[2.4.3] (S9) Manald Heal Builds + Mechanics

Wizard
Prev 1 14 15 16 23 Next
So I found when in high density and many attacks are going off at the same time, non crit MH procs aren't really displaying damage numbers all that often. I see them on rare occasion but mostly I just see the monster health drop. This makes it very hard to count non-crit MH procs in this situation.

When you get down to low target or single target though, you start seeing the non-crit MH proc damage display numbers again.

It explains why I might have thought that the CHC mod was included with the damage formula, even though it is not.

It also might explain why so many think Manald Heal is bugged. It might be proccing non crits and you wouldn't even notice those procs in higher GRs.
It's very unlikely to not have any crits for more than 1 attack though. With iceblink you should be at around 71% chc. With how many times per second you attack the chances of not getting a critical are remarkably low, even within a 1.5 second window. I suspect there is some manner to the way this ring works that might be arcane.

You can make a Bayesian probability tree to see what the chances of not having a critical and proc happen within a time window.
So what's the update?

CHC on gear DOES affect MH damage?
CHC from skills DOES NOT affect MH damage?
Ok here's round 5, where I redid the tests for Pinpoint barrier, Conflagration, Iceblink and Deep Freeze.
  • https://youtu.be/D8LqITPc8UY

All tests assume a 5% base CHC on character. Took the first 100 MH procs and counted how many crit.
  • Pinpoint Barrier (+5% CHC buff): 00:00 - 22 out of 100 MH procs crit. Working with MH.
  • Conflagration (+6% CHC debuff): 03:15 - 13 out of 100 MH procs crit. Working with MH.
  • Iceblink (+10% CHC debuff): 06:15 - 37 out of 100 MH procs crit. Working with MH.
  • Deep Freeze (+10% CHC buff): 09:15 - Hard to tell since non-crit Mh proc damage isn't being displayed all that often. After comparing with no deep freeze assigned, and looking at the footage though, I feel the Deep Freeze buff is working.

Note: "working with MH" means the item or skill increases MH proc crit chance.

So the only questionable result from this set is deep freeze. Looks like it's working though. A lot of crits compared to only having 5% CHC.
Broken promises test:
  • https://youtu.be/bH2YQQvmI9U

All MH procs noted when Broken promises buff increased CHC to 100% - did crit.

Noted non-crit MH procs only when broken promises buff was not up.

Broken promises is working with MH.
Harrington Waistguard feels like it increases MH damage too
Spectral Blade appears to be bugged with MH:
  • https://youtu.be/Kg9Ju3jOhUQ

Counted procs and looked at behavior.
  • Shame + Fragment: 00:00 - Result: 64 MH procs noted in the first minute after engaging.
  • No Item Speed bonus: 02:35 - Result: 42 MH procs noted in the first minute after engaging.
  • Shame Only: 05:36 - Result: 37 MH procs noted in the first minute after engaging.
  • Fragment Only: 08:02 - Result: 37 MH procs noted in the first minute after engaging.

Possible bug: MH procs seem to only occur from the first Spectral blade cast (the one that procs paralysis). Subsequent casts within 1.5s of the initial paralysis proc do not typically proc MH. The exception seems to be when paralysis rolls true in succession (back to back).

What this means is you only get up to 3 MH procs per paralysis proc (one from each tick).
Has anyone tested serpent sparker + hydra with vyr-rasha on the PTR? If so, what was the MH proc rate by the hydras like? Decent? Terrible?

As an aside, I'm seeing a lot of anecdotes from ppl on the PTR saying it feels like MH got nerfed somehow. No concrete evidence yet, but they say it seems to be proccing much less than it does on live. Has anyone done more conclusive tests?
@cratic I must ask, what do you do professionally? are you a researcher?
02/03/2017 09:07 AMPosted by RuffRyder
Has anyone tested serpent sparker + hydra with vyr-rasha on the PTR? If so, what was the MH proc rate by the hydras like? Decent? Terrible?

As an aside, I'm seeing a lot of anecdotes from ppl on the PTR saying it feels like MH got nerfed somehow. No concrete evidence yet, but they say it seems to be proccing much less than it does on live. Has anyone done more conclusive tests?


https://us.battle.net/forums/en/d3/topic/20753196188

See the thread I made on this here, and check the gifs posted. It has definitely been changed/bugged.
02/03/2017 09:07 AMPosted by RuffRyder
I'm seeing a lot of anecdotes from ppl on the PTR saying it feels like MH got nerfed somehow. No concrete evidence yet, but they say it seems to be proccing much less than it does on live. Has anyone done more conclusive tests?

Take a look, Tal/Vyr archon MH in a GR80 (2.5.0.43355):
  • https://youtu.be/6UETzf9Hueo

MH proc rate looks the same to me as it is on live.
02/03/2017 09:18 AMPosted by aloc
@cratic I must ask, what do you do professionally? are you a researcher?

01/23/2017 12:54 PMPosted by Cratic
01/23/2017 05:17 AMPosted by Angry
QA job

Funny you mention that..

=)
02/03/2017 05:08 PMPosted by Cratic
02/03/2017 09:07 AMPosted by RuffRyder
I'm seeing a lot of anecdotes from ppl on the PTR saying it feels like MH got nerfed somehow. No concrete evidence yet, but they say it seems to be proccing much less than it does on live. Has anyone done more conclusive tests?

Take a look, Tal/Vyr archon MH in a GR80 (2.5.0.43355):
  • https://youtu.be/6UETzf9Hueo

MH proc rate looks the same to me as it is on live.


Can you do more than one test? Do a sample of runs on T13/70 on live, then a sample on PTR and compare how fast things are going, this is where people are noticing that something feels 'off'.

It could very well be that something is bugged, rather than deliberately changed. There already appears to be a few Archon bugs in PTR already, so I can't say it would surprise me.
Instead of insisting Cratic isn't doing enough testing on ptr, maybe you should do a bunch of testing on ptr and provide us with data. Stop telling us that something is "off" whether in this thread or the other and stop taking Cratic's work for granted. If you don't want to do testings of your own then do what I do: Keep my/your mouth shut!
02/03/2017 11:42 PMPosted by DunkeyKong
Instead of insisting Cratic isn't doing enough testing on ptr, maybe you should do a bunch of testing on ptr and provide us with data. Stop telling us that something is "off" whether in this thread or the other and stop taking Cratic's work for granted. If you don't want to do testings of your own then do what I do: Keep my/your mouth shut!


Please do grow up and do something constructive.

I don't have the time to do proper indepth isolated testing, and neither does Cratic at the moment. Does it mean I shouldn't post anything to make people aware of the possibility? Of course not - we're on a discussion board, not a safe space; yet funnily enough Cractic is the only one being reasonable and open minded here.

I'm really disappointed with quite a few of you. Sounds like you'd rather sit around and wait for other people to do everything for you (whether it is me or Cratic) and do nothing for yourselves except lambast anything that goes against what you want.

:/
I didn't suggest you to not make people aware of any potential problem, I am suggesting you to do the opposite by give us your test result but you are not going to test, are you? Because you don't know how and you know how I know?

This is what you said in the other thread
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/d3/topic/20753095940?page=2#post-22

"I am aware the proc rate chance is 15%, and that Wizard proc-coefficients have been terrible for a long time - that is why I insist that one rift testing is insufficient, because I stated myself I saw no issues until I kept playing for longer."

and this is from the first page of this thread

Paralysis applies on cast. MH damage appears to be applied on hit (based on testing, deals damage in line with spell damage ticks).

Paralysis is a static 15% chance to stun. Chance is NOT multiplied by skill proc coefficients.

Since Paralysis is decoupled from proc coefficients, this makes skills with speed coefficients > 1 more appealing. This means, AT:SD, Electrocute, and Disintegration Wave (Archon) all are prime picks
Good call on the quote, I had my proc and speed coefficients mixed up when typing that.

It still doesn't invalidate that one rift tests are simply not sufficient enough, however. And again, I told you - I don't have the time to do that now. Why would I keep silent and potentially let something get through PTR when I could incite other people to go see for themselves as well?

You can either ignore what I'm saying and go on with your day, or hop onto PTR for a few hours and compare with what you're seeing on live. It's pretty simple, and anyone can do it. The more PTR testing done the better.
"I am aware the proc rate chance is 15%, and that Wizard proc-coefficients have been terrible for a long time - that is why I insist that one rift testing is insufficient, because I stated myself I saw no issues until I kept playing for longer."

No, you didn't have speed coefficient and proc coefficient mixed up because for the longest time, wiz have been complaining about proc rate and not speed coefficient. You just thought that MH has everything to do with proc rate. You didn't even know the MH mechanics how can you say it feels "off"??
You're misunderstanding my words. I said I got them mixed up entirely when writing that, not just the word choice. I was a bit drenched and up to my ears in dealing with rude and negative responses.

Have you ever used a 60hz and 144hz monitor? You don't have to understand the mechanics of how those work to feel the difference either, so your point is pretty meaningless regardless of whether I know how it exactly works or not.

You play/do something long enough, and you'll notice when something feels different. I'm not sure why I have to even explain this.
https://memegenerator.net/instance/58811041
https://onsizzle.com/i/when-you-explained-to-her-how-she-was-wrong-but-1005781

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum