LON HoTA 2.6.4

Barbarian
Hello everybody !

When I read the final patch notes with the 750% LON bonus, I wanted to try a HoTA version.

I worked out the following configuration : https://www.d3planner.com/465968979

    Little comparison with Immortal King set

  • LON : 9750% / IK : 4000%
  • LON : 60% fire damage / IK : 40% (60% with RoRG)
  • LON : Wrath of the Berserker 79% uptime / IK 100% uptime
  • LON : no Convention of element / IK : have it
  • LON : no Endless walk = 0% / Ik have it = 100% more damage
  • LON : no Istvans's paired blades = 0% AS + armor + damage / IK have it = 30% more


How do you think the LON HoTA is doing against the IK?
In the past when I did LoN HotA I did something similar but with some changes to your configuration:

Wear Cindercoat
Wear PoC
Cube AQ
Drop Envious Blade for Axe of Sankis (In-Geom for low tier)
Cube Zodiac Ring
Lose CDR on Amulet

Between LoN bonus, AQ and IP that's enough defense for a bit before needing to go the BoM route. The challenge for LoN HotA was typically not enough damage; eventually you may need to switch to BoM but zodiac will give you 100% uptime on WotB.

Also, Overpower/Crushing advance is fantastic defensively vs physical and if you're disciplined to not spam it to eat zodiac procs you could drop Demo Shout. If you're doing speeds with In-Geom the LoN bonus makes the damage not worthless (Saffron Wrap, RIP) and you can spam the hell out of it while charging without cooldown from pack to pack.

All that being said, IK will be superior but it will be interesting to compare the two in practice.
Yesterday, I did a run on the live no season with LON HoTA setup. I started to take a lot of damage in GR 90. I had Ignore Pain / Aquiline. The LON defense bonus does not compensate for the bonus of Band of Might. Maybe I didn't have enough sustain.

I built my configuration with daggers for attack speed. We lose a lot of attack speed without Istvan's paired blades and the need of high CDR for this build.
12/19/2018 09:29 AMPosted by Arnosega
Maybe I didn't have enough sustain.


It's overkill but when I run HotA with LoN I try to get LoH on both weapons (typically 10% CDR/LoH) and on bracers and it helps a ton. Also give Overpower a try; it's very underrated but the 35% reduction vs physical is huge.

You can also forgo using Cindercoat and wear/cube PoC/String of Ears and then drop Brawler for Superstition to help with ranged damage.
We need Nubtro to number crunch this, I would so love for this to be a thing!
https://www.d3planner.com/349801569

I think mine would look more like this
Pig sticker and Sankis is not as good as Rogue/Slander but it is not a huge step backwards. Endless walk essentially takes the IK bonus to 8k, throw in CoE your at 12k.

IK will win by a lot.
Ik is 4000x2x1.3 that itself does more then lon. Add coe. Perm wotb.

You don’t get the dr you do from Ik in Lon.

It’s meh.

It will be fun to play around with that’s for sure.
CoE & Endless Walk put IK: HOTA ahead by a good bit unfortunately imo.
How high are you guys taking this on a push? I can do 90 with either In-geom-sticker or Sunkeeper-sticker, likes that elite damage.
There should be some mid 90's for sure, some of you guys are better skilled with higher gems and augs than I am..
Ok, after playing with the numbers more I think it is going to be closer than I initially thought.

I used the d3planner to help me out with some relative numbers. At first I was just trying to maximize the dps for the IK set and then for the LoN set and not worry too much about the defense. Then I added in some defense to see what I came up with.

To really get over GR100 you need 3 items of 50% damage reduction. For the LoN set I used the LoN set, IP ignorance is bliss and Aquilas (cube). Most the stuff is what you expect with PoC, Magefist, Cindercoat, Hellfire, Swamp waders, Leorics. For weapons Sankis doesn't appear to be as good as Sunkeeper. The main reason for this is you already have 5 pieces of gear that will give 20% to fire damage (gloves, legs, chest, bracer, amulet) Going to a 6th doesn't add as much as the 30% elite damage. Secondly if you want to guarantee 100% crit you can add weapon master because maces give you an extra 5% crit to put you at a 102%.

With zodiac in the cube you get a 100% up time on IP and WotB which is much better than BoM for damage and CoE for defense. Might have to play with the passives/skills for fury generation I didn't play with that on the sims.

Comparing the damage on a non elite, non human/beast IK HotA does 3x damage with the old multipliers.

With the new multipliers LoN is increase 2.8 times more than IK which makes the damage fairly close. If the mob is an elite I had 38% damage increase on the LoN setup and nothing for the IK. Then you get another 30% if it is human or beast with pig sticker.

IK still has the advantage on defense with BoM, Together as One and IP 50% of the time using the ignorance is bliss rune.

It will definitely be interesting to play with in the next patch if the d3 planner is doing relative damage correctly.
12/19/2018 03:16 PMPosted by Blackarrows
How high are you guys taking this on a push? I can do 90 with either In-geom-sticker or Sunkeeper-sticker, likes that elite damage.
There should be some mid 90's for sure, some of you guys are better skilled with higher gems and augs than I am..


I just played with LoN HotA for the first time this morning. I threw some stuff together and completed GR90 in 12 minutes on the first try not good maps and most of my gear isn't augmented. Gems were trapped, eso and stricken. I did run with 18k Stength but the only thing I have for healing is LPFS on my belt. If you try an optimize things and go full augment I should be around 21k str. I would say at the bare minimum I could get a 95 clear.

On the next patch with 7.5x the damage? I would guess 110 will be within reach for me. Still think IK HotA will be better after the patch.
My estimation is that incoming damage will be your downfall in high tiers.

With all these damage buffs, people seem to oversee the fact that there are no new nor improved mitigation sources. While monster damage is increased by only 2.338% per level, you will feel the 6-10 GR jump for most builds and might struggle with survivability.

10 GR levels = 26% more incoming damage, which requires another 20.635% mitigation source compared to before.

LoN buff is roughly 13 GRs worth of monster health, which is 35% more damage taken. That requires a 26% mitigation source.

Good luck and have fun.
12/20/2018 01:51 PMPosted by Nubtro
My estimation is that incoming damage will be your downfall in high tiers.

With all these damage buffs, people seem to oversee the fact that there are no new nor improved mitigation sources. While monster damage is increased by only 2.338% per level, you will feel the 6-10 GR jump for most builds and might struggle with survivability.

10 GR levels = 26% more incoming damage, which requires another 20.635% mitigation source compared to before.

LoN buff is roughly 13 GRs worth of monster health, which is 35% more damage taken. That requires a 26% mitigation source.

Good luck and have fun.


Completely agree, which is why I am starting to play with the build now to see if there is some ways to improve damage mitigation.

Cleared 92 with duel daggers to see if that was viable and did it on my second try. Started in on 94 and it looked like my defense was a bit thin. I added Call of the Ancients, Fury of the Ancients, an remorseless. Very little down time on the ancients and a lot more defense, healing and fury. I just missed 94 twice so I am sure it is doable.
12/20/2018 08:22 PMPosted by Felix
Completely agree, which is why I am starting to play with the build now to see if there is some ways to improve damage mitigation.


Just put BoM in cube and go with it.

As a side note to everybody,

As past experience shows, the more you guys keep posting about a potential LON HOTA build capable of clearing high grifts, we will see more of a nerf hammer to LoN as a set just caused by a HOTA build variety instead of solutions to your logical problem reports.

Please stop giving any feedback to them. Do your trials and tests and keep it to yourselves.

F.
12/20/2018 11:41 PMPosted by Prokahn
As past experience shows, the more you guys keep posting about a potential LON HOTA build capable of clearing high grifts, we will see more of a nerf hammer to LoN as a set just caused by a HOTA build variety instead of solutions to your logical problem reports.

Past pushes by certain players has impacted changes, negative for most all cases, but even with the 750% LoN boost, it still won't even make the LB's.
Now it takes a 100 at around 12 min to even make the bottom of the top 1000. the 750% increase, with all the set changes, will not make one whit bit of difference, It still won't make the leaderboards. Season or NS...
Did a 100-11:17, first key. The build will still be 15-20 lvls below IK HotA, but it will do 100's if someone enjoys getting away from the standard set builds, go for it..
https://www.d3planner.com/566032909 this version is better
02/20/2019 02:26 AMPosted by TheLegend
https://www.d3planner.com/566032909 this version is better

There will be several versions depending on gear drops and rolls. You have to use what you have.
How high have you pushed this, any video?
Planner builds are not always as good in game as they look on paper, fyi...

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