Elemental Exposure

Wizard
Hi, can someone please help me to understand this as I get so many conflicting opinions on this.

"Damaging enemies with Arcane, Cold, Fire or Lightning will cause them to take 5% more damage from your attacks for 5 seconds. Each different damage type applies a stack, stacking up to 4 times.

Elemental damage from your weapon contributes to Elemental Exposure."

I have a weapon with cold damage on it
Electrocute surge of power = lightning
Meteor Starpac = Arcane
Ray of Frost = Cold

Would changing RoF to Arcane Torrent flame ward give me the 4th element and would I lose damage from not using RoF?

Also, Is it multiplicative? Would Unwavering will be more damage.
Both EE and Unwavering Will are additive. EE is an additive debuff and Unwavering Will is an additive sheet buff.

Yes, changing RoF to a fire skill would give you the 4th element.

Yes, EE is more damage than Unwavering Will. 20% > 10%.

05/28/2019 06:20 AMPosted by Nigel
Would changing RoF to Arcane Torrent flame ward give me the 4th element and would I lose damage from not using RoF?


I don't know enough about Star Pact builds to comment on that. Is the low AP cost of RoF: Cold Blood necessary for the build to function?

Also, I don't see any wizards on your profile. Do you have another account? I was trying to see what specific build you are playing.
If you are doing Bazooka you need Ray of Frost. The non archon Star Pact with Shame of Delsere can use Arcane Torrent.

For some reason Ray of Frost can be started at 6 arcane power. I think the AP cose ticks twices as fast but at half the cost.
Thank you all for your comments
05/28/2019 07:45 AMPosted by TinneOnnMuin
Both EE and Unwavering Will are additive. EE is an additive debuff and Unwavering Will is an additive sheet buff.
I remember testing both passives in S6 and both were indeed additive. A few months back I was called out on stream for being incorrect on EE when mentioning; I retested it on the spot and it turns out that it is a separate multiplier nowadays. EE always has been additive but somewhere between S6 and S14 (when I retested it) it was ninja-changed (without patch notes) to be a separate multiplier. With that being said:
05/28/2019 07:45 AMPosted by TinneOnnMuin
Yes, EE is more damage than Unwavering Will. 20% > 10%.
It's actually a lot more damage.
Thanks SVR also do you have any input on Acrane Torrent vs Ray of Frost?

I am referencing for Bazooka build in NS
Weird. I actually went through the old patch notes before I posted just to make sure it hadn't changed. All I found that mentioned it was the change from it being a party buff to yourself only. Maybe it was made multiplicative then but not documented?

Anyway, good to know.

EDIT: EE was changed to benefit only yourself in 2.4.2. So right before Season 7.
2.4.1 (prior to Season 6) was the patch that made a bunch of other buffs multiplicative instead of additive.
05/28/2019 07:19 PMPosted by sVr
05/28/2019 07:45 AMPosted by TinneOnnMuin
Both EE and Unwavering Will are additive. EE is an additive debuff and Unwavering Will is an additive sheet buff.
I remember testing both passives in S6 and both were indeed additive. A few months back I was called out on stream for being incorrect on EE when mentioning; I retested it on the spot and it turns out that it is a separate multiplier nowadays. EE always has been additive but somewhere between S6 and S14 (when I retested it) it was ninja-changed (without patch notes) to be a separate multiplier. With that being said:
05/28/2019 07:45 AMPosted by TinneOnnMuin
Yes, EE is more damage than Unwavering Will. 20% > 10%.
It's actually a lot more damage.


Interesting, thank you sVr, I was totally still under the impression that EE was additive, it's still shown as an additive debuff under DIBS in D3planner. As a separate 20% multiplier EE is significantly stronger than UW considering how diluted DIBS becomes under current builds/group buffs that stack a lot of additive dmg (Spellsteal, Strongarms, Time Warp, etc). This makes a much better case for Primordial Soul if it could indeed increase this to a separate 40% multiplier.
05/29/2019 03:21 PMPosted by mcdundee
05/28/2019 07:19 PMPosted by sVr
... I remember testing both passives in S6 and both were indeed additive. A few months back I was called out on stream for being incorrect on EE when mentioning; I retested it on the spot and it turns out that it is a separate multiplier nowadays. EE always has been additive but somewhere between S6 and S14 (when I retested it) it was ninja-changed (without patch notes) to be a separate multiplier. With that being said:...It's actually a lot more damage.


Interesting, thank you sVr, I was totally still under the impression that EE was additive, it's still shown as an additive debuff under DIBS in D3planner. As a separate 20% multiplier EE is significantly stronger than UW considering how diluted DIBS becomes under current builds/group buffs that stack a lot of additive dmg (Spellsteal, Strongarms, Time Warp, etc). This makes a much better case for Primordial Soul if it could indeed increase this to a separate 40% multiplier.


Primordial soul seems pretty decent in a arcane orb setup.
Interesting that the debuff is now multiplicative. It does make sense that it could be since only the wizard that applies benefits.

So I took an hour to test EE, with a specific focus on the application of the debuff.

Used Vyr Cold Chantodo build CoE (no storm armor), AT:SD outside of archon. My weapon had fire element damage range, so up to 3/4 stacks or 15% debuff total. Entered several different GR128 rifts, levels and engaged different mob types.

As far as test method, I often moved quickly to get a better gauge of what was applying the debuff. This was more to see if single attack types applied the debuff. Other times I did stay on top of groups of enemies, hitting with multiple attacks.

Noted that Chantodos Wave of Destruction, Disintegration Wave, Archon Blast, and Archon Strike all did not appear to apply EE.

EE was getting applied, but very sparsely. It wasn't getting applied often enough to clearly say that any of these attacks were the means of application. Sometimes only a few mobs out of a dense pack would have EE applied, other times, up to ~60% would have EE applied. It's really bothering me that I can't figure out what was applying the debuff.

However, EE tended to favor not applying at all while attempting to hit with archon attacks and Chantodo, which is very concerning.

Possibilities:
  • A bug of some sort with how EE applies from archon attacks and chantodos WoD.
  • Graphical bug with the debuff icon/symbol not displaying on enemies that DO have the debuff applied.
  • Means of application is from some source other than the archon attacks or WoD. I was thinking thorns perhaps, but I tested this quickly, and it does not appear to be the source.

Other things to examine:
  • Does the EE debuff from any given attack element apply before a damage instance, similar to how WoD chills before dealing damage?

My initial thought was that with EE multiplicative, it could very well be worth going after as it's (napkin math) somewhere in the ~3-5% damage increase over going Cold Blooded. This is with EE at about 12% overall increase, vs CB, which is between about 9% and 7% overall increase depending on if you're running time warp or not (MW:D included).

However, with this inconsistent application being an issue, my initial take is to not use EE at all for Cold Vyr Chantodo push in the optional passive slot (assuming Audacity, Evocation, UA standard).
Interesting that the debuff is now multiplicative. It does make sense that it could be since only the wizard that applies benefits.

Noted that Chantodos Wave of Destruction, Disintegration Wave, Archon Blast, and Archon Strike all did not appear to apply EE.

However, with this inconsistent application being an issue, my initial take is to not use EE at all for Cold Vyr Chantodo push in the optional passive slot (assuming Audacity, Evocation, UA standard).


So, I'm trying not to be overly bitter about this but

1) EE was never rewarding enough for the difficulty in applying it.
2) Primordial Soul was introduced, but EE was additive (at the time) and therefore not really worth using.
3) EE was then ninja-patched to be made multiplicative, but made self-only and thus removing the whole point of Primordial Soul (which then became even more useless and a blight on our loot table)
4) Now, you're telling me EE doesn't even work properly.

Sounds like Diablo 3 :P

In theory, EE should have at least 100% uptime on Cold and Fire (wpn) type, with periodic applications of Lightning (From Static Dischange) and possibly Arcane (from Calamity), which would make it considerably better than Unwavering. I do not recall offhand how the stack is refreshed, but you'd think it worked like Tal's.

Oh well.
Hey Cratic,

Did you check it with other elemental types on your weapon?

I was seeing the same sparse application as you with fire and arcane weapons. But with a holy weapon, black damage weapon, and cold weapon, it seemed to apply a the single stack (from cold Archon skills) much more consistently for me.

I am wondering if it's some kind of bug with Archon attacks not correctly applying EE when you have a second elemental type on your weapon? Like having the second element on your weapon seems to cancel both EE stacks, but having only cold-type from your attacks seems to apply the single stack fine?

Won't be worth running if you can't apply the second element from your weapon, but might help us narrow down what's going on.

Just curious if you tested other weapons, because I did seem to get much more consistent application when it was just the single EE stack from cold Archon attacks without the possible second stack from weapon.
06/24/2019 09:54 PMPosted by Venaliter
In theory, EE should have at least 100% uptime on Cold and Fire (wpn) type, with periodic applications of Lightning (From Static Dischange) and possibly Arcane (from Calamity), which would make it considerably better than Unwavering.


It looks like the Combustion explosion might also apply fire-type, even in a cold Vyr's build. Was tough to isolate that, but I thought I was seeing an additional EE stack there. Maybe haha.

So running cold Vyr's with arcane weapon + lightning Static Discharge + Fire (initial explosion) might have also given all 4 stacks. If EE was applied consistently.
06/25/2019 07:16 AMPosted by TinneOnnMuin


So running cold Vyr's with arcane weapon + lightning Static Discharge + Fire (initial explosion) might have also given all 4 stacks. If EE was applied consistently.


I assumed due to the nature of the Vyr 2-piece the explosion damage defaulted to your highest elemental damage type, not the base "Fire" combustion rune. Definitely some funny business going on.
06/25/2019 09:31 AMPosted by Venaliter
I assumed due to the nature of the Vyr 2-piece the explosion damage defaulted to your highest elemental damage type, not the base "Fire" combustion rune. Definitely some funny business going on.


There's always been some funny business with Vyr2 and Combustion. In the old Tal/Vyr builds it would grant a fire stack for Tal's even when your Archon was lightning, too.

I'm not 100% sure it was granting an EE stack, as it's hard to tell sometimes how many stacks of EE have been applied. But it looked brighter than it should have been to me for only a single stack. I'd definitely want to see the results of some more testing on that before saying for sure one way or the other.
Combustion is always fire. Only Archon skills change elements depending on rune or highest elemental damage.

Ideally, you should have Arcane damage on weapon to gain 4 stacks of Elemental Exposure.
06/25/2019 07:15 AMPosted by TinneOnnMuin
Did you check it with other elemental types on your weapon?

No, I have not tested with other elemental weapon types, only the fire element thus far. Wanted to keep it simple and focused for the first attempt.

Very interesting that the non-EE element type weapons seem to be allowing application of the single EE stack more readily for the Vyr Cold build.

I'll see if I can confirm, and try other combinations, but not tonight - I've got to rest a bit. It's not like this is going to get (or need) a hotfix midseason, hah!
Hi i have only xxxx damage
Guess it doesnt help with EE right ?
06/29/2019 01:44 PMPosted by Ponchik
Hi i have only xxxx damage
Guess it doesnt help with EE right ?

No. It is physical be default, unless it says otherwise. And EE didn't benefit from physical.

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