Disgust and Disbelief

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if their servers cant handle 5 simple stashes... don't expect anything better.

forget any new content or any updates to current things like getting dynamic tooltips.

this also explains exactly why GR150 is the max.

there has been RELEVANT suggestions for years and none of them implemented, now I know why, it has nothing to do with how valid they are, its all because the game actually cant handle anything more, because Blizzard have shelved the game and work on other titles or something.

I mean like seriously....

a dev team not being able to add stash tabs because it would cause lag/delays... you just know there is no hope for that game.
04/13/2019 08:27 AMPosted by Meteorblade
04/13/2019 08:20 AMPosted by Orrion
Don't see why anyone was expecting it to be different this time around

We were expecting it to be different because Blizzard said it would be different.

This x1000.

Blizzard even said it twice and didn't even mention stash tabs when they described seasons (an independent confirmation of their two prior statements), Read the initial post. I highlighted relevant sections for those who can not read more than a few sentences.
04/13/2019 08:38 AMPosted by Shurgosa
04/13/2019 08:27 AMPosted by Meteorblade
...
We were expecting it to be different because Blizzard said it would be different.


Blizzard says plenty about Diablo 3. It's best just assume the absolute worst outcome each time.

Many players have happily chugged though umpteen seasons doing the same mindless crap over and over and over again, so this is just more more more of what people have happily accepted up until now....


this should NEVER be the case when someone cares about something they look after it.

if they cant be honest with their communication and then try backtrack their own words....

what does that say about them?
04/12/2019 10:08 PMPosted by MicroRNA
Although Blizzard has claimed poor communication, their behavior is far worse in my opinion. I can not reconcile the recent comment quoted below with the original patch statement with a Developer Comment also shown underneath. Simply stated, poor communication is one thing, but mutually incompatible statements are disingenuous. For the initial patch notes, they clearly refer to the 5 tabs being available with the patch as highlighted in the QoL section and the corresponding developer's comment. In the season section, they state absolutely NOTHING about stash tabs being a seasonal reward. I call horse hockey on Blizzard.

Huh? You actually considered PTR a finished product. PTR is much like BETA software and is subject to change. Why test if set in stone? Same applies to what you read (patch notes since D3 2012 release). Name a single national/multinational company that has NEVER changed their business plan --their people, product, and process. To think otherwise is …. So you still wonder why Blizzard doesn't communicate much?
I wonder who else noticed the glaring omission in the blue post. Although they were quick to point out that extra stash space caused technical issues for consoles, no such statement was made about PC. Certainly, if there was a technical issue for PCs, it would have been likewise noted. Just saying...

I wonder if the PTR bug sticky was the first PR attempt to lay the foundation/explanation of gating stash tabs, but when no one reported any crash there (irrespective of the root cause), they knew saying it was a technical issue on PC would make them look like a laughing stock or alternatively, incompetent for not being able to fix their code. Either way it was a bad look so they came up with the whole intent/clarification thing, hoping that no one would highlight the incoherence with their initial Patch note.
04/13/2019 08:47 AMPosted by Speedy
04/13/2019 08:38 AMPosted by Shurgosa
...

Blizzard says plenty about Diablo 3. It's best just assume the absolute worst outcome each time.

Many players have happily chugged though umpteen seasons doing the same mindless crap over and over and over again, so this is just more more more of what people have happily accepted up until now....


this should NEVER be the case when someone cares about something they look after it.

if they cant be honest with their communication and then try backtrack their own words....

what does that say about them?


That's correct, this should NEVER be the case when someone cares about something.

unfortunately they don't care and as a result it ALWAYS is....

If they cared about Diablo, every aspect of it would be halfway interesting and engaging, along with this one....

Instead everything they touch is regurgitated and flavourless and feels like a slot machine for 5 year olds. Grinding away for stash tabs for months and years is just par for the course around here.....and that is sad.

It's exactly as sad as vomiting the next Diablo game onto a cellphone, because it is a horrific sadness of ideals that delivers this sad production.

farming away for stash tabs is not the problem, it is a symptom of a problem.
04/13/2019 09:08 AMPosted by MicroRNA
I wonder who else noticed the glaring omission in the blue post. Although they were quick to point out that extra stash space caused technical issues for consoles, no such statement was made about PC. Certainly, if there was a technical issue for PCs, it would have been likewise noted. Just saying...

I wonder if the PTR bug sticky was the first PR attempt to lay the foundation/explanation of gating stash tabs, but when no one reported any crash there (irrespective of the root cause), they knew saying it was a technical issue on PC would make them look like a laughing stock or alternatively, incompetent for not being able to fix their code. Either way it was a bad look so they came up with the whole intent/clarification thing, hoping that no one would highlight the incoherence with their initial Patch note.


There was more than one lie in that PTR bug post that I called out, the claim that Digital Deluxe gave stash tabs. IMO the whole thing was fiction and a smoke screen. There were no player crash reports in that thread, the PTR bug and discussion forums, the tech support forum or the regular bug report forum (which sadly got more PTR posts than the PTR bug forum...).

The fact there was silence when that was called out and when asking for clarifications on what specific things to test when the rest of the claimed conditions were met pretty much proves the "issue" was fiction.
04/13/2019 09:08 AMPosted by MicroRNA
I wonder who else noticed the glaring omission in the blue post. Although they were quick to point out that extra stash space caused technical issues for consoles, no such statement was made about PC. Certainly, if there was a technical issue for PCs, it would have been likewise noted. Just saying...

I wonder if the PTR bug sticky was the first PR attempt to lay the foundation/explanation of gating stash tabs, but when no one reported any crash there (irrespective of the root cause), they knew saying it was a technical issue on PC would make them look like a laughing stock or alternatively, incompetent for not being able to fix their code. Either way it was a bad look so they came up with the whole intent/clarification thing, hoping that no one would highlight the incoherence with their initial Patch note.


Sad part is, this is probably scarily accurate.
04/13/2019 08:47 AMPosted by SilverFox
Huh? You actually considered PTR a finished product. PTR is much like BETA software and is subject to change. Why test if set in stone? Same applies to what you read (patch notes since D3 2012 release). Name a single national/multinational company that has NEVER changed their business plan --their people, product, and process. To think otherwise is …. So you still wonder why Blizzard doesn't communicate much?


No one considered the PTR a finished product. If you take Blizzard's blue post as factual, then:
1) It was always their intent to have stash tabs gated
2) They acknowledge that their intent was not communicated effectively in the PTR Patch notes

Don't white knight this issue. Blizzard already admitted and apologized that they screwed up. Do not blame the players for believing what Blizzard writes. Do you honestly think it was some rogue employee who put out the original patch notes without them being edited and approved by superior(s). Frankly, I have difficulty in believing what they say with everything that has transpired over the years.

I have serious issues about their so-called effort at communicating better. If I see clear hypocrisy and lack of integrity, I will call it out.
a lot of crying
over nothing
04/13/2019 09:08 AMPosted by MicroRNA
I wonder if the PTR bug sticky was the first PR attempt to lay the foundation/explanation of gating stash tabs,


You know I called her out on that Sticky in the PTR Bug Forum, funny though she never responded :-o, here is that post:
"I have to call it, it is a lie.
Is there is another game out there that crashes because of a few Item Stash's? I don't think so. Most games I have seen welcome people that want extra Stash space, and will offer them one way or another.
I think, as others have stated on the Forums, that this is really a numbers issue and is actually related to Monthly Active User (MAU) and that is a key performance indicator (KPI) often used by online games to show the stock holders the game is still viable and not a game performance issue at all.
So cut the crap and tell the players what the real issue is!"

I believe you are right microRNA.
https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/8z4gaz/how_many_stash_tabs_do_you_use/
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1328382/page/1

Look at those numbers. Sure, this is only a small sampling in a totally different game, but it seems on average people have around 20-40 stash tabs (I think I have at least 20, maaaybe 30, not counting special tabs for currency, maps etc).

I have never, ever heard of the PoE servers slowing down or crashing under that 'weight'. And their infastructure is far inferior to Blizzards. In fact, Chris Wilson has said they can manage 65,000 tabs per person before issues occur.

Obviously, theres a difference between paid for tabs and free tabs, but this should show you how much wiggle room there is here.

Blizzard wants you in seasons to show the investors. Thats why. Thats the reason.
04/13/2019 08:27 AMPosted by Meteorblade
04/13/2019 08:20 AMPosted by Orrion
Don't see why anyone was expecting it to be different this time around

We were expecting it to be different because Blizzard said it would be different.


You're smarter than that.

Since when have you taken the first version of the patch notes to hit the scene as the final version, anyway?
04/13/2019 10:33 AMPosted by Orrion
You're smarter than that.Since when have you taken the first version of the patch notes to hit the scene as the final version, anyway?
For patches, they have changed numbers on set bonuses/legendary items. They removed one legendary item.

Have they ever modified a quality of life change from the initial PTR Patch notes?
I can not think of any so it is completely fair to expect this not to change.

You claim that they changed their mind after the initial PTR patch notes was released and that should be expected. HUGE PROBLEM: The blue post admitted that season-gated stash tabs was their intent the whole time.
04/13/2019 10:33 AMPosted by Orrion
04/13/2019 08:27 AMPosted by Meteorblade
...
We were expecting it to be different because Blizzard said it would be different.


You're smarter than that.

Since when have you taken the first version of the patch notes to hit the scene as the final version, anyway?


For changes to gear, no. To multipliers and values, no. To add more items to update, to tweak class numbers, no. That is the purpose of the PTR, to test the number changes, item changes, interactions and the like. Of course they will/may make changes.

To a basic QoL life change - as it was presented - the yes, I expected it to be the way they wanted and would hit Live the same as the PTR.

The apologists on this forum simply astound me.
If we're being honest, most PTRs pushed to us are 95% done and our feedback very rarely, if ever, has mattered. Indeed, some number tweaks may happen, but that's the easy part of the process.

Nonetheless, we have a very glaring problem between wording and intent. Let's have a little exercise to demonstrate.

1) I don't like pizza.
2) I don't like pizza with pineapples.

For 1, it would be fair for anyone to believe that I don't like pizza. Fortunately, this is not true, but it is still a statement put to words that can be interpreted as such. 2 gets specific and goes on to imply that I like all pizza except those with pineapples. Odds are, if you serve me pizza, I'll be okay with it.

Now, let's convert this to the patch notes...

1) PC players have been given 5 additional stash tabs.
2) PC players have been given 5 additional stash tabs to be unlocked by the seasonal journey.

A bit of paraphrasing, forgive me, but the detail or lack thereof matters. People can easily read 1 and think that all PC users are getting 5 more tabs. A week or so passes only for Blizzard to go, "Oops, we meant #2!"

Can we hide behind the excuse that the PTR is subject to change? Sure. Does this defy the norm of numbers tweaks or other relative 95% completion? Yes, yes it does. I'd liken it to a form digital indian giving at this point. Peoples' hopes got up, they were enjoying it, then yoink. Or something like a friend who helps you out without terms, only to randomly come at you sometime later with, "Remember that favor I did for you?" and ask for something disproportionately more. Simply put, no one asked for it in this way. Not everyone has been excited about the directions seasons have been heading in, either. This is just icing on that cake.

The question should inevitably be, "What does Blizz lose if they drop the seasonal requirement?" I'd say most of the rational folk who aren't here just to antagonize those who are upset, favor playing devil's advocate, or espouse some smarmy rhetoric about hoarding, would agree that Blizzard loses nothing. Maintaining their present stance doesn't exactly promise a gain in the PR department, either. Quite the opposite, really.

So, while mistakes happen, sometimes you do need to deal with those consequences. It's not our fault they posted 1 instead of 2. The genie is out of the bottle at this point, as others have said. Just stick to 1 and resolve to maybe do something better in the next season or two. Just don't forget that NS players DO exist and like new shinies, too. A lesson seemingly forgotten of late.
This confusion is just another instance of the illustration of two tendencies: 1) players who have poor reading comprehension or who are less educated failing to understand what they read, and, 2) players' perceptions of what they read based on their own long-standing desires or frustrations.

It was pretty clear to me at the outset.

As soon as I saw that I could buy all stash tabs with gold in the PTR I knew for a fact that the only reason I could get those tabs for gold was for testing purposes, so that I could fill the stash up with the hundreds of Legendary items that were going to drop, and then try out the search function to find them. But selling all of those stash spaces for gold removes any value they might have. So I knew that the stash tabs were going to be "made available" in the same way that all other stash tabs have been; as rewards for the Season Journey.

Any other interpretation of the patch notes or anything else Blizzard has said was just wishful thinking, or poor reading comprehension. For example, every single make and model of new car for 2019 is available to me. Does that mean I can walk into every new car dealer and get one? When I go shopping, every item on the shelves of the grocery store is available to me. I don't tell me, "Yeah, but you can buy those things for money." I have to go work for that money. It takes time and it isn't easy.

But I don't mind the stash tabs being made available as rewards for the Season Journey. I finish Guardian on all six of my accounts every Season.

I find that I have the most fun in this game when I have a mission; something to accomplish. That's why I have those six accounts; I like leveling up new characters from scratch, and I play every Season on all six of them. I find it to be rewarding in a way that achieving one higher number on a Greater Rift isn't. I'm sure the same holds true for new players of this game; Blizzard wants to give them something to do, a mission to accomplish, so that they feel like playing this game provides some kind of reward.

In the meantime, quit crying about the stash tabs being a reward for completing the Season Journey. W should actually be looking forward to it.
04/13/2019 12:12 PMPosted by Saidosha
1) PC players have been given 5 additional stash tabs.
No, once again you are paraphrasing, and responding based on your skewed understanding of what was actually said.

What was actually said is, "Additional stash space has been added for all players | PC: 5 additional stash tabs are now available"

The stash space has been added, I assumed to the system, and five additional stash tabs are available to all players. To me that doesn't say that as soon as I log into the game I'll have those five additional stash tabs. It means they're "available," but Blizzard hasn't yet told me what I have to do to get them.

Think, McFly, think!

[Well, gotta go put in some work, so I can't continue arguing this point.]
04/13/2019 12:45 PMPosted by Slamboney
04/13/2019 12:12 PMPosted by Saidosha
1) PC players have been given 5 additional stash tabs.
No, once again you are paraphrasing, and responding based on your skewed understanding of what was actually said.

What was actually said is, "Additional stash space has been added for all players | PC: 5 additional stash tabs are now available"

The stash space has been added, I assumed to the system, and five additional stash tabs are available to all players. To me that doesn't say that as soon as I log into the game I'll have those five additional stash tabs. It means they're "available," but Blizzard hasn't yet told me what I have to do to get them.

Think, McFly, think!

[Well, gotta go put in some work, so I can't continue arguing this point.]


call it what you will.... at the end of the day, blizzard being known for screwing up patch notes or changing their mind last minute, just shows a history of incompetence.

i'll say it again... Path of Exile took 18 people to develop a game far more diverse and involving than Diablo 3... PURELY because they cared about their game.

Blizzard should have FAR SUPERIOR servers and vastly more devs..
there shouldn't even be a hint in lack of content or diversity.

If blizzard don't care about D3, why should we?
You're not really helping your argument any as their poor wording instead becomes a case of, "Hey, test this!" when we're left to think, "Test what?" Nothing about insinuating they're "available at a cost" specifies that it is seasonal, gold bought, sacrificing a chicken, or posting that D2 is better than D3 because that's what all the cool kids like to do. For many, available would infer that they're... available. For use. To take. To enjoy. No one goes to a car dealership expecting a free car because car dealerships are where they're sold. There's no ambiguity. And before you counter that there were prior seasonal unlocks, I'll just remind you that there were also prior gold unlocks and 2 that came with the Necro. Again, you're wanting to assume based on preference, feeling, or that little glee some people get trying to convince everyone else that they're the only one who's right about something.

Blizzard frak'ed up. Not us.

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