Fundamental flaws with Diablo 3

General Discussion
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1. No meaningful choices in character progression (RPG-aspect). Every "choice" is temporary and therefore meaningless. Loot is the only source of power.
2. Loothunt is not exciting at all. Loot rains from the sky and you only hunt for bigger numbers.
3. Matchmaking. Finding like-minded players is done by spamming in communities, which is a pain the ***. Why not allow named games?
12/09/2016 05:59 PMPosted by MissCheetah
That does not fix the game, only player perception of it. They get all our input, they just don't tell us what they do with it and by and large, they don't agree. What you really want is for them to actually DO what we say (not largely going to happen) and to tell us why they won't. Valid concern of course.

Here's my issue as far as communication goes.

Viability of builds boils down to a math problem. Thus when players and devs disagree about the viability of skills / builds / sets / whatever, what this means is that two people are working on the same math problem and getting different results. From an academic standpoint, this is unacceptable.

If I say something like, "Even building around Mirinae as much as possible, it's still objectively a trash gem". I can show that work by making an Inna's WotHF FoF build, building around the general Shenlong bonus, and sticking a Mirinae in compared to Simplicity's Strength (they're the direct competition) and doing the math. If it's impossible that Mirinae can ever win out, then the best case scenario for Mirinae is still subpar and something needs buffing, either the gem buffed or Shenlong bonuses switched to 6x universal multiplier, 2.5x gen multiplier, etc. Something has to give.

The dev's silence on issues such as that tells the player base that they're doing the math wrong, but the devs themselves are not showing us their work. That's what needs to change.

If the devs stand by the current iteration of certain mechanics in the game such as procs as objectively useful tools for a player to build around, at this point it's incumbent on them to either pick holes in our current models about how they're useless, demonstrate to us that there's a mechanic we're not taking into account in our calculations, or demonstrate the existence of a build with mechanics we agree on, that actually has these tools doing something useful.

Absent any of these responses, it's going to look like pure negligence from the player's perspective.
For me it would be-
1. Story. For sure it felt like, while Blizzards cinematics were still excellent, the story in game needed some better writting in some areas.

2. As other said the Skill System. I think we need to go bck to the Tree... in some cases tho, not all! Obviously pumping 5-20 points into a skill is an utter waste, especially nowadays when ppl dont have time to role 2-3 Paladins or Witch Doctors lol, but the system they have now with gear determining damage and power of said skills is equally bad.

3. End game. Imo all 3 games have kinda suffered this issue. Im all for questing for sets and loot....but maybe have it serve a purpose once we achieve that goal too aside from "awe man my guy looks cool!!!"?

Thats one thing ill give D3 at least, they did try (try being the key word) and do a few things with the end game
12/11/2016 08:47 PMPosted by Chaosgod4
3. End game. Imo all 3 games have kinda suffered this issue. Im all for questing for sets and loot....but maybe have it serve a purpose once we achieve that goal too aside from "awe man my guy looks cool!!!"?

ARPGs have traditionally thrived on diversity, not on an explicit "endgame". Without diversity, the perceived need for an explicit endgame arises. The fact there's no real way to reach a plateau thanks to infinite scaling only makes things worse, as diversity becomes progressively eroded thanks to the careless approach to balance (more like the lack thereof). If as if that was not enough, these clueless designers just want to funnel everyone and their mom into their stupid sets, only because they're obsessed with dictating how we are to play the game.

Basically, what we see in D3 is a seemingly endless chain of mistakes thanks to a completely wrong focus and a glaring lack of understanding of the genre. These folks just can't seem to be able to keep themselves from holding our hands, despite the genre itself thriving on meaningful gear and build exploration. It's the exact opposite of what they're doing. As far as they continue to force their personally crafted setups, this game will never have quality replay value, and will continue to lump on the laughably uninspired and completely artificial power creep approach that's become Blizzard's only trick as of late.

Granted, other ARPGs have actually ventured into explicit endgame activities, but not without ignoring the critical importance of diversity within any APRG's core gameplay as Blizzard has. They just think streamlining progression around sets is good enough because it worked for their WoW cash cow, seemingly oblivious about the fact the only reason why this works for that game is the robust content updates it receives periodically. The game is designed from the ground up to support steady progression through new layers of content, something D3 definitely doesn't have (and shouldn't even need, for that matter). And no, before some clueless fanboy tries to defend this nonsense, bloating numbers ad-infinitum isn't adding any new layers of content. It's a lame gear check, at best.

Honestly, the best thing that could happen to this game is that the entire design team gets moved back to WoW, and replaced by people who actually have a clue about what Diablo is at it's core, because these guys have no idea after 4+ years of throwing crap at the wall hoping something sticks.
No Lobby
Forced Playstyle
To much WoW in D3
CD Skills in D3
4/2 items... WTF ?
No fix Unique stats - Too much RNG
Ancients and Augmenting... Two of the worst decisions...

And so on ....and so on... No way to fix this anymore...

12/09/2016 04:47 PMPosted by MissCheetah

WTF ?! Do or can they not understand what you were trying to say ?
No named games
Paragon more important than items
1: Nothing to do beside Greater rift all the time.

2: No skill

3: only 4 players in game ...
1. An ARPG Game not an Action Game: Freedom of choice in characters development, Skills (doensn't need to be a tree), stats, weapons, types of gear, etc.

2. Story: I get that Bliz has it's way of telling a story, but how this game's was developed was beyond bad. To be specific: Cartony/Scooby-Doo villains, cain's death, etc.

3. Interaction with core player base: better communication, specially with long time fans.
1. No real itemization (To play end game we are forced to use class sets and we are limited to few weapon/rings/amulets. That's not fun.)

2. No real character/skill builds ( 77 int/dex/str really? I want to alocate myself what I want and where I want. I need it to have influence. I don't want high numbers of stats like 11k+ It's just bad design. It was little bit better pre RoS)

3. No real crafting (Is blacksmith used for anything else than salvaging and making rares so we can upgrade them? Hm....)
  • Developer Forced Builds
  • through sets. In D2, you can pump levels into skills of choice and still makes it viable even if not maximizing efficiency, in D3 if you're not using sets you do practically no damage at all and you can only use skills determine by the sets.

    In another word, we're trying to find skills for our sets instead of items for our skills. In a game about item hunt, it's just wrong.

  • Poor item designs
  • Legendaries without an affix is pointless, then they give us manald heal.

  • Classes don't play like its archetype
  • This is due to the forced builds. We have monks that plays like a meteor wizard (wave of light build), wizards that plays like a tank or witch doctor (arcane orbit and firebird archon), Witch doctors that play like a wizard (barber).

    By itself its not a bad thing, but when our choices are limited to developers forced builds, it's not ideal.
    12/10/2016 11:22 PMPosted by ShadowAegis
    I say that this thread should've been done differently.

    But the problem with trading is that when you have a game that supports trading then the drops have to suck compared to trading. Which means it is more efficient to get gear from trade. Then you are right back where Wyatt says is that you have been bumped up the gear curve. Where instead of getting an upgrade every couple hours to getting an upgrade every few weeks.

    No, you would have Item Drops like they are now (or without the bias towards your character class) and the Trade Function would be supplemental/a method of getting what you want if RNG decides to not favour you for a while.

    1) You wouldn't want drops to suck so that Trade becomes the only viable way to play.

    2) Trading isn't gameplay. Why would you prioritize it over the gameplay!?
    design philosophy and its perverted meta
    12/12/2016 08:20 AMPosted by SirSteel

    2) Trading isn't gameplay. Why would you prioritize it over the gameplay!?

    There are people in WoW who do nothing but play the AH. Legit players and not the gold farmers.
    1. build diversity (which means itemization, skill tree etc...)
    2. lack of content (doing rifts, GR and bounties is pretty limited)

    thats basically it
    12/09/2016 08:31 AMPosted by TakeNotes
    I would like to start a real discussion regarding the fundamental flaws with this game. List 3 flaws you feel break the game:

    1) Weapons based DPS
    2) Lack of skill trees
    3) Too many useless legendaries

    1. Actually, it's not solely weapon based damage but your total sheet dps (which the game is pretty crappy at showing). Essentially it's the same in my opinion as in D2, you collected +skill stats on charms and your gear, especially as a caster. It just has a different look.

    2. Lack of skill trees is both true and false. There are no actual skill trees but there aren't a lack of choice in skills. Each skill has runes that changes the skill and thus are essentially a new skill.

    3. They are fixing that but in the wrong way I think. The problem with this is that they are adding in more legendary items that don't just change skills around but they also buff the damage of skills too which makes the game too reliant on gear and limits what your build can be.

    For me it's one thing mostly and that's the way items are handled in this game. Sets and some legendary items buff the damage of certain skills so that it essentially elevates some builds above others. All skills and their runes should do good damage and be viable by themselves. Legendary items and sets should at the most just tweak skills to be different than default and only increase the damage by a little bit if it's needed to enforce a certain playstyle for a set.
    1) Being a MMORPG. I always blamed d2 for such things too, but it wasn't as huge. I do like multiplayer games but not massive multiplayer online experience.
    2) Handled by blizzard. Anyone but them, please, because d1 and d2 were essentially made by other studio. Which means the game will be catered down to absolute majority, non-gamers. But who will care about what I like? Having to visit new, to see all these commercials, buy now only at 19.99!! type of bullpoop. It's almost as bad as steam, which is a social-network/market for everyone and his grandmother.
    3) Consumer culture is enforced in game, on forums, in communities. I just don't enjoy playing it with its audience. It's just like in South Park episode where Eric tried to get into Nascar racing but he wasn't "As dumb and poor." In conclusion, this game is just not for me and I was being a silly man for trying to fit in.
    My main peeves:

    (i) Lack of diversity; due to
    (ii) itemisation (gear determining 99% of your characters' damage/toughness); and
    (iii) no active skill point allocation to determine which skills the player chooses to buffed and not the devs.

    I can list a lot more, but those are the main issues that need to be addressed urgently.

    Constructive criticism topics like this needs to have a reply by CMs, otherwise it appears like they just don't care.
    12/12/2016 05:31 PMPosted by jtcdgroup
    Constructive criticism topics like this needs to have a reply by CMs, otherwise it appears like they just don't care.

    Sadly a CM post saying "we will pass this on" tends to horribly derail the thread into "OMG why can't we have blue posts on other topics/" Well, CMs are not Devs who the players want to hear from.

    That said, this thread is constructive and I encourage folks to stay on track. Do not derail it outside of the core GAME issues you have a problem with.
    1. Strength-based characters are hilariously weak
    2. Paragon levels
    3. Useless, slap-in-your-face and throw-it-out-of-here legendaries

    PS- Devs can do something about this but they have shown time and time again that they won't ^^

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