hit boxes. Be wary of death maidens. I don't believe that it is a bug with epiphany, and I quite like the tp on attack, there is just a learning curve to it. No reason not to give it the damage buff it needs.

For the WoL bug well, yea. This should have been fixed a long time ago. Full stop. Again, though, absolutely no reason not to buff the skill.

In case you missed it, monks are the only, I repeat, the only class that does not have a damage buff attributed to their avatar skill. I have yet to hear a legitimate reason in opposition of buffing epiphany.
Is there any viable spec that does not include Epiphany?

Diversity is a good thing. Frustrating gameplay shouldn't be forced.

If we want dps, moving some or all of our crapload of additive mods to multi is a better way to go.

If a monk wants to tempest rush, wave of light, or lashing tail kick with their respective supporting items, maybe with 3 of our 20% additive dps passives, overawe, faith in the light, fire ally, we end up looking at 300-400% additive dps mods. That is ridiculous compared to other classes.
05/29/2016 12:53 AMPosted by Mannou
05/28/2016 10:17 AMPosted by Jalantha
as much as it would be nice to have epiphany be buffed trust me you don't want the situation that demon hunters have since dawn was introduced with "permanent vengeance or go home"

having your weapon cube slot locked up for every single DH build ever gets real old real fast


that might be an issue for dh but monks can get full up time on epiphany without a legendary affix like dawn. In fact monks don't even have a legendary affix that is in anyway related to epiphany.

The thing is, what weapon would you ever want to replace dawn with as a dh? There really isn't a better option out there so there really isn't a problem with dawn taking that cube spot. Should be happy about it :D

[/quote]

any DH build that would want to utilize two legendary weapon bonuses (without dual-wielding) or two quiver bonuses...while at the same time having the dawn bonus

for example trying to push with elemental arrow with marauder set, you need rucksack + augustine quiver bonuses at same time

permanent vengeance is a horrible band-aid to try and fix DH issues, and even with 100% vengeance uptime (through some combination of zodiac and CDR abuse) still mathematically makes the class inferior in terms of DPS
Epiphany is fine. Solves spirit problems and provides toughness. Give it any more and they'd have to take it from somewhere else in the monk kit and we're already one of the most pigeon-holed classes.
Like was touched on above, a lack of legendary modifiers for Epiphany is likely the key to tuning a lot of monk builds. The trick would be balancing which slot the item is in. With the current gear builds for the main monk specs, there isn't much wiggle room and something would need to be likely changed in the currently unused runes to make up for a loss elsewhere.
    Monk

    New legendary Ring

    As long as Epiphany is on your hotbar, gain the effect of the Desert Shroud rune. The duration of Epiphany is also increased to 20 seconds.
The ring slot could work. Tbh I'd like boot slot for WoL builds. Removing the need for Mystic Ally through the increased spirit regen rune would also free up a skill slot for Blinding Flash Faith in the Light for damage, or a number of defensive posibilities (which equates to more damage through less movement generally anyway).

Problem is fitting that into a U6 build... or even finding the room for it in others.
I could get behind an Epiphany set. Since it would already be mandatory in that build space, it could then be buffed to the moon via 6-set without adversely affecting all monk play.

2-set = gain desert shroud rune, epiphany does not expire.

4-set = fire rune now deals 2000% more dmg, and changes to highest elemental dmg.

6-set = gain 200% dmg for 5s, up to a maximum of 2000%, each time you teleport.
06/03/2016 06:00 AMPosted by Taurea
    Monk

    New legendary Ring

    As long as Epiphany is on your hotbar, gain the effect of the Desert Shroud rune. The duration of Epiphany is also increased to 20 seconds.


interesting idea but that's just unity with an epiphany wrapping. I like the thought though :)

06/03/2016 03:21 PMPosted by Vox
I could get behind an Epiphany set. Since it would already be mandatory in that build space, it could then be buffed to the moon via 6-set without adversely affecting all monk play.

2-set = gain desert shroud rune, epiphany does not expire.

4-set = fire rune now deals 2000% more dmg, and changes to highest elemental dmg.

6-set = gain 200% dmg for 5s, up to a maximum of 2000%, each time you teleport.


Could also be interesting to give an Epiphany set the clones from Sunwuko.

2 set - When in epiphany your attacks summon clones that explode for x% weapon damage. Gain X% damage reduction, for each mob hit (percentage would have to be high enough that you don't get oneshot by guardians on gr 85+)

4 set - Cooldown on epiphany is reduced by X% and while in epiphany your attacks reduce your defensive cooldowns.

6 set - After your clones hit a mob, the next clone that hits within X seconds has X% chance to create another clone. When a clone hits a mob that mob takes X% more damage from your attacks for X seconds and clone damage is increased by X%
06/03/2016 06:00 AMPosted by Taurea
    Monk

    New legendary Ring

    As long as Epiphany is on your hotbar, gain the effect of the Desert Shroud rune. The duration of Epiphany is also increased to 20 seconds.


interesting idea but that's just unity with an epiphany wrapping. I like the thought though :)


But it works outside Solo, which is where it's actually really needed!
So not "just" ... unity with an epiphany wrapping ;)

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