Make LON 100% Setless like season 17 will be!

General Discussion
LONs original design was to open up build diversity by removing the ability to wear sets, yet LON itself is also a set??

Oce season 17 starts some classes will have a chance to experience LON without the rings and enjoy LON as the true endgame setup that everyone originally wanted LON to be and after the season ends LON will once again loose those two slots and make it less fun/diverse. So insteadd, why not simply turn LON into the true end game set that works equally for all classes?

Instead of LON being a ring set blizzard should move it a new passive (or change the worst one from each class) to work something like this.

LON passive

When equipped with this passive your damage dealt is equal to your highest set bonus global multipler (or blizzard can customize this number per class) and your damage taken is reduced by 52%. Your damage bonus and damage reduction are reduced by 7.69% for every normal item you have equipped and 100% disabled with a set item equipped


If blizzard feels like this is to easy to obtain and really wants LOn to be the true end game of D3 then simply make the passive locked until paragaon 800.
When equipped with this passive you damage dealt is equal to your highest set bonuses and you damage taken is reduced by 52%.


Lovely, the way this reads we could just double stack our highest bonus damage set with the same equipped set. I like power creep; a lot but this may actually be more harmful than helpful, the way its worded.

04/19/2019 05:43 PMPosted by Jumpman
would allow every class go participate in this season and open up so many different builds for all classes that we never knew existed.


Every class can already participate, or did you mean utilize the LON bonus equally? Another point; if you were able to just double stack your highest set bonus you'd be forced into one setup for GR's. Not really a good step in the direction of build exploration.

I'd suggest keeping the wording on the set bonus the same on the passive and just applying it to every character upon reaching level 70. The power is gated behind the gear anyway which is more or less how the game works with everything else so it may flow better.

Just some thoughts.
04/19/2019 05:51 PMPosted by jay
When equipped with this passive you damage dealt is equal to your highest set bonuses and you damage taken is reduced by 52%.


Lovely, the way this reads we could just double stack our highest bonus damage set with the same equipped set. I like power creep; a lot but this may actually be more harmful than helpful, the way its worded.

04/19/2019 05:43 PMPosted by Jumpman
would allow every class go participate in this season and open up so many different builds for all classes that we never knew existed.


Every class can already participate, or did you mean utilize the LON bonus equally? Another point; if you were able to just double stack your highest set bonus you'd be forced into one setup for GR's. Not really a good step in the direction of build exploration. I'd suggest keeping the wording on the set bonus the same on the passive and just applying it to every character upon reaching level 70. The power is gated behind the gear anyway which is more or less how the game works with everything else so it may flow better.

Just some thoughts.


Seriously? You read my post and took it 100% literally LOL. Obviously my post is about moving LON to a passive and not about letting it double stack with sets. I just took the lon words and changed it some to fit in the passive.

Yes all classes can participate with LOn, but that doesnt make it worth it or equal for all classes. For example as a demon hunter you have to choose between 10,000% damage with LON or a set that gives 60,000% damage! That makes lon worthless as a demon hunter and I'm sure there are other classes where LON I just as worthless.
04/19/2019 05:59 PMPosted by Jumpman
For example as a demon hunter you have to choose between 10,000% damage with LON or a set that gives 60,000% damage!


Right, but you're sort of comparing apples to oranges, and the 60k gain is to Impale, it isn't a general multiplier like LON. The classes that use LON best do so because of the strength of the supporting items. If certain support items were buffed and LON buffed it would solve the set disparity issue that you're pointing out with DH.
04/19/2019 05:59 PMPosted by Jumpman
Seriously? You read my post and took it 100% literally LOL.


How else should we take it?

04/19/2019 05:59 PMPosted by Jumpman
Obviously my post is about moving LON to a passive and not about letting it double stack with sets.


Passive effects will stack with Set bonuses multiplicatively there's no exception for it so far. I think you never stated otherwise either in your post. If you think coding that won't bother coders and should be done, please take a gander at it by trying to code something similar at github and share here.

04/19/2019 05:59 PMPosted by Jumpman
For example as a demon hunter you have to choose between 10,000% damage with LON or a set that gives 60,000% damage!


If you're mentioning Shadow Set it's 60k-75k% "weapon" damage bonus to Impale, comparing them it's a 10x multiplier only while 10000% damage bonus is a multiplier of 100x on exact values.
04/19/2019 05:43 PMPosted by Jumpman
LON passive

When equipped with this passive your damage dealt is equal to your highest set bonuses and you damage taken is reduced by 52%. Your damage bonus and damage reduction are reduced by 7.69% for every normal item you have equipped and by 100% for every set item equipped.
The damage is equal to your highest set bonuses, but then reduced by 100% for every set piece you have equipped.

So if I have a full six-piece set equipped, my damage will be the damage bonus of the set, reduced by 600% because I'm wearing the set.

Did you even think about this before you wrote it?

Question: after my damage reduced to zero by the first 100% damage reduction, does that mean I'm actually healing the monsters by 500% of my damage when I hit them?
04/19/2019 06:11 PMPosted by jay
04/19/2019 05:59 PMPosted by Jumpman
For example as a demon hunter you have to choose between 10,000% damage with LON or a set that gives 60,000% damage!


Right, but you're sort of comparing apples to oranges, and the 60k gain is to Impale, it isn't a general multiplier like LON. The classes that use LON best do so because of the strength of the supporting items. If certain support items were buffed and LON buffed it would solve the set disparity issue that you're pointing out with DH.


That's the point, the supporting items for certain classes have high numbers because of how it was balanced. I stead of messing with all that you simply need to make LON match your highest set damage multiplier.

As for the DH I wasnt talking about just one set. All of them are bad compared to LON and even worse when you cant use F+R or EW.

UE:
86x 350% = 30,100% >> 9750%
+ F+R / EW (that LON doesnt get)

M6:
5x 12,000% = 60,000% >>> 9750%
+ F+R / EW (that LON doesnt get)

N6
2x 14,000% = 28,000% (N4 * N6) >> 9750%
+ EW (that LON doesnt get)
04/19/2019 06:24 PMPosted by Jumpman
I stead of messing with all that you simply need to make LON match your highest set damage multiplier.


Code something similar yourself and if you think it worths the effort share the code here? Passive effects stack with Sets unless stated otherwise, you're talking about giving a free upgrade equal to old LoN values at the cost of one passive.

04/19/2019 06:24 PMPosted by Jumpman
All of them are bad compared to LON and even worse when you cant use F+R or EW.


Those said Sets can not abuse damage/skill procs like LoN to double their damage output. A general damage increase is actually more than you deserve for some setups.
04/19/2019 06:28 PMPosted by naksiloth
04/19/2019 06:24 PMPosted by Jumpman
I stead of messing with all that you simply need to make LON match your highest set damage multiplier.


Code something similar yourself and if you think it worths the effort share the code here? Passive effects stack with Sets unless stated otherwise, you're talking about giving a free upgrade equal to old LoN values at the cost of one passive.

04/19/2019 06:24 PMPosted by Jumpman
All of them are bad compared to LON and even worse when you cant use F+R or EW.


Those said Sets can not abuse damage/skill procs like LoN to double their damage output. A general damage increase is actually more than you deserve for some setups.


The devs are paid to code that is their job. If they like the idea and want to change it or improve it they can, this is their game. This change would vastly improve the endgame and make it more equal for all because right now LON is either worthless for some classes or OP to others classes because of the flat damage increase that works for all classes.

A loss of a passive is far better than a loss of two ring slots especially since your already loosing EW or focus and restraint. And FYI You can always gain that passive back with a hellfire amulet. This change would open up many new builds just like how the seasonal 17 buff will accomplish by giving us LON without the need to wear the two set rings especially since the whole point of LON is not wearing sets which should also include this one. Once the season ends everyone who loved LON during the season will hate it since they will now loose two ring slots. It's no different than everyone feeling sad about loosing the extra item from the Ring of royal grandeur buff.

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