Why all the love for D2 but hate for D3?

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double post
D3 is the opposite of D2.
D3, is just a product that takes the name. D3 does not have the hard core of D2.
That little difference between d3 developers with d2.
blizz north, Did a good job in his day. D3 It's also a well-made game, being of 2012.
The lack, is that, was not faithful to his name.
The problem is that you're not a kid anymore and by today's standard Diablo 2 was NOT a good game.
First off, you're an idiot. Secondly I wasn't a "Kid" when I started playing Diablo 1 or 2, 20 years ago. In fact I have a character right now in the current ladder season of Diablo 2. You know how that's possible? Because the game was such an overwhelming success that there is still a very large number of people playing it. Not for Nostalgia, but because they like it, and it's actually a very fun and rewarding game to play.

It wasn't a DEEP game by any stretch of the imagination

I'm guessing the reason you think that is because you probably choose to follow the heard and ended up getting rushed and botted through most of the game with some uber cookie build. But the reality is, you can end game content with almost any set of skills you wish, right now. Try it. You might surprise yourself with the truth.

It's kind of hard to criticize a game that has almost as many players as it's successor 17 years after it was released. You can yell throw fits and call it nostalgia all day long but the fact is, a bunch of people still play it. That a lone speaks volumes.
05/08/2017 01:48 PMPosted by Godzilla
So, your argument is that Diablo 2 was insanely easy, so you could just do whatever you want?
No it wasn't. Just because a lot of people did stupid crap like build frozen orb sorcs, Hamerdins and got rushed to the end and did botted CS and Baal runs doesn't make it easy(maybe easy to exploit).

If you took your time and used a bit of skill and worked out some good builds you could make it through with just about anything. Not because it was easy, but because it was possible.

You keep claiming D3 is diverse but how many builds can solo GR100+? 2 maybe 3? How many builds can end game Diablo 2? Almost all of them. But it takes time and Patience, an understanding of how the game functions and a little bit of luck. It's not easy. But it IS possible.

There is way more the D2 then just adding zero's all day.
05/08/2017 05:57 PMPosted by DragonsBlood
K this one, I disagree on this. Do baal runs till 99, then its over. I do believe they need to improve on their end game though. It shouldn't just be GR runs.
You clearly haven't played the game in a VERY LONG time. There is more end game then 99.
I played since D1 came out. I'd enjoy playing D2 right now. I haven't played D3 in weeks. It's not rose tinted glasses, D3 got old way faster than D2 did.
Music and atmosphere!
D3 has no music or garbage music (besides a few tracks that are good but hardly ever played like the urzael fight or whatever his name is)
No one remembers/mentions d3 music, but everyone knows about diablo 1 and 2 music!
05/08/2017 12:58 PMPosted by Godzilla
05/08/2017 12:39 PMPosted by Hackusations
Having lots of animations with different coefficients of %weapon damage is not depth. You rush a stock WoW character to level cap, grind some starter WoW set, and all so you can hit higher HP piñatas using your WoW skill rotations.

Abilities that look different and do different things is the entire point. What do you expect when you ask for variety, a different game? Maybe work some basketball into the gameplay? Yes, it's all beating up loot pinatas with different looking skills and rotations... Diablo 3 gives you way more in depth and varied ways to do that than Diablo 2 ever did.


Except on a mechanical level the damage skills in D3 aren't doing different things and that's the point. They are doing the same thing using the same component just with different %s, costs, CDs, and geometries. It is a homogeneous design intended to create efficiency micro-management and rotations.

10,000% - 10sec CD
5,000% - 5sec CD
1,000% - 1sec CD

10,000% - 50 resource
5,000% - 25 resource
1,000% - 10 resource

300% every 2 secs for 10 secs
150% every 1 sec for 10 secs
100% every 1 sec for 15 secs

That's the kind of "depth" D3 has. It's give you different mathematical break downs of the same thing creating basically no ecology. Just hit the button that does the most DPS in the right order.
05/08/2017 07:52 PMPosted by ChaosLeech
05/08/2017 05:57 PMPosted by DragonsBlood
K this one, I disagree on this. Do baal runs till 99, then its over. I do believe they need to improve on their end game though. It shouldn't just be GR runs.
You clearly haven't played the game in a VERY LONG time. There is more end game then 99.


05/08/2017 03:54 PMPosted by DragonsBlood
I no life D2 for many years, till D3 came out.


I really did no life it, no other game on the planet matter to me. When d3 came out is when I actually started playing other games more often. So ya from 90 to 99 is actually longer then leveling from 1 to 90.... and it sucked doing it more then once.
In the end the "depth" of d3 consists of a random dev selected set beeing boosted to 3500% dmg to make everything else useless. Deepness at its best.
05/08/2017 12:58 PMPosted by Godzilla
05/08/2017 12:39 PMPosted by Hackusations
Having lots of animations with different coefficients of %weapon damage is not depth. You rush a stock WoW character to level cap, grind some starter WoW set, and all so you can hit higher HP piñatas using your WoW skill rotations.

Abilities that look different and do different things is the entire point. What do you expect when you ask for variety, a different game? Maybe work some basketball into the gameplay? Yes, it's all beating up loot pinatas with different looking skills and rotations... Diablo 3 gives you way more in depth and varied ways to do that than Diablo 2 ever did.


In Diablo 2, there was a difference between physical (block and dodge), cold (piercing), fire (High), lightning (Random), magic (very unresisted) and poison (Over time).
Then, different monsters had different resistances, as well.
Physical attacks had attack rating for chance to hit, and monsters had defense to avoid getting hit.

That is depth.
In Diablo 3, you only choose the color for your damage numbers with elements. No difference.
And monsters don't have resistances or defense either. Zero depth.

5 meaningfully different skills in a world where your skill choices have strategic depth in terms of which monsters you're good and bad at defeating > 100 skills that essentially do the same, in a world where monsters are spiky loot piñatas.

Then you could also invest different amounts of points into skills. While that aspect, the skill leveling, could've been improved a lot, each build had multiple skill investment options.

Before the three free respecs, and respec potions, you actually built your characters.
While the storyline was boring the 10th time around, actually BUILDING a character was a part of the good roleplaying experience.

While locked skillpoints were annoying when you made a mistake, and starting at level 1 wasn't as fun the 100th time...unlimited free respecs in Diablo 3 removes any and all sense of remaining identity.

All skills and runes unlocking in series, with zero choices made, caused the first playthrough to feel very strange.
Skill, Rune, Skill, Skill, Rune...
So often that you don't really have time to give most of them a chance.
And most of them are bad, anyway.
I don't get that part.
ALL skills are based only on weapon damage. And yet they're not even remotely balanced? What? Why?

And elemental type doesn't matter, except for damage color and some set bonuses.

Diablo II had build diversity, because even a hammerdin wasn't a hammerdin.
Spirit or HoZ or Exile?
Fortitude, Heart of the Oak or Rare scepter?
All in on hammers, or Smite or even Zeal hybrid?
125 or 75 faster cast rate?
Strength for gear, before gear, or with gear?
Strength, dexterity and vitality all get affected by your gear choices.
original d2 was good but offered bnot enough gameplay and content. with mods and private mod servers this game was the best thing i have ever played.
music is still the best. music connect your soul with infernal and you get very high feelings like with drugs.
05/08/2017 07:52 PMPosted by ChaosLeech
You clearly haven't played the game in a VERY LONG time.


Forgot to mention something too, I am a D2 casual player now, Every ladder reset. Man it still has the power to suck me in.

She died so early during resets, she couldn't handle the over whelming lag, there was just too many of them at once....

RIP :'( http://imgur.com/a/j3l4G

[edit]

Thumb down even when showing proof that I still currently play? :)
Anyone want to see my no life account? its SC though -.-'
because "play your way" in D3 does not exist. everybody is forced to play on-two builds that are the best for each class, e.g. ShadowImpale for DH in S10.
Diablo 1 had no customization, you basically just rolled with what you could get, trying to reach the maximum. Items were very generic and didn't provide much difference, but some held a bit more power than others.

Diablo 2 increased the customization of your character by introducing limits in stat points received, removal of caps and skill points. Items gave different powers and varied more, but the main aspect of building your character was in your creation through leveling.

D3 is completely opposite, your character means nothing, your choices for your character means nothing, your skills means nothing. Everything is based on a chance you find something. The control and concept of you designing a character you want to play and I prove that with some items are completely gone.

Secondly Diablo 2 had different interesting mechanics that made for certain combinations and powers, meanwhile D3 just has a damage scale. There's nothing else to it, numbers vs numbers and timings
Mainly 5 reasons why Diablo 3 is considered a disappointment, imho an epic let down.

- Lackluster Itemization(Blue and rare items not relevant, lack of interesting concepts, runes, white/socketable/craftable etc).
- Atmosphere, cartonish 3d textures that works for the Warcraft universe, not the Diablo universe. Arbitrary music & childish story mode, awful boss monologue etc).
- Lack of character customization, meaningful character depth, arpg.
- Poorish online social interaction, limited trading, only 4 players per game.
- No relevant pvp, i wonder how many of those millions initially copies sold were thanks to the Arena, promising pvp that never happened.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8c2r3ZNNmO8

Honorable mention: Always online requirements, singleplayer/solo and later on mods is important to many typical arpg players.

The things Diablo 3 does extremely well, mainly impressive combat/ animations has kept it alive but obviously most Diablo 2 fans can't accept this game as a worthy sequel to Diablo 2, we had much higher expectations after a decade of waiting.
05/05/2017 03:28 PMPosted by DragonsBlood
05/05/2017 02:17 PMPosted by terascque
Seriously what is the difference?


Diablo 3 isn't a true Diablo game to me and never will be, cause "The Originals" Didn't create this, fans of "The Originals" did in their own vision, if that makes sense to anyone?

Doesn't mean I am not having fun slaying monsters, but everything above is how I feel and will always feel this way about D3.

Well back to GR speed runs, ┳テ=一(O_O)


David brevik for pres!!!!
The ga

[quote="207527999141"]K this one, I disagree on this. Do baal runs till 99, then its over. I do believe they need to improve on their end game though. It shouldn't just be GR runs.
You clearly haven't played the game in a VERY LONG time. There is more end game then 99.[/quote

The game starts at 99!!!!
05/05/2017 02:51 PMPosted by Palladiamors
05/05/2017 02:43 PMPosted by RedCell
...

The legendary powers in D3 today are infinitely more interesting and engaging than the those in D2 because that change actual mechanics of skills and alter the way the player interacts with the monsters.

D2 items simply gave players more damage and defense and access to cross class skills, e.g. Paldins can get now curse things, Necros can Teleport etc. There's a veey good reason why Median XL was popular.


The difference being that D2 had more base skills that weren't dependent on items to make them into a successful 'build'. Builds were more dependent on spending skill points than on finding the right set or legendary to make them function in a 'proper' manner.

In other words, you built your class from the beginning and items you found refined that as opposed to you had to find items in order to make a build work.

That sounds like D3 Vanilla to me, which people absolutely HATED. You just can't win with this crowd.
I loved d2 because I enjoyed the skill trees a lot more. Building characters that played differently was fun and each could be treated as a project.

Admittedly I started off with the cookie cutter sorc, stacked her with mf, teleport to meph and farmed away. But as I got richer with better items it was time to bring on the zany builds because they were fun and just as viable.

Did builds like Javazon when they weren't very good and still had the lag inducing graphics. Built a chargeboltress just to fill the screen with little white bolts. Singing Barb just for lols. Also building characters for pvp, trap assassin, hammerdin, leaping barb. Whatever, literaly built so many different characters just for fun.

Agree that d2 wasn't perfect, but it improved overtime. The expansion was great and built on so many things.

But for d3 it feels like all the work has gone into it just to get it to an acceptable level. There are features from d2 that are still missing from d3.

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