Wow, the power-creep is insane. What happened?

General Discussion
Prev 1 9 10 11
"Power creep is blah blah" .


This is the most intelligent thing you've said this entire conversation. Yes, power creep is indeed 'blah blah' as you so intelligently put it. There is no reason to bloat numbers to further trivialize the difficulty in the game.

If you 'need' power creep to progress in GR, perhaps you were never meant to pass where you are now. It's OK to admit you hit you skill limit. I am stuck on a specific GR with a DMO melee build, yet I don't ask for bigger numbers because I know I should be able to get further with what is available and don't need Blizzard to hold my hand for me.
08/27/2018 06:06 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
If they actually worked at it instead of throwing damage multipliers at us they can make Diablo 3 go from a decent game to a great game. It could go from one that will be pretty much forgotten should a sequel be released to one that will be remembered for a long time, just like the other two predecessors.


D3 RoS is a great game. This game had been out for 6 years and people like you still bitter about it (for not being D2 HD) just proving that D3 will not be forgotten any soon. If D3 is doing well in Nintendo Switch in term of sales and popularity, please don't cry or throwing tantrum at here.


D3 is a good game. It’s not a great game.

Zed doesn’t give half a crap about D2 HD and neither do I. Stop being stupid and thinking everyone who doesn’t share your exact opinion is in the “D2 remaster” camp.

It’s no secret that instead of content we got power creep, and just power creeping is nothing but a short term solution to problems. Playing the newest OP class build is fun for like a week, and then you’re back to the same old issues when the novelty wears off.

08/27/2018 06:06 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
Don't get me wrong. I think it's the fact the developers aren't willing to do anything more as of this point in time that players are willing to accept whatever drivel is carelessly tossed our way. The game has issues, and at this point many players are of the opinion 'something is better than nothing', even though they're getting nothing with the power creep


Double standard. When D2 introduce synergy, you guys praised it like 2nd coming.


Double stupid. What are you even talking about here?

Love how you ignoring the fact when Blizzard buff (or change) the weaker sets to be as strong as the stronger sets


It’s quite easy to ignore something they never did. We’ve never had parity as far as the sets go. Oh, they would power creep sets, but there have always been sets that suck in comparison to others no matter what they did, and that’s still true today. Do you see anyone using Roland’s these days on a Crusader? Nope.

And yes, "something" is always better than "nothing". I am enjoying a new pet, new portrait frame, new banner, and new wing in every new season. but I guess you don't know or aware about these items because you were too blinded by the "power creep" nonsense.


More like I just don’t care about cosmetics. It’s fine if you like them, but you need to realize that not everyone cares about them like you do.
Gotta agree with Orrion here. The entire thing is spot on, especially about the inequality in sets.

As I've said before, they could have done so much more with the game if they would have looked past boosting numbers and looking for interesting ways to change gameplay up.
08/27/2018 10:43 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
Yes, I did say Diablo 2 did many things right. 'Many things right' is most definitely not 'everything right'. As I said previously, I didn't praise synergy. You even quoted me saying that. Thank you. I'll leave it below for you to read again.


See. In the end, your heart is unconsciously keep comparing D2 with D3. You condemned Grift as endgame option but I don't see a single word from you talk about how boring is D2 endgame where you keep grinding at one spot over and over. You think 1000% increment is BS in D3, but you never said a damn thing about how insane the number jumped in D2 until I brought the issue up here, and then you tried to save face by saving "You know what? I am actually dislike Synergy...ya really. Trust me".


You seem to be trying to fit everyone with 1 label here - if they don't like anything about D3 for any reason, then they must worship D2.

It doesn't really matter how much the numbers jumped in D2 because in D2 you didn't start out the expansion hitting for a couple million and end it hitting for trillions. The scale in D3 is completely different and out of control. Did D2 power creep? Sure. Did it power creep anywhere near what D3 has done? No.

08/27/2018 10:43 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
There was no reason to buffing every item in existence, which is exactly what they did. There is no reason to constantly buff things to the point that they have to add new difficulties multiple times, just to buff equipment and make them too easy as well. That kind of defeats the purpose of adding new difficulties.


For your information, they added the difficulty due to the high demands from the posters and players in this forum. Their initial plan is to capped T6 as the final difficulty. They buff items because they believe that buff the weaker is always better than nerf the strongest.


For your information.. BZZZZT, wrong. Seasons were always planned as part of Reaper, and the first Season players were doing higher than T6's equivalent Greater Rift.

And what's wrong with higher and more difficulty? Higher difficulty drop more loot, more death breath, more golds, more legendary and so on. It saves a lot of time for every players. Heck, even few of my friends who play Hardcore mode are grateful with the multiple difficulty as they can play at their own pace.


Drop rates were fine at the 1 year mark, right after they decided to keep the anniversary buff permanent. There is a point where "more of everything" becomes bad, and D3 passed it a long time ago. That's part of the reason they had to add Ancient and then Primal items - they boosted the drop rates on regular legendary items so much that they just rain from the sky. If you don't understand why that's a bad thing then we don't really have much to talk about.

17 difficulty levels is just stupid. Most of them don't get any use.

08/27/2018 10:43 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
Naked runs were possible in Diablo 2 for several classes. Items should supplement character power, not be the power.


Who is more dangerous? A drug addict with a machine gun vs a karate master?

Even in our world, item is power. So I see no issue if your character is dependant to items. Because your character is strong with items, it gives me more motivation to do bounty, upgrade rare, running rift just to gear my seasonal character up.


It's an issue because it made the game one-dimensional. If you put all the power on items, then you can't have the items be difficult to find because then players can't get to the higher difficulties. For example, back in the first year of Reaper, it was possible to literally spend over 500 hours looking for a single item. That doesn't sound like something you've ever experienced. You sound like someone who would burst all the blood vessels in your brain if that happened.

You mentioned wanting higher difficulty to get stuff done faster, but you fail to grasp that higher difficulty is meaningless unless they also increase the power and drop rates, otherwise you'll never be able to do that higher difficulty in the first place.

08/27/2018 10:43 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
You mean gear dependant. By the way I did a naked run in Skyrim as well, another RPG. Same in Baldur's Gate 2. A well designed RPG of any kind should not be 100% reliant on gear for the character power. Even pen and paper D&D follows this, I've designed a few multiclass characters that don't use armor and use basic weapons just fine.

Creativity of skills and abilities used should be the main thing. Gear should supplement those abilities.


Yes. I mean gear dependant. Sure you can do self-imposed challenge for yourself, but don't assume everyone will do that. The whole point of diablo franchise is always about item hunting and killing mob of monsters with the items you found.


Yet you don't appear to understand that having all the power on items killed the item hunt. You can't have all the power on items and then not allow players access to them. Otherwise they'll never be able to progress through all those difficulty levels you want.

08/27/2018 10:43 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
Nope. Most of D3 I'm OK with as it is. I'm fine with GR existing, though I disagree with not making an option to the game that has a challenge that actually encourages exploration or trivializes all other difficulties because of the crazy power creep to the point they are not a challenge. What options do players that don't care about leaderboards have for a challenge to their characters? The answer folks like you give is to go into GR, a game mode I have no interest in playing for reasons I've already listed. That doesn't mean I believe the option should not exist. Big difference in those facts.

Really, all you've done is call me names the last few posts with nothing substantial to even support your claims. Instead of throwing hate at me because I'm pointing out obvious flaws in the game (lack of end game options, lack of build diversity, needless power creep), maybe be more constructive in your debates instead of attempting to hurl insults. I'm finding it hard to take your posts seriously when every other sentence is you attempting to insult someone.


Do I need to repeat myself? The whole of Diablo endgame is always about trivializing the difficulty. In fact, at least D3 has the option where you can push your character to the limit with high GR. Unless you are a hardcore D2 pvper, there is literally NOTHING can challenge your D2 fully-equipped PVM character.


Again, the difference is one of degree. You seem incapable of understanding that. Yes, a well-geared character in D2 can eventually trivialize Hell. No, a well-geared character in D2 cannot hit Baal in Hell for billions of times his total health pool like I can do to Torment 13 Diablo.

D3 has a lot of exploration contents. So I don't see why would you get salty just because one (Greater Rift) of the whole D3 content doesn't allow the exploration.


Because it actually doesn't have a lot of exploration content, that's why.

In fact, D3 has worked itself into a corner where making more content is extremely difficult because they've propped up Rifts and Greater Rifts as the only activity really worth doing. Something like the werewolf island or Secheron gets explored maybe once (Secheron for the Cube), and then nobody ever goes there again except for the occasional bounty because there's nothing there at all.

And yes, I am throwing hate on you because of your whole "Power creep is blah blah" is getting annoying.


What's getting annoying in your posts is the inability to connect the dots and have a coherent understanding of the game.
08/28/2018 07:49 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
Gotta agree with Orrion here. The entire thing is spot on, especially about the inequality in sets.

As I've said before, they could have done so much more with the game if they would have looked past boosting numbers and looking for interesting ways to change gameplay up.


Basically, we're just really "rotating" top sets. Sets themselves aren't flexible enough (except a handful) to create anything new.

Legendary items themselves are pretty bad.

They created a huge problem with all those +XXX% damage to skill Y. With the creation of such (lazy) itemization, one must wait after Blizzard to create a new Legendary Power to help under-performing skills... skills that may be under-performing because... Blizzard made it so!

Blizzard hasn't even created any new Legendary items in a long while... so... yeah. They started a problem and didn't even bother to fix it.

Their whole itemization can be summarized with a single WD Skill --- Gargantuan.
-> A permanent Gargantuan (Cold) deals more damage than a timed one.

One has to wonder how that is even allowed... even after all those years.

Their itemization is unfinished, and they aren't doing anything about it. Their skill system is a mess, and they aren't doing anything about it (recently anyway). Their game balance is totally broken and they aren't doing anything about it.
08/28/2018 06:36 AMPosted by Orrion
Given how the stat system works and the fact that most items are worthless anyway, getting an actual upgrade from Primals 1.0 would have been akin to the odds of winning the lottery.

Would have pissed me off more, that’s for sure. If I get a bad Primal now, it’s “meh.” If I got a Primal that’s a 30% stat increase but I couldn’t use it? Pissed. Off.


And that is exactly what I am alluding to when I say the "rule system sucks".
Itemization clumps created within it, are more of a symptom of the problem.

I'm certainly not flipping around and supporting or anticipating an item system where if i get a strong item I can't use, I just say "meh" and that's the excitement for the day.....

I support neither.
They both suck
Because the rules that govern their creation suck
and the devs that created the rulebook suck.

Diablo 3 deserves much better, and it deserved it long ago.

Shurgosa:
This is the core of the power-creep issue, sad to say. whatever is created,(for example any version of primals...) is placed on a game consuming slider of damage, where the top stuff is desirable and worn by everyone and everything else is worthless.


08/28/2018 06:36 AMPosted by Orrion
..... That is exactly WHY people rejected Primals 1.0.

Yet you don’t think rejecting 1.0 was a good idea.


No this is incorrect.

Many people did not make the above the argument and that is NOT why they rejected primals 1.0, because many people are morons, who accepted version 2.0 after they moaned about version 1.0. Those who actively disposed of both versions? I don't think I met a single one on these forums, I'd love to do a roll call to see who there was....

I'm not condemning or supporting 1 version of primals or the other, I'm condemning the rule system that brings these things into existence.

I happily reject all versions of primals for a deeper reason than is ever exhibited in one version or the other. I also admit that technically the chance at gaining "more power" regardless of how small that chance is, is more interesting than a chance at gaining "minute slivers" of power, or no power at all, that neither of those things are acceptable at face value I'm my opinion, They are just little technicalities worthy of consideration, or discussion.

It's the exact same thing with this whole power creep argument. I'm not hoping to halt or lessen this "poisonous" growth called power creep. It should be molded into something interesting the way they do it with Hearthstone. There is more to just accepting and rejecting concepts on the basis of there plus and minus values, and that includes interestingly enough for those here in this thread trying to defend D3 yet again, for delivering values of +100 bazillion.

If a person translates primals vers 1.0, as an item system where huge rewards exist on a horrifically rare and sparse schedule of occurrence, that is a fundamental idea I am deadly interested in, however the D3 devs plopping on big piles of mainstat in their pathetic D3 rule-set through the lens of this idea does not impress me at all.

Dialing down those values and plopping them on with more frequency (version 2.0) also does not impress me. in fact it seems to me like a potentially less interesting proposition that happens more frequently.... your use of the word "Meh" certainly applies.

I'm one of those weird people who wants RPGs to have items with finite lifespans, or items that only 1 player will ever find, or a few, or items that are rare or powerful or captivating beyond words. I feel this is part of a whole game, and the quality of the remainder of the game is lifted overall, and the remainder of the game is now strong-armed to be good enough to hold players' interest, because it will be the large bulk of what they experience the way D3 items in the lower 4 tiers, and items overall in the past 6 years certainly do not.

This is a complex issue worth talking about, and the D3 devs changing a border colour and slopping on more mainstat, because that's all they are capable of delivering, and clueless fans rallying behind one large pile or a few smaller ones, is as dumb as those oceans of morons rallying behind their big binary political parties without digging into the raw fabric of what these things are actually composed of.
08/22/2018 09:00 AMPosted by Meteorblade
08/22/2018 08:35 AMPosted by Demonmonger
Players cannot even clear a GR150 which is the max GR available currently in the system, so this premise of "Power Creep" is inaccurate.

GR150 was first cleared on the Asia region servers over a month ago...
https://kr.diablo3.com/ko/rankings/era/10/rift-team-4


Pay to win mechanics are involved there, cannot even remotely compare it.

That is also a 4 player group, solo is only GR120's atm
08/28/2018 11:34 AMPosted by Demonmonger
08/22/2018 09:00 AMPosted by Meteorblade
...
GR150 was first cleared on the Asia region servers over a month ago...
https://kr.diablo3.com/ko/rankings/era/10/rift-team-4


Pay to win mechanics are involved there, cannot even remotely compare it.

That is also a 4 player group, solo is only GR120's atm


How exactly does this make power creep inaccurate?
08/28/2018 06:41 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
This is the most intelligent thing you've said this entire conversation. Yes, power creep is indeed 'blah blah' as you so intelligently put it. There is no reason to bloat numbers to further trivialize the difficulty in the game.

If you 'need' power creep to progress in GR, perhaps you were never meant to pass where you are now. It's OK to admit you hit you skill limit. I am stuck on a specific GR with a DMO melee build, yet I don't ask for bigger numbers because I know I should be able to get further with what is available and don't need Blizzard to hold my hand for me.


Then stop asking Blizzard to reduce the numbers or power creep since you don't need Blizzard hold your hand. You dislike power creep and GR? Good, now please go to play at normal mode with your overrated fun trash build and let's us alone who is enjoying playing high GR.

D3 is a good game. It’s not a great game.

Zed doesn’t give half a crap about D2 HD and neither do I. Stop being stupid and thinking everyone who doesn’t share your exact opinion is in the “D2 remaster” camp.

It’s no secret that instead of content we got power creep, and just power creeping is nothing but a short term solution to problems. Playing the newest OP class build is fun for like a week, and then you’re back to the same old issues when the novelty wears off.


Deny all you want, but you guys reek of D2 stench.

If you think power creep is nothing, then why you insist to remove it since it is pretty much DOES NOTHING to the game. Is it because you guys have number phobia or something?

08/28/2018 06:52 AMPosted by Orrion
It’s quite easy to ignore something they never did. We’ve never had parity as far as the sets go. Oh, they would power creep sets, but there have always been sets that suck in comparison to others no matter what they did, and that’s still true today. Do you see anyone using Roland’s these days on a Crusader? Nope.


I did see Multishot DH at GR100+ where MS DH in the past stuck at Lv80+.

08/28/2018 06:52 AMPosted by Orrion
More like I just don’t care about cosmetics. It’s fine if you like them, but you need to realize that not everyone cares about them like you do.


The key point is "Something" is better than "Nothing".

It doesn't really matter how much the numbers jumped in D2 because in D2 you didn't start out the expansion hitting for a couple million and end it hitting for trillions. The scale in D3 is completely different and out of control. Did D2 power creep? Sure. Did it power creep anywhere near what D3 has done? No.


Power creep is power creep. It is disgusting that you who claimed not to be D2 fanboy (LOLOLOLOL) think that D2 can get a pass because it didn't hit millions.

For your information.. BZZZZT, wrong. Seasons were always planned as part of Reaper, and the first Season players were doing higher than T6's equivalent Greater Rift.


How am I wrong again, when T6 is supposed to be the max difficulty for the whole game (minus GR) until Blizzard caved in to the demands of the players who want higher difficulty than T6?

Drop rates were fine at the 1 year mark, right after they decided to keep the anniversary buff permanent. There is a point where "more of everything" becomes bad, and D3 passed it a long time ago. That's part of the reason they had to add Ancient and then Primal items - they boosted the drop rates on regular legendary items so much that they just rain from the sky. If you don't understand why that's a bad thing then we don't really have much to talk about.

17 difficulty levels is just stupid. Most of them don't get any use.


Yet you don't have to play all those difficulties level. More options are always good even if you don't use it.

Legendary rains from the sky is a compensation for no open trading. This game rewards people who play the game and at the same time, it doesn't bind your whole life to play it.

It's an issue because it made the game one-dimensional. If you put all the power on items, then you can't have the items be difficult to find because then players can't get to the higher difficulties. For example, back in the first year of Reaper, it was possible to literally spend over 500 hours looking for a single item. That doesn't sound like something you've ever experienced. You sound like someone who would burst all the blood vessels in your brain if that happened.

You mentioned wanting higher difficulty to get stuff done faster, but you fail to grasp that higher difficulty is meaningless unless they also increase the power and drop rates, otherwise you'll never be able to do that higher difficulty in the first place.


Higher difficulty is never a meaningless for a well-equipped characters. I can farm at GR100 comfortably. Just imagine if there are a difficulty equivalent to GR100 in Bounty and Rift? Getting crafting materials from bounty, death breath and rift stone from the Nephlaem Rift, and Uber part for the Hellfire amulet would be amazing.

As for new character, grouping is always a good way to play on the high difficulty that you can't solo.

Yet you don't appear to understand that having all the power on items killed the item hunt. You can't have all the power on items and then not allow players access to them. Otherwise they'll never be able to progress through all those difficulty levels you want.


Considering that all items can be dropped at all difficulty, except Primal, and there are few legit way to farm or craft a legendary items, I think it is fine. This is not D2 or D3 classic. Your concern about it is understandable if it is D3 classic as Lv63 items were gated at Act 3 and Act 4 in the past.

Again, the difference is one of degree. You seem incapable of understanding that. Yes, a well-geared character in D2 can eventually trivialize Hell. No, a well-geared character in D2 cannot hit Baal in Hell for billions of times his total health pool like I can do to Torment 13 Diablo.


And? In the end, you still trivialized D2 Baal and the whole game. Please don't pretend that your well-equipped character will have a hard time in D2.

Because it actually doesn't have a lot of exploration content, that's why.

In fact, D3 has worked itself into a corner where making more content is extremely difficult because they've propped up Rifts and Greater Rifts as the only activity really worth doing. Something like the werewolf island or Secheron gets explored maybe once (Secheron for the Cube), and then nobody ever goes there again except for the occasional bounty because there's nothing there at all.


Those maps were made for Bounty. They served their purpose well. Don't give me the crap that you care about other D2 dungeons either. Any D2 dungeon doesn't have Lv85+ monsters will be ignored. At least D3 Bounty give you the reason to explore those maps.

What's getting annoying in your posts is the inability to connect the dots and have a coherent understanding of the game.


The game is fine. You guys are the problem here. Some of you have a number allergy and one of you feel extremely bitter because people are enjoying GR and no one wants to play fun build with him.
... You dislike power creep and GR? Good, now please go to play at normal mode with your overrated fun trash build and let's us alone who is enjoying playing high GR.


Nothing wrong with you enjoying high GR. I don't have a thing against GR in and of itself. Just remember this:

08/28/2018 06:41 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
If you 'need' power creep to progress in GR, perhaps you were never meant to pass where you are now.


If you like having power creep coming in to push you up a few GR, I guess we know how well you earned that GR rank.

As to leaving you alone in GR? Gladly. People that act like you, being arrogant, insulting and boorish, I'm quite OK with avoiding. I feel sorry for the people that end up having you join their game.
08/28/2018 11:34 AMPosted by Demonmonger
08/22/2018 09:00 AMPosted by Meteorblade
...
GR150 was first cleared on the Asia region servers over a month ago...
https://kr.diablo3.com/ko/rankings/era/10/rift-team-4


Pay to win mechanics are involved there, cannot even remotely compare it.

That is also a 4 player group, solo is only GR120's atm


Uh, no. Korean servers do not have pay to win mechanics.
08/21/2018 06:36 PMPosted by Cars
Maybe I'm just jaded, I dunno. Perhaps I've had my fill of Riftablo 3. Bleh. End of rant.


Or... playerbase is entitled and whined until they become on-par with hardcore players and refuse/threaten to play otherwise?
08/28/2018 06:41 AMPosted by Zeddicuus
This is the most intelligent thing you've said this entire conversation. Yes, power creep is indeed 'blah blah' as you so intelligently put it. There is no reason to bloat numbers to further trivialize the difficulty in the game.

If you 'need' power creep to progress in GR, perhaps you were never meant to pass where you are now. It's OK to admit you hit you skill limit. I am stuck on a specific GR with a DMO melee build, yet I don't ask for bigger numbers because I know I should be able to get further with what is available and don't need Blizzard to hold my hand for me.


Then stop asking Blizzard to reduce the numbers or power creep since you don't need Blizzard hold your hand. You dislike power creep and GR? Good, now please go to play at normal mode with your overrated fun trash build and let's us alone who is enjoying playing high GR.

D3 is a good game. It’s not a great game.

Zed doesn’t give half a crap about D2 HD and neither do I. Stop being stupid and thinking everyone who doesn’t share your exact opinion is in the “D2 remaster” camp.

It’s no secret that instead of content we got power creep, and just power creeping is nothing but a short term solution to problems. Playing the newest OP class build is fun for like a week, and then you’re back to the same old issues when the novelty wears off.


Deny all you want, but you guys reek of D2 stench.

If you think power creep is nothing, then why you insist to remove it since it is pretty much DOES NOTHING to the game. Is it because you guys have number phobia or something?

08/28/2018 06:52 AMPosted by Orrion
It’s quite easy to ignore something they never did. We’ve never had parity as far as the sets go. Oh, they would power creep sets, but there have always been sets that suck in comparison to others no matter what they did, and that’s still true today. Do you see anyone using Roland’s these days on a Crusader? Nope.


I did see Multishot DH at GR100+ where MS DH in the past stuck at Lv80+.

08/28/2018 06:52 AMPosted by Orrion
More like I just don’t care about cosmetics. It’s fine if you like them, but you need to realize that not everyone cares about them like you do.


The key point is "Something" is better than "Nothing".

It doesn't really matter how much the numbers jumped in D2 because in D2 you didn't start out the expansion hitting for a couple million and end it hitting for trillions. The scale in D3 is completely different and out of control. Did D2 power creep? Sure. Did it power creep anywhere near what D3 has done? No.


Power creep is power creep. It is disgusting that you who claimed not to be D2 fanboy (LOLOLOLOL) think that D2 can get a pass because it didn't hit millions.

For your information.. BZZZZT, wrong. Seasons were always planned as part of Reaper, and the first Season players were doing higher than T6's equivalent Greater Rift.


How am I wrong again, when T6 is supposed to be the max difficulty for the whole game (minus GR) until Blizzard caved in to the demands of the players who want higher difficulty than T6?

Drop rates were fine at the 1 year mark, right after they decided to keep the anniversary buff permanent. There is a point where "more of everything" becomes bad, and D3 passed it a long time ago. That's part of the reason they had to add Ancient and then Primal items - they boosted the drop rates on regular legendary items so much that they just rain from the sky. If you don't understand why that's a bad thing then we don't really have much to talk about.

17 difficulty levels is just stupid. Most of them don't get any use.


Yet you don't have to play all those difficulties level. More options are always good even if you don't use it.

Legendary rains from the sky is a compensation for no open trading. This game rewards people who play the game and at the same time, it doesn't bind your whole life to play it.

It's an issue because it made the game one-dimensional. If you put all the power on items, then you can't have the items be difficult to find because then players can't get to the higher difficulties. For example, back in the first year of Reaper, it was possible to literally spend over 500 hours looking for a single item. That doesn't sound like something you've ever experienced. You sound like someone who would burst all the blood vessels in your brain if that happened.

You mentioned wanting higher difficulty to get stuff done faster, but you fail to grasp that higher difficulty is meaningless unless they also increase the power and drop rates, otherwise you'll never be able to do that higher difficulty in the first place.


Higher difficulty is never a meaningless for a well-equipped characters. I can farm at GR100 comfortably. Just imagine if there are a difficulty equivalent to GR100 in Bounty and Rift? Getting crafting materials from bounty, death breath and rift stone from the Nephlaem Rift, and Uber part for the Hellfire amulet would be amazing.

As for new character, grouping is always a good way to play on the high difficulty that you can't solo.

Yet you don't appear to understand that having all the power on items killed the item hunt. You can't have all the power on items and then not allow players access to them. Otherwise they'll never be able to progress through all those difficulty levels you want.


Considering that all items can be dropped at all difficulty, except Primal, and there are few legit way to farm or craft a legendary items, I think it is fine. This is not D2 or D3 classic. Your concern about it is understandable if it is D3 classic as Lv63 items were gated at Act 3 and Act 4 in the past.

Again, the difference is one of degree. You seem incapable of understanding that. Yes, a well-geared character in D2 can eventually trivialize Hell. No, a well-geared character in D2 cannot hit Baal in Hell for billions of times his total health pool like I can do to Torment 13 Diablo.


And? In the end, you still trivialized D2 Baal and the whole game. Please don't pretend that your well-equipped character will have a hard time in D2.

Because it actually doesn't have a lot of exploration content, that's why.

In fact, D3 has worked itself into a corner where making more content is extremely difficult because they've propped up Rifts and Greater Rifts as the only activity really worth doing. Something like the werewolf island or Secheron gets explored maybe once (Secheron for the Cube), and then nobody ever goes there again except for the occasional bounty because there's nothing there at all.


Those maps were made for Bounty. They served their purpose well. Don't give me the crap that you care about other D2 dungeons either. Any D2 dungeon doesn't have Lv85+ monsters will be ignored. At least D3 Bounty give you the reason to explore those maps.

What's getting annoying in your posts is the inability to connect the dots and have a coherent understanding of the game.


The game is fine. You guys are the problem here. Some of you have a number allergy and one of you feel extremely bitter because people are enjoying GR and no one wants to play fun build with him.


Why do you keep bringing up Diablo 2? Is that seriously what you're taking away from all of this, that some people have a number allergy?
08/21/2018 08:07 PMPosted by Lobsterbash
Preach. I would have liked to have been a fly on the wall during some private conversations between developer colleagues in Blizzard while these power creep discussions were being had (and probably pushed from above). You know people coded things against their better judgment.


The coders have to do what their bosses tell them to do. They can't say we won't do it or do something entirely different. That won't cut with their bosses. They would be shown the door with a pink slip. That wouldn't help them or their family as far as being able to live.

I seen this power creep coming from a mile away like a lot of others did. It happens in a lot of games. Only not to the degree that this game has taken it. Oh well those are the brakes when you design the game the way this dev team did.

D3 is a good game. It’s not a great game.

Zed doesn’t give half a crap about D2 HD and neither do I. Stop being stupid and thinking everyone who doesn’t share your exact opinion is in the “D2 remaster” camp.

It’s no secret that instead of content we got power creep, and just power creeping is nothing but a short term solution to problems. Playing the newest OP class build is fun for like a week, and then you’re back to the same old issues when the novelty wears off.


Deny all you want, but you guys reek of D2 stench.


Yeah, good luck defending that point. Go ahead, please explain.

If you think power creep is nothing, then why you insist to remove it since it is pretty much DOES NOTHING to the game. Is it because you guys have number phobia or something?


Uh, it does a lot to the game. Power creep is why we have such an imbalance with items. Power creep is why main stat matters over everything else. Power creep is why people can now do such high GRs. It isn't your skill getting you that high - it's Blizzard adding power modifiers.

08/28/2018 06:52 AMPosted by Orrion
It’s quite easy to ignore something they never did. We’ve never had parity as far as the sets go. Oh, they would power creep sets, but there have always been sets that suck in comparison to others no matter what they did, and that’s still true today. Do you see anyone using Roland’s these days on a Crusader? Nope.


I did see Multishot DH at GR100+ where MS DH in the past stuck at Lv80+.


So, is that you agreeing with me? Thanks.

08/28/2018 06:52 AMPosted by Orrion
More like I just don’t care about cosmetics. It’s fine if you like them, but you need to realize that not everyone cares about them like you do.


The key point is "Something" is better than "Nothing".


No, it isn't, since cosmetics aren't actual content. Like I said, it's fine if you like cosmetics, but not everyone likes cosmetics.

It doesn't really matter how much the numbers jumped in D2 because in D2 you didn't start out the expansion hitting for a couple million and end it hitting for trillions. The scale in D3 is completely different and out of control. Did D2 power creep? Sure. Did it power creep anywhere near what D3 has done? No.


Power creep is power creep. It is disgusting that you who claimed not to be D2 fanboy (LOLOLOLOL) think that D2 can get a pass because it didn't hit millions.


Where did I say D2 got a pass? I just said the problem is many times WORSE in D3, not that D2 didn't have a problem. Please stop ascribing arguments to me that I didn't make.

For your information.. BZZZZT, wrong. Seasons were always planned as part of Reaper, and the first Season players were doing higher than T6's equivalent Greater Rift.


How am I wrong again, when T6 is supposed to be the max difficulty for the whole game (minus GR) until Blizzard caved in to the demands of the players who want higher difficulty than T6?


Probably because you didn't mention the "(minus GR)" part originally. You actually have to write clearly, or nobody is going to be able to discuss anything with you. You can't come in later and go "Oh, I'm not wrong because I actually mean this, despite not ever mentioning it."

Further, it's kind of odd that you're arguing about this, yet defending power creep. Power creep is the reason T6 didn't stay the top difficulty.

Drop rates were fine at the 1 year mark, right after they decided to keep the anniversary buff permanent. There is a point where "more of everything" becomes bad, and D3 passed it a long time ago. That's part of the reason they had to add Ancient and then Primal items - they boosted the drop rates on regular legendary items so much that they just rain from the sky. If you don't understand why that's a bad thing then we don't really have much to talk about.

17 difficulty levels is just stupid. Most of them don't get any use.


Yet you don't have to play all those difficulties level. More options are always good even if you don't use it.


No, more isn't always better. If you don't believe me, go eat a gallon of ice cream all at once. I guarantee that you won't think a gallon is better than the 2 scoops you usually have. "More is better" is a child's argument, used when they aren't old enough to know better. You know better. Act like it.

And it's less that you don't have to play those difficulty levels and more that the game's power system means you can skip them outright. That's not a sign of good design.

Legendary rains from the sky is a compensation for no open trading. This game rewards people who play the game and at the same time, it doesn't bind your whole life to play it.


Yes, and it was the absolute wrong way to compensate. That's why the whole item hunt now is just finding better versions of what you already have. There's nothing interesting about it at all.

It's an issue because it made the game one-dimensional. If you put all the power on items, then you can't have the items be difficult to find because then players can't get to the higher difficulties. For example, back in the first year of Reaper, it was possible to literally spend over 500 hours looking for a single item. That doesn't sound like something you've ever experienced. You sound like someone who would burst all the blood vessels in your brain if that happened.

You mentioned wanting higher difficulty to get stuff done faster, but you fail to grasp that higher difficulty is meaningless unless they also increase the power and drop rates, otherwise you'll never be able to do that higher difficulty in the first place.


Higher difficulty is never a meaningless for a well-equipped characters. I can farm at GR100 comfortably. Just imagine if there are a difficulty equivalent to GR100 in Bounty and Rift? Getting crafting materials from bounty, death breath and rift stone from the Nephlaem Rift, and Uber part for the Hellfire amulet would be amazing.


You can only farm at GR100 because Blizzard boosted your items to that level. It's not because you're well geared. You aren't doing anything different now than people were during Season 1 when GR40 was considered high. You aren't any more well geared than they were. Your items have just been boosted and your Paragon level is higher.

Having exponentially increasing rewards from regular Rifts and Bounties wouldn't be good. It would just mean you're done with the game that much faster.

Yet you don't appear to understand that having all the power on items killed the item hunt. You can't have all the power on items and then not allow players access to them. Otherwise they'll never be able to progress through all those difficulty levels you want.


Considering that all items can be dropped at all difficulty, except Primal, and there are few legit way to farm or craft a legendary items, I think it is fine. This is not D2 or D3 classic. Your concern about it is understandable if it is D3 classic as Lv63 items were gated at Act 3 and Act 4 in the past.


Items dropping at all difficulty has nothing to do with my argument that having 99% of power on items killed the item hunt.

Again, the difference is one of degree. You seem incapable of understanding that. Yes, a well-geared character in D2 can eventually trivialize Hell. No, a well-geared character in D2 cannot hit Baal in Hell for billions of times his total health pool like I can do to Torment 13 Diablo.


And? In the end, you still trivialized D2 Baal and the whole game. Please don't pretend that your well-equipped character will have a hard time in D2.


And it's absurd in D3. They went the wrong direction - they should have capped difficulty at a reasonable level and then worked on giving us things to do and balancing things so we had diversity. Instead they just gave us the same things to do over and over again, and constantly juggled which builds were able to play at the top.

Because it actually doesn't have a lot of exploration content, that's why.

In fact, D3 has worked itself into a corner where making more content is extremely difficult because they've propped up Rifts and Greater Rifts as the only activity really worth doing. Something like the werewolf island or Secheron gets explored maybe once (Secheron for the Cube), and then nobody ever goes there again except for the occasional bounty because there's nothing there at all.


Those maps were made for Bounty. They served their purpose well. Don't give me the crap that you care about other D2 dungeons either. Any D2 dungeon doesn't have Lv85+ monsters will be ignored. At least D3 Bounty give you the reason to explore those maps.


What does it matter if D2 also got it wrong? D3 was 12 years later and should have been an improvement. It shouldn't be equally or even more wrong.

A game that did it right, I think, is Grim Dawn.

What's getting annoying in your posts is the inability to connect the dots and have a coherent understanding of the game.


The game is fine. You guys are the problem here. Some of you have a number allergy and one of you feel extremely bitter because people are enjoying GR and no one wants to play fun build with him.


It's odd how much you say I care about D2 given that I've only mentioned it once. Every other mention has been you. Are you sure you're not the one with the allergy?

As far as the game being fine.. I DID say it was a good game. It's just not a great game. It's too much of a departure from RPGs in general and doesn't have enough variety to keep me interested long-term anymore.
08/21/2018 06:36 PMPosted by Cars

Grifts in the 50s used to be dangerous as hell. Then the 70s. Now there are people hitting the grift cap.


Didn't realize you played Diablo in the 50's or 70's xD
no jk, Agreed with your statement, it's just to super impose the power of the nephalem I think.
But except for the unique powers for legendaries which you only use with kanai's cube, there are few reasons to have them.
Funny how people are still defending D3 as if it was a great game. Even Blizzard doesn't think so. If they did, they would have found a way to monetize it and put out one or two more expansions already.

They've seen the numbers. That's why a new Diablo game is in the works - and it's pretty obvious it will be far from the experience we've had with D3.

I mean, take a look at the Blizzcon infographic. The only Diablo related statistic was about Necro skill combos.
Power creep is a very easy and tantalizing thing for developers to do in order to add to game length, but it's terrible for the game's long term health. When developers resort to power creep, it's because they are either out of ideas and are phoning it in, or they just don't see much point in keeping the game going much longer and are just pulling the last resort lever.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum