Adjust Grift Key stack to 5k please

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If all you do is play all SC and NS as it seems Phatty does from looking at his profile, you are going to get way to much of everything.

Maybe you could stop complaining and start playing a game mode with some risk attached. I never have too many of anything as a HC only player since I am constantly rebuilding dead characters over the course of the season.
I don’t really wanna comment anymore on this nonsense. But oh well.

ShadowAegis, I don’t know why you think that anything in this game that is beneficial for majority of playerbase should not be implanted because of botters. I don’t get this idiocy, I’m sorry. I don’t know what you know about botting, but I know a thing or two. Like a fact that years ago you could set fixed number of keys that bot will keep, along with xp pool management and means of getting them (search maps or do a key run), rotation at which bot will proceed, which gems to level, at what chance, which keywardens, what bounties, to which amount of mats, so on and so forth. Basically, whatever argument you wanna throw here, is pointless because there is no such thing as “slowing them down”. Even if it was, you really think that anyone that was botting had issue with bot losing a minute or 2 in an hour? Really? Lolz. But Bots are non existent in this patch, let’s start from this.

And why you think that anything game related should be balanced around cheaters is beyond me. I mean all your nonsense posts, with all these “facts” like “no need for keys when you are geared up” are pure gold. You refuse to realize that there is tons of people that purposely farm 300-500 Keys because there is several reasons for it. Some do it once a week to be able to jump onto group runs every time they log in next few days. Some farm it to push 4man/solo, which is typically heavy fishing. When I play season for example I farm keys everyday. You know why? Because there is 1.5-2 hours a day when I can play, but only solo and I need to be able to pause the game due to kids being awake. I cannot group up, and I cannot grind Greaters because I need to be focused for that. So I farm keys, this way when I’m free to play at night I can jump into group runs. But I still farm more keys than I burn a day. I’m always surplus in season, because that’s how my real life is impacting it.

I’m mean I really don’t get it. Why would you even broth this idiotic arguments here? Botting? Hoarding? Really?
03/09/2018 11:46 AMPosted by Kukiri
Maybe you could stop complaining and start playing a game mode with some risk attached.


Just wow! Maybe you could stop telling people how to play the game? Last I heard it was their choice and with the lag I've experienced over the last week any HC chars I played would be long dead. So no thanks.....
03/09/2018 11:50 AMPosted by S4v4G3
And why you think that anything game related should be balanced around cheaters is beyond me. I mean all your nonsense posts, with all these “facts” like “no need for keys when you are geared up” are pure gold.


Exactly, a game should never ever be balanced around cheaters. The moment you do that, you've given in and they've won.

I play almost entirely solo, and I still collect a easily a few hundred keys in bounty/nephalem rifting mode before switching to greater rift mode to burn (some of) them. Thinking that bots should be a limiting factor in this is beyond stupid.

03/09/2018 11:50 AMPosted by S4v4G3
I’m mean


You're not that mean :D
Is there a valid reason to still have GR keys? Regular rifts used to have keys as well but they did away with those and I don't remember anyone complaining that "just anybody could run a rift." Is there a reason we need to gate GR so that people can't run them without a key? It's not like rifts would go away, you still need to farm DBs. Even if no one ran another regular rift ever again and only ran GR would that be a problem?
03/09/2018 12:22 PMPosted by CrowRezin
Is there a valid reason to still have GR keys? Regular rifts used to have keys as well but they did away with those and I don't remember anyone complaining that "just anybody could run a rift." Is there a reason we need to gate GR so that people can't run them without a key? It's not like rifts would go away, you still need to farm DBs. Even if no one ran another regular rift ever again and only ran GR would that be a problem?


How about leaving the keys but adding DBs to the GRs? Hmmmm? That would eliminate the problem of having too many GR keys pretty quick.
How about leaving the keys but adding DBs to the GRs? Hmmmm? That would eliminate the problem of having too many GR keys pretty quick.


I like it! It solves two problems.
03/09/2018 10:16 AMPosted by apl
Your serious argument against higher stacking is bot inventory/stash management?


More than that if you haven't already seen it. Another problem is there is no reason to stack more than what you would normally be using. Okay then why would you need to have GR keys at 5,000 per slot? Most of the players here don't understand why you would need to hoard keys. I don't either, in fact I don't hoard keys. I use them as I go along. I figure out how many keys I want to earn then I do enough rifts to get that amount. Then I use them to level the gems that I want to level. That is a mixture of playing normal rifts and GRs. In order to hoard around 5,000 GR keys you would have to be playing for around 83 hours or for about 3.5 days of game time.

I just don't see how someone can play for that long without getting bored of doing normal rifts. i know that I couldn't do it

03/09/2018 10:34 AMPosted by evok
Yeah unbelievable eh? We should all play the game so as to disadvantage bots, which are currently non-existent btw.


What would be the reason to have 5,000 GR keys per stack? Why would anyone need to hoard that many. How can anyone play for more than around 83 hours doing nothing but normal rifts to aquire that many keys. I am talking about playing for around 3.5 days of game time, instead of real time.

How can anyone play for that long doing nothing but collecting keys from normal rifts. I know that I can't do it so how can it be possible for others to do it. The only thing I know that won't get bored for doing something so repeative for that long is a bot.
03/09/2018 11:50 AMPosted by S4v4G3
ShadowAegis, I don’t know why you think that anything in this game that is beneficial for majority of playerbase should not be implanted because of botters. I don’t get this idiocy, I’m sorry. I don’t know what you know about botting, but I know a thing or two. Like a fact that years ago you could set fixed number of keys that bot will keep, along with xp pool management and means of getting them (search maps or do a key run), rotation at which bot will proceed, which gems to level, at what chance, which keywardens, what bounties, to which amount of mats, so on and so forth. Basically, whatever argument you wanna throw here, is pointless because there is no such thing as “slowing them down”. Even if it was, you really think that anyone that was botting had issue with bot losing a minute or 2 in an hour? Really? Lolz. But Bots are non existent in this patch, let’s start from this.


There is zero reason, other than it would help botters to better manage their botting sessions. There is no reason to have more than 1000 keys per stack because there is no reason to hoard them. What will there be a time where those keys will translate to instant type of ancient item that will raise us to truly godly status. Where we would have a god mode for x period of time. Or will they translate to some form of currency that will allow us to get guaranteed super godl gear that would give us god status? I don't think so, that means there is no reason to hoard them. Players need to learn to use them as they aquire them.

I know that I myself couldn't play nearly long enough to aquire more than 100 keys straight without getting bored let alone some 5,000 GR keys. What other than bots can pull off playing for what would be more than 3.5 real days worth of time doing nothing but collecting GR keys.

03/09/2018 11:50 AMPosted by S4v4G3
And why you think that anything game related should be balanced around cheaters is beyond me. I mean all your nonsense posts, with all these “facts” like “no need for keys when you are geared up” are pure gold. You refuse to realize that there is tons of people that purposely farm 300-500 Keys because there is several reasons for it. Some do it once a week to be able to jump onto group runs every time they log in next few days. Some farm it to push 4man/solo, which is typically heavy fishing. When I play season for example I farm keys everyday. You know why? Because there is 1.5-2 hours a day when I can play, but only solo and I need to be able to pause the game due to kids being awake. I cannot group up, and I cannot grind Greaters because I need to be focused for that. So I farm keys, this way when I’m free to play at night I can jump into group runs. But I still farm more keys than I burn a day. I’m always surplus in season, because that’s how my real life is impacting it.


Still for grouping would be a good reason to only raise the limit to around 1,000 per stack at most, instead of 5,000. But still earning that many is too much for me. I guess if I had a family to take care of I wouldn't be playing games. But that is just me, I am not saying what you have to do at all. Just saying what I would do if I had kids to take care of.

Also fishing GRs, I am sure that if it is done right that the need for fishing can be cut down a lot. That is something that I am going to be testing out after I learn more about what it takes to get to where I am able to clear a GR95 maybe even higher than that. When I know what it takes to do that in a season along with being able to do it reliably. I will start looking into such questions as; are there ways of lowering the need for fishing through paragons? At what GR level is it manditory to fish GRs, regardless of your paragon.

Can it be possible that some are spending too much time fishing GRs to push for either a better clear time or a higher GR? So many questions to ask and so much to learn that I want to learn by just playing the game.

Exactly, a game should never ever be balanced around cheaters. The moment you do that, you've given in and they've won.

I play almost entirely solo, and I still collect a easily a few hundred keys in bounty/nephalem rifting mode before switching to greater rift mode to burn (some of) them. Thinking that bots should be a limiting factor in this is beyond stupid.


You are missing the whole point. What other than a bot could stand playing for around 3.5 game days, not real time, farming for 5,000 GR keys. Can't you see I am saying that the number per stack is way too high to make any sense at all. Heck I would have problems gaining 100 keys in a row without getting bored of playing normal GRs let alone 5,000.

Now if you were to say 1,000 that would make more sense. Because then someone could take some time to farm enough keys to go push some GRs in a group. But that would be one of the only reasons to do that.

That is unless you are saying there are those that love this game so much they can play one feature and nothing else for 3 full months wihtout getting bored. i would love to see that happen.
Shadow, a bot running rifts can collect 2k grift keys in a matter of a few days.

There's really no issue with keys and botters since they can be replenished over night.

For humans, that's not an option.

Relatively speaking if 1 key is 1 minute, 2k keys is 33 hours of play time. Thats a big deal to a human, but to a bot, that's 3 nights of running.

The key problem is a non bot problem.

Lastly, if you think it's normal to "hoard" a few hundred keys, why would anyone want 6 slots taken up when you can use 1 slot or just the mats table / UI.

Lol.
There is zero reason, other than it would help botters to better manage their botting sessions. There is no reason to have more than 1000 keys per stack because there is no reason to hoard them.


Huh? So now we are saying that 1000 is ok but 5000 is too much? What is this nonsense? How does it matter if according to your logic:

In order to hoard around 5,000 GR keys you would have to be playing for around 83 hours or for about 3.5 days of game time.


than for 1000 keys it will be circa 16 hours, and your whole point of

it would help botters to better manage their botting sessions.


is absolutely nonsensical even more that it was originally. You REALLY think that GR stacking to 5000 or indefinitely would actually make any difference on how botters are managing anything? Hey, let's put mats back to stash too, because there is no reason to keep more than 5000 of each if you play efficiently, use them as you go, who want's to farm more than 5000 anyways, right? THIS - mats in UI - was a HUGE help to botters because mats is something that they have in stupid amounts. One of dudes from my FL who was banned on a wave before mats got to UI had 6 mules, named "yellow" "white" and "blue", two of each. Where were you when mats got to UI? Why you were not fighting against it? Look on this, this is how well setup botting account looks like mats wise, and no, it is not photoshopped, 100% real:

https://imgur.com/a/gPcDq

Players need to learn to use them as they aquire them.


Sorry dude but at this point I think you don't know what you are talking about. So players who farm 400 keys in few hours or over the weekend just to be able to jump into GR's for few days in a row when they don't want to waste time for keyfarm are doing it wrong? Or when we farm 500 keys for end of season push or end of era on NS we are doing it wrong? Or when we play both, season and non season and our NS stash all of the sudden have 1000+ keys accomodated, it is somehow good? Each key is 3-5 gem levels, they are worth something, but they will be SITTING IN MY STASH before I will burn them all in graters.

I know that I myself couldn't play nearly long enough to aquire more than 100 keys straight without getting bored let alone some 5,000 GR keys. What other than bots can pull off playing for what would be more than 3.5 real days worth of time doing nothing but collecting GR keys.


Ya, you are projecting your own perspective onto here, without staying objective, that's the problem. You know what open/closer is? You know that a lot of groups are farming 100-500 A SESSION? Ever heard of cascade key farming?

03/09/2018 05:00 PMPosted by ShadowAegis
I guess if I had a family to take care of I wouldn't be playing games.


Another portion of personal bias, but I'll bite it. I make 6 digits a year after taxes, my wife doesn't have to work. I spend all the time I feel like with kids, typically last 1.5-2 hours before they go to sleep is when they "discharging" their batteries running around like maniacs, wife baths them, I make them dinner, so on and so forth. All this time I have my PC on with D3 on and I farm keys in super inefficient way (like instead of 40-50 keys an hour solo I do 30 max)

03/09/2018 05:00 PMPosted by ShadowAegis
Also fishing GRs, I am sure that if it is done right that the need for fishing can be cut down a lot.


Ignorant statement, given that is followed by

03/09/2018 05:00 PMPosted by ShadowAegis
That is something that I am going to be testing out after I learn more about what it takes to get to where I am able to clear a GR95 maybe even higher than that.


You simply have no clue what you are talking about, but you argue for a sake of arguing and you keep projecting your personal thoughts on the matter without having knowledge nor experience. I have spend hundreds of hours fishing for my personal/group bests. It cannot be really changed.

03/09/2018 05:00 PMPosted by ShadowAegis
When I know what it takes to do that in a season along with being able to do it reliably. I will start looking into such questions as; are there ways of lowering the need for fishing through paragons? At what GR level is it manditory to fish GRs, regardless of your paragon.


Yes there is a way of lowering the fishing need thru paragon. But firstly we are talking about adding paragon in hundreds at minimum (aka 1500 to 1800 or 900 to 1100) and secondly, it is fruitless because IF you really gonna push your limits you will realize that "fvck, GR XXX is possible with my mainstat, especially that I did GR YYY in xx:xx and 2nd tile was not the greatest, I didn't get power for RG, and Condo was only 2 blue packs". Paragon have diminishing returns. At some point it is better to get a piece of gear that gives you 1% more CHC or 4% more CHD than farm another 50 paragons.

It is never ending cycle, and down the road you will realize that you can push build X only on map Y filled with mob Z, when you get pylons A, B and C with RG being certain type. This is what you will fish for, and this is when you will realize that it can take 100-300-500 keys, extreme example is rank 1 world dh from few seasons ago, 1300 keys fish.

03/09/2018 05:00 PMPosted by ShadowAegis
Heck I would have problems gaining 100 keys in a row without getting bored of playing normal GRs let alone 5,000.


That's just another one of " I know i cannot, so no, it makes no sense".

Dude, you are arguing for sake of arguing. I can take every single of your posts apart and prove you point by point that you are just on the edge of trolling.
I just don't see how someone can play for that long without getting bored of doing normal rifts. i know that I couldn't do it

This is an excellent example of the logical fallacy known as the argument from incredulity, i.e. if you can't imagine how something could be true then it must be false.
More than that if you haven't already seen it.


Don't tell me you want captchas too to "prevent" botting.

Most of the players here don't understand why you would need to hoard keys.


Citation needed.
As a nonseason player I've got several stacks of GR keys from way back in the day when trials were still a thing. Hated doing trials so mostly just did T6 rifts at the time. Would have used them all up by now but I still have to do normal rifts for DBs.

Higher stack cap or moving them to the crafting mats tab would free up a bit of stash space for me.

And for the downvoting idiots: even if I was willing to risk my account by botting I'd be using it to avoid the drudgery of bounty runs, not rifts, so the "GR key stockpile = botter" argument is complete bull!@#$.
Only bots need this much stack space. Please dont encourage them.
03/10/2018 01:34 AMPosted by XxTaiPanxX
Only bots need this much stack space. Please dont encourage them.

You realise that gems stack to 5000 as did crafting materials before they were moved to the Inventory UI, right? Are you going to accuse people that have lots of gems of also being botters?
Why are there so many f*cking idiots playing this game. Use your keys or don't pick them up moron.
03/10/2018 02:46 AMPosted by Aspirine
Why are there so many f*cking idiots playing this game. Use your keys or don't pick them up moron.


I was just thinking this...except not so blunt? If people are running rifts for Deaths Breaths, and picking up the keys and hoarding them, then they actually wouldn't have their time wasted if they have to remove/sell some keys because they're not spending their time going for the keys. They are not even using them! So the keys are like white, blue, or yellow trash pieces almost, that you pick them up....just because they are there, or you mis-clicked.

Like I have a Black Mushroom (or whatever, for the Staff of Herding) in my Seasonal bag because....I picked it up because....I have no good reason...
Hoarding keys to the point where you feel it's neccesary to have 5k per stack or else your inventory will get flooded is actually quite hilarious.
But sure, I'd oblige you in your first world problem, I don't think Blizzard will though.
For some reason they have this urge to control or restrict how much we get to play our preferred content in the game.
03/10/2018 04:53 AMPosted by Alecta
Hoarding keys to the point where you feel it's neccesary to have 5k per stack or else your inventory will get flooded is actually quite hilarious.

And yet they did precisely this for crafting materials (before they were moved to the Inventory UI) compared to how they used to stack to 500, then to 1000, then to 5000.

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