2.6.1 UE SoJ vs CoE math?

Demon Hunter
Hey all, can someone help me with the math please? I know before 2.6.1 the CoE was better, but can't find the math to prove it and am wondering if that still stands since each point of discipline is now worth 100% dmg instead of 40% for UE.

Assuming perfect rolls on all gear, 40% FR dmg on amy and bracers, no source of +elite dmg other than bane of the stricken (no idea if this is add. or multi.).

CoE
200% / 4 = 50% dmg increase
+50% crit dmg
+6% crit chance

vs

SoJ
20% FR /140 = 14.4%
30% eli = 30%
10 disc = ??

I'm thinking the 2 extra stats on CoE and being able to time when to use cd's still make it better, but I dislike the CoE window playstyle so if they're anywhere close I'd rather go SOJ. Thanks in advance!
I think because the COE buff is a separate multiplier, it's going to be far superior no matter how much discipline there is on the SOJ (and how much each point of discipline is worth).
10 Disc is about an 11.6% real damage increase.
The Math is exactly the same as pre-2.6.1. The math will always be the same no matter how they tweak the UE bonus %damage per discipline, because COE is a separate multiplier.

Looking at the damage multipliers:

1 discipline gives 100% or 2x
86 discipline = 87x
96 discipline = 97x
86 discipline + COE = 87*1.5 = 130.5x
@ zaknafien
Interesting but why 2 extra stats on SOJ ?
If I m correct SOJ beside the 10 max discipline have + fire dmg + elite dmg and + another stat (crit chance/crit damage...)

So the comparison should be made between:

CoE
650 Dext (or 105-210 dmg range)
+50% crit dmg
+6% crit chance
+200% / 4 = 50% dmg increase
vs

SoJ
20% FR /140 = 14.4%
30% eli = 30%
+50% crit dmg (or 6% crit or 650 cex or 105-210 dmg range)
+10 disc = 11,6% real damage

Moreover in my opinion the 50% dmg increase for CoE is not very accurate because it is almost impossible to play it perfectly in every situation (especially in higher grifts). But maybe I m wrong ;)

In any case I would be very interested to in having some correct math results
CoE might be better but sometimes I simply want to leave it out so not every build would wear it.
10/14/2017 08:58 PMPosted by Scofield
Moreover in my opinion the 50% dmg increase for CoE is not very accurate because it is almost impossible to play it perfectly in every situation (especially in higher grifts). But maybe I m wrong ;)

If you don't time it at all, It's 50% (1.5x) averaged out over the rift. If you can time it perfectly, it's 200% (3x). So in practice it'll be somewhere in between. Usually you can make some effort to time it with your element, so it's likely to be over 100%. That will easily beat SoJ.
10/17/2017 12:22 PMPosted by gooball
10/14/2017 08:58 PMPosted by Scofield
Moreover in my opinion the 50% dmg increase for CoE is not very accurate because it is almost impossible to play it perfectly in every situation (especially in higher grifts). But maybe I m wrong ;)

If you don't time it at all, It's 50% (1.5x) averaged out over the rift. If you can time it perfectly, it's 200% (3x). So in practice it'll be somewhere in between. Usually you can make some effort to time it with your element, so it's likely to be over 100%. That will easily beat SoJ.


CoE's legendary effect can never exceed 50% damage unless:

- your attacks have long cool downs, like FoK
- multi-element skills are used (cold, fire)
- you're mowing down packs in 4 seconds or less (not typical for GR push)
- you're traveling / herding (the most common displacer).

So to quantify CoE, you should subtract travel/herding from the 16 second cycle, then run your calculations. (ie. Over the full 16 second CoE cycle, i traveled for 10 seconds and attacked for 6 seconds, I was in the fire element for all 4 seconds, making my actual CoE damage bonus 133% (4/6 * 200%). The travel time will always be different, but a skilled player will maximize their CoE cycle to their gain.

There are other factors too, such as herding to gain area damage, which becomes more complicated to quantify. Then there's the ability to overlap the specific CoE element cycle with the oculus ring, which is a non-factor for SoJ.

Compared to SoJ -- without considering any of the above, and assuming the player is attacking a single elite, CoE is roughly 10-11% stronger than SoJ.

Maximizing travel vs Missing/Partial CoE cycles -> CoE still wins for damage.
Ah yes, sorry about that. It was early in the morning my time :-). Thanks for correcting me.

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