It's disgusting how groups are mandatory...

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Could just remove leaderboards.

Would solve the thud and botting problem as well.

Remove the competitive aspect of that ranking system would solve a lot of problems in regards to the emotional distress coming from this.
01/17/2017 12:02 PMPosted by Phatty
Could just remove leaderboards.

Would solve the thud and botting problem as well.

Remove the competitive aspect of that ranking system would solve a lot of problems in regards to the emotional distress coming from this.
That pretty much status quo anyway right? Peoples feeling gets hurt because it's "unfair" that someone is doing something that has zero effect on others outside of pride and they must fix it!
01/17/2017 12:02 PMPosted by Phatty
Could just remove leaderboards.

Would solve the thud and botting problem as well.


Yes, I'm sure it would definitely give solo players some kind of way to compete with each others... =_=
Well remove competition from the entire game would make it fair across the board.

I'm sure there are players who want to "compete" can go to third party sites and register themselves. There are a few of these.
This thread is proof that the forums are more entertaining then the game. >.<
01/17/2017 12:45 PMPosted by ChaosLeech
This thread is proof that the forums are more entertaining then the game. >.<


True, forums are the true end game.

If someone has a know how, you could probably just get all the leaderboard information and stick it into a database and remove anyone on multiple leaderboards and you'd have a pretty good solo leaderboard group, wouldn't be perfect but good enough.

You can just check if they have multiplayer records also in game to see if they aren't solo.
The level of disparity between groups & solo (and indeed between say 4 man groups and 2 man) is one of the big reasons this game died off like it has, if you are going to cater to a minority of your playerbase to the detriment of the majority, then well...
You know why D2 did not have this issue?

Solo players were mostly always offline players, me included.

And the fact that characters did not derive their dps/toughness 99% from gear.
01/16/2017 08:26 PMPosted by Blashyrkh
SOLO PLAYERS CAN, AND DO CARE ABOUT COMPETITION, WHETHER YOU ACKNOWLEDGE IT OR NOT.

And get upset when people sit on the solo leaderboards after doing the best grift solo. If I do a grift solo, why shouldn't be counted as solo, seeing as I did it on my own why shouldn't it count, It's a solo leaderboard, reguirement is to do it solo, they did it solo and now you don't want it to count, sounds more like I want my own leaderboard so I'm always on top, because I'm the only one on it.
Same as your idiot assumption that you should get top position in leaderboards, regardless of what you wear. Whaaaa, its not fair, I can't get first position with nothing but whites, where's play my way, I demand that I should be able to get 1st position on leaderboards, naked, if I so desire
Well that's a whole new level of stupid.
Eh. Word of advice, just ignore Phatty, he's provided no substantiative argument, just decided yours isn't substantiative without refuting your points in the slightest. Block him, ignore him, and don't respond to him.

01/17/2017 07:59 PMPosted by Steve
And get upset when people sit on the solo leaderboards after doing the best grift solo. If I do a grift solo, why shouldn't be counted as solo, seeing as I did it on my own why shouldn't it count, It's a solo leaderboard, reguirement is to do it solo, they did it solo and now you don't want it to count, sounds more like I want my own leaderboard so I'm always on top, because I'm the only one on it.

They can't get their on their own. They got all their gear from running torments and rifts of a higher level than they can solo, resulting in them gaining gear faster, which allowed them to climb the solo leaderboard on the backs of their teams speed. Climbing a solo board based on the success of a group doesn't sound too solo to me. I can see their perspective. I personally focus on the 2 person group myself, and only run solo rifts to get more bloodshard limit.
01/17/2017 08:40 PMPosted by Rynn
Eh. Word of advice, just ignore Phatty, he's provided no substantiative argument, just decided yours isn't substantiative without refuting your points in the slightest. Block him, ignore him, and don't respond to him.


That's rich considering that there are people who agree with my points.

The problem is that citing something that true isn't enough for causation. Yes, there is definitely a major disparity. Considering that the multiplayer experience does not impact solo performance directly - everything is relative and isolated in their own environments. OP and those supporting the crux of his argument on the basis of true - true related circumstance. I think it's true - true unrelated.

The problem lies in trying to measure yourself against people who don't play the same way you do.

I only refute that the disparity matters from a pure solo standpoint - except in the case of leaderboards - which I've already agreed with Thorgor about.

I've also said that straight forward scaling of rewards should be fixed in the setting of hellfires and bounty caches.

Trying to demonize me is nice and all, but I think you've missed me by a mile.
01/17/2017 07:59 PMPosted by Steve
01/16/2017 08:26 PMPosted by Blashyrkh
SOLO PLAYERS CAN, AND DO CARE ABOUT COMPETITION, WHETHER YOU ACKNOWLEDGE IT OR NOT.

And get upset when people sit on the solo leaderboards after doing the best grift solo. If I do a grift solo, why shouldn't be counted as solo, seeing as I did it on my own why shouldn't it count, It's a solo leaderboard, reguirement is to do it solo, they did it solo and now you don't want it to count, sounds more like I want my own leaderboard so I'm always on top, because I'm the only one on it.
Same as your idiot assumption that you should get top position in leaderboards, regardless of what you wear. Whaaaa, its not fair, I can't get first position with nothing but whites, where's play my way, I demand that I should be able to get 1st position on leaderboards, naked, if I so desire

When did I say I should get a top leaderboard spot regardless of what I wear? Asking for reasonable balance and that over-hyperbolized nonsense you're now claiming I said are two very different things. Learn to read, and more importantly, understand what's being discussed or go troll somewhere else, because you're just making a fool of yourself here.

If you had actually been paying attention (which as usual, you have not), you'd realize the problem is solo players lacking a competition niche to call their own. Whether we like it or not, we're all pit against eachother under the standard "solo" leaderboards, which vastly undervalue the individual efforts of solo players as a product of several unwarranted perks co-op players receive. This is precisely why many people have requested a solo-only leaderboard as an easy alternative to actually working balance out between both modes. Heck, they can keep the current farcical "solo" leaderboard if they want, as long as they actually allow us to have a relevant context under which to compete against like-minded folks. Is that clear enough?
01/17/2017 05:48 PMPosted by jtcdgroup
Solo players were mostly always offline players, me included.
I don't know where you get that idea from. Tons of people played Solo Ladder only for the gated content(rune words), Uber Diablo, and Uber Tristram. I guess you could use some of those SP mods that replicated events and gave you unlimited stash space and character editors, but they also made it real easy your cheat yourself out of a fun time.
01/17/2017 12:02 PMPosted by Phatty
Could just remove leaderboards.

Would solve the thud and botting problem as well.

Remove the competitive aspect of that ranking system would solve a lot of problems in regards to the emotional distress coming from this.


That would also remove what little motivation there is left to play this game
Ironically, I have more Seasonal Hardcore 100% SOLO Paragon than the Op acquired in 5 years of Diablo total. Leaderboards top 500 easy peasy with a Solo caracter created 3 days ago (and I work Fulltime).

But yeah, keep blaming groups!
01/18/2017 01:15 AMPosted by Doombringer
Ironically, I have more Seasonal Hardcore 100% SOLO Paragon than the Op acquired in 5 years of Diablo total. Leaderboards top 500 easy peasy with a Solo caracter created 3 days ago (and I work Fulltime).

But yeah, keep blaming groups!


Oh you're such a hero! In case you haven't noticed there have been others who've posted in this thread as well.
Groups are not mandatory. I play mainly solo and am still hanging in there close to the top of the leaderboards.

Groups are more efficient, as it should be. We need incentive to play with people.
not gonna lie, i'm amused at how much support an incorrect statement like "groups are mandatory" has gotten

i mean, let's be real: i pay less attention when someone sounds incredibly whiny, which is the overtone that post takes

it's not mandatory. yes, it's better to play in groups in almost all spheres, and yes, it is not incredible design that the solo leaderboards are impacted in a very serious way by people who are not trivially advantaged in groups. that doesn't make the tone any less obnoxious, however, and generally self-gratifying whining is filed more in the "noise" pile than the "signal" pile.

also, wow, here's a wild concept: any suggestions for addressing the issue? Of course not. It's easy to piss and moan about a problem, but the problem being pissed and moaned about is not an easy one to solve. You can make it better in some spheres such as the obvious benefits of being in a group means it really doesn't necessitate and artificial bonus like the magic find and EXP bonuses, but that will not leave a large footprint on the nature of the problem.

Four characters who can coordinate eachother's strength and weaknesses will always be better by nature than someone playing alone, and in a game that rewards you based on your performance, this means that groups will always have a higher capacity for receiving better rewards than someone playing alone. This is the crux of the problem, and unless they restrict solo leaderboards to people who only play solo and are never allowed to be in a group (hint: I'm guessing a lot of the people whining like to play in groups every now and then,) there is pretty much no way to reverse engineer the game to make it where soloing is someone as good, as strong, as efficient as being in a group without implementing arbitrary drawbacks to playing in a group that noone would approve because discouraging group play doesn't make sense.
01/18/2017 01:28 AMPosted by Mupasthech
Groups are not mandatory. I play mainly solo and am still hanging in there close to the top of the leaderboards.

And you would be even closer if you played in a group.

01/18/2017 01:28 AMPosted by Mupasthech
Groups are more efficient, as it should be. We need incentive to play with people.

Why? If people don't want to play in group, why is there a need to bait them into it? Do you really want to group with people that are only there because of the incentive?
People should group because they want to group, which would ensure they group with other people that want to group because they want to group, making this whole grouping thing more enjoyable for all the people involved.

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