Etched Sigil Proc Mechanics (AS & ICD)

Wizard
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11/18/2017 10:57 PMPosted by dolynick

Also, you don't want to just remove all ias from paragon either. That puts you at 63f for sigil procs which is much better but still not optimal. You need to have at least 2.2 ias assigned to hit the perfect 60f breakpoint (1.42857 - 1.5 aps).

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Well I still have 7% IAS on my chest (since it's ancient and augmented, I haven't replaced it yet.), so w/ no Paragon points my sheet says 1.5, so I guess I'm right on it.
Could someone confirm the correct Etched Sigil mechanics for me? I am a bit unclear on how it actually works. If there already is a conclusive testing done, please direct me to it.

Arcane Torrent, Disintegrate, and Ray of Frost also cast one of other damaging Arcane Power Spenders every second and increase damage of Arcane Power spenders by 125-150%.


My interpretation after reading this:

1) all AP spenders are buffed, with or without channeling (best case scenario). If this were the case, people will cube es over ooid for dmo frozen orb.

2) all AP spenders are buffed WHILE channeling. Even those NOT Procced by etched sigil (seems this is the case as with star pact fb)

3) only AP spenders procced by channeling/etched are buffed (worst case)

So which is it?
12/20/2017 04:09 AMPosted by dejuvenate
Could someone confirm the correct Etched Sigil mechanics for me? I am a bit unclear on how it actually works. If there already is a conclusive testing done, please direct me to it.

Arcane Torrent, Disintegrate, and Ray of Frost also cast one of other damaging Arcane Power Spenders every second and increase damage of Arcane Power spenders by 125-150%.


My interpretation after reading this:

1) all AP spenders are buffed, with or without channeling (best case scenario). If this were the case, people will cube es over ooid for dmo frozen orb.

2) all AP spenders are buffed WHILE channeling. Even those NOT Procced by etched sigil (seems this is the case as with star pact fb)

3) only AP spenders procced by channeling/etched are buffed (worst case)

So which is it?


Tested it.

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/d3/topic/20759528719?page=3#post-50

It is the second scenario.
If I cast manually a meteor when I'm channeling, It cancel the channeling of at/rof so the the manual meteor won't benefit from Etched Sigil/Deathwish ?
12/21/2017 11:15 AMPosted by Maas
If I cast manually a meteor when I'm channeling, It cancel the channeling of at/rof so the the manual meteor won't benefit from Etched Sigil/Deathwish ?


I considered the same. I think since meteor does actual damage a few moments after the cast, and you are already channeling by then, your manual meteor will be affected by Deathwish and Sigil. But, during the break you may have had other meteors (triggered by Sigil), and if this idea is true, then they lose that bonus during that break anyways. So I strongly doubt there is a good tactics to significantly increase your damage output by manually spamming meteors.
I usually try to cast one manual meteor at the end of the ice cycle on my CoE. Thats when i'm using other skills to interrupt my ROF channeling for tals. Manually casting a meteor every 3 seconds both for tals and for extra damage might just be the optimal strategy.
So just for clarification. If I have 1.64 aps while using arcane torrent and i add more attack speed through paragon I will actually lose damage?
02/28/2018 05:47 PMPosted by Kindran
So just for clarification. If I have 1.64 aps while using arcane torrent and i add more attack speed through paragon I will actually lose damage?


Yes.

You want to stay in the 12 frame breakpoint, 1.539-1.666 APS.

Being in the 11 frame breakpoint will decrease your DPS from non-cooldown Sigil-spenders by about 10% compared to the 12 frame breakpoint.

So in your case, you'll want to make sure you stay in that 1.539-1.666 APS range.

A 1.4 weapon with just the 10% IAS from paragon puts you nicely in that breakpoint. So ideally for the build I see in your profile right now you'd just swap out your RoRG for a Halo of Karini and run RoRG in the cube. The 7% IAS on your RoRG is a totally wasted affix for your build since you can hit 1.54 with paragon alone. Anything over 1.54 but less than 1.67 won't do anything at all. And being over 1.67 will actually decrease your DPS by about 10%.
03/01/2018 01:18 PMPosted by TinneOnnMuin
You want to stay in the 12 frame breakpoint, 1.539-1.666 APS.

Being in the 11 frame breakpoint will decrease your DPS from non-cooldown Sigil-spenders by about 10% compared to the 12 frame breakpoint.

So in your case, you'll want to make sure you stay in that 1.539-1.666 APS range.

A 1.4 weapon with just the 10% IAS from paragon puts you nicely in that breakpoint. So ideally for the build I see in your profile right now you'd just swap out your RoRG for a Halo of Karini and run RoRG in the cube. The 7% IAS on your RoRG is a totally wasted affix for your build since you can hit 1.54 with paragon alone. Anything over 1.54 but less than 1.67 won't do anything at all. And being over 1.67 will actually decrease your DPS by about 10%.


Cheers for this summary post. I'm usually good with my maths but the calcs behind Etched Sigil was just doing my head in (esp during the weekend when my brain just wants to relax). Will just make sure I'm between 1.539-1.666 APS.

@Kindran - my understanding is that the leg affix on equipped items will override the same item in the cube. So you may as well take Nilfurs out of the cube and put in Aquila, Magefists or Hergbrash's. Someone else might be able to confirm this.
Another question regarding RoF vs AT:SD

Does arcane torrent provide more dps than Ray of Frost regarding etched sigil and meteor procs? It's so much easier keeping aquilas up when using RoF as the main channel ability
What you need to calculate is the amount of attack speed needed to round the hit-rate into an integer.

An example for Arcane Torrent:
Weapon Attack Speed = 1.4
Arcane Torrent hit rate = 3

Formula= RoundUp( WAS * AThr ) / ( WAS * AThr ) - 1

This results 19%. between 1% to 19% increased attack speed will improves the trigger rate, more than that will decreases the trigger rate until it reaches near to the next integer.
In season 13 running a meta Tals build. No AS on my gear and reduced my paragon AS to 4%, leaving 20+ unspent points which gets me to 1.46. I now get meteor procing approx. 25% more often from Ray of Frost. It's crazy that I am a quarter stronger cause I removed paragon points.
03/01/2018 01:18 PMPosted by TinneOnnMuin
Anything over 1.54 but less than 1.67 won't do anything at all.

It will allow you to stack stricken faster. Off the top of my head, I think you can get up to 2 stricken breakpoints (up to 2 frames less in between stricken stacks) while still being within the above quoted range.

Realistically though, the extra AS roll is not worth going for if you're shooting for the above quoted AS range. Another affix will usually be more beneficial, especially with a weapon.
03/17/2018 08:11 PMPosted by Cratic
03/01/2018 01:18 PMPosted by TinneOnnMuin
Anything over 1.54 but less than 1.67 won't do anything at all.

It will allow you to stack stricken faster. Off the top of my head, I think you can get up to 2 stricken breakpoints (up to 2 frames less in between stricken stacks) while still being within the above quoted range.

Realistically though, the extra AS roll is not worth going for if you're shooting for the above quoted AS range. Another affix will usually be more beneficial, especially with a weapon.

I just got an early season primal DW that rolled with 7% AS. I want to eventually play 4 man Star Pact. The question is do I roll off the AS or Vitality for Area Damage? I dont really have much good Firebird gear so i dont know what my attack speed is going to look like once im geared up!
09/28/2018 10:23 PMPosted by mstrike
The question is do I roll off the AS or Vitality for Area Damage?


IAS on DW is an undesired stat, but it is better than vit. Doesn't matter what gears you will be obtained, rolled off vit and keep ias. It does help in generating arcane.
Aside from very self customized SP play styles, you should not find vit on any meta SP DW.
Hello. I have a question : do spenders proc by Etched Sigil proc area damage ?
Thanks !
01/13/2019 07:48 AMPosted by vofou
Hello. I have a question : do spenders proc by Etched Sigil proc area damage ?
Thanks !

No. There is a mechanic limitation where procs cannot proc other procs.

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