Almost everything is determined by Paragon

General Discussion
Prev 1 7 8 9 Next
Being a vet gives players the advantage of being able to optimize their character easier. They would be able to optimize the way that they are playing their character. Trouble is though in this game like the OP you are putting it as if Paragon is the most important thing in the game that determines your power.

Vets already have that advantage. They don't need additional one.
Trouble is though in this game like the OP you are putting it as if Paragon is the most important thing in the game that determines your power.

I already addressed that when asked by another poster.
If you know how to play a build, if you have the right items for the build, all that's left is Paragon.
Sure, when it comes to pushing, fishing is probably more important.
However, Paragon does grant you advantage. Having more damage makes groups for grinding exp in speed GRifts more accessible and farming through these GRifts more consistent, resulting into even more Paragon.
Your knowledge translated into raw power that gave you what you needed to get the job done. You know the phrase that I am using here; "Knowledge is power."

Yes... and that knowledge was enough. I didn't need double or triple damage added on top of that.
The game is only dead when the servers are shutdown

When I say the game is dead, I don't mean, that the servers are shut down.
I'm talking in terms of player base. While Blizzard don't release info on their active players in D3, there are plenty of indications that there are few thousand players left.

There's plenty of controversy surrounding Blizzard since BlizzCon 2018, the fired employees and so on. They are not going to shut down the servers of a 7 year old game, because their reputation will suffer beyond repair while at the same time releasing WoW Classic and working on WC3 Reforged. Doesn't mean, that D3 has a healthy player base.
07/04/2019 11:53 AMPosted by XxTaiPanxX
Most leaderboards bot. Bot for bounties. Bot for mats. Bot for exp.
this game is corrupt.


That is easy to prove or disprove. I have to ask have you checked the profile of everyone on each of the solo leader boards to see if it is true? Because seeing time played is the only way of telling a bot from a legit player.
07/04/2019 03:21 PMPosted by ElobaCarcen
When I say the game is dead, I don't mean, that the servers are shut down.
I'm talking in terms of player base. While Blizzard don't release info on their active players in D3, there are plenty of indications that there are few thousand players left.

There's plenty of controversy surrounding Blizzard since BlizzCon 2018, the fired employees and so on. They are not going to shut down the servers of a 7 year old game, because their reputation will suffer beyond repair while at the same time releasing WoW Classic and working on WC3 Reforged. Doesn't mean, that D3 has a healthy player base.


I do believe that it is more than a few thousand players that are playing this game. You might be surprised at how many still play this game. Sure it is not religiously every day and only this game. But still it is played enough by a lot of people worldwide to keep the game going.
07/04/2019 07:28 PMPosted by ShadowAegis
But still it is played enough by a lot of people worldwide to keep the game going.

You keep thinking of Diablo 3 as if it's Marvel Heroes. As if it's a company like Gazillion, that released a single game. If a game fails and company shuts down, that's one thing.
But if D3 were to be shut down, while Blizzard still operates and supports their other IPs, I can absolutely guarantee you, that there will be outrage and Blizzard's rep would never recover. They are already the butt of so many jokes since last BlizzCon, and behind those jokes there's real criticism and outrage.

D3 servers still operating is in no way an indication of a healthy player base.
Paragon is just as important as caldesaan or having perfect rolls/primals. Aka, it is an always evolving part of the process and nothing more. It's a piece of the puzzle. And I think it's a relatively balanced piece, honestly. 1 paragon, 5 main stat. 1 gem level, 5 main stat. normal item vs primal? +250-500 main stat. Just pieces in a puzzle, no piece is more important or better than the other. Imo
07/04/2019 02:18 PMPosted by Phatty
<span class="truncated">...</span>

This is just wrong and I'll tell you why. For example, there is no way in hell you actually believe the OP thinks that gear is irrelevant. That the OP thinks you can walk in to a high GR with 10k paragon but with nothing equipped, and he will clear it easily.
But you see, if you take the title literally, then that is exactly what he is suggesting.
Yet everybody and their mom knows the OP doesn't believe that, he was merely attempting to clickbait at best with his title. And some of you went ham and focused on the most irrelevant part of his post.


Oh I see now it's click bait and this entire thread again if we assume was just to say higher paragon is important is pretty damn stupid.

I doubt that. His point is that higher paragon is needed to succeed in the leaderboards and "everything" as in the most important.

Lastly, he accepts the fact now. That is the nail in the coffin. Everything now is back peddling and rationalization.

Not sure where you come with your deduction, you his real life friend or something?


How can you actually read what I wrote and reply with this garbage?
Again, it's really simple. Are you suggesting the OP thinks he can place high on the leaderboards with 10k paragons and no equipment on? If your answer is Yes, then you're something else. If your answer is No, then your whole freaking point is moot. Because then we establish that "EVERYTHING" was simply hyperbole, nothing more.

Too bad he didn't have the edited title to begin with. Then you poindexters wouldn't have to waste your time arguing over nothing.

07/04/2019 09:02 PMPosted by SuperCuddles
Paragon is just as important as caldesaan or having perfect rolls/primals. Aka, it is an always evolving part of the process and nothing more. It's a piece of the puzzle. And I think it's a relatively balanced piece, honestly. 1 paragon, 5 main stat. 1 gem level, 5 main stat. normal item vs primal? +250-500 main stat. Just pieces in a puzzle, no piece is more important or better than the other. Imo


It's not though. Mathematically you're simply wrong. 13 pieces of caldesanns with 150 gem amounts to 13x150x5=9750 mainstat.
9750/5=1950 paragonlevels. 4k paragons is easily achievable by the zombies in seasons, so it offers twice the amount of raw stats basically. Gems are the same, since they also are capped. Paragon points trump caldesanns/gems and gear, since gear is easily obtainable in this game and everybody will have more or less the same.
Lol alectra, title changed also.

Come on now, give it up.

Now you are being silly.

I get the devils advocate thing but this is too much.

07/04/2019 04:34 AMPosted by Fangskin
Anyway, I will accept the points made from this discussion, and create another discussion about "capping seasonal Paragon".


That means he didn't accept them before, capiche?
You're hopeless, you can't even spell my name correctly. Expecting basic reading comprehension is obviously too much.
07/05/2019 09:17 AMPosted by Alecta
You're hopeless, you can't even spell my name correctly. Expecting basic reading comprehension is obviously too much.


ALectRA, please stop.

You saw his other thread right? I mean, there's consistency in his thought pattern. He STARTED a new thread after he ACCEPTED our discussion.

Come on!!!
07/05/2019 09:19 AMPosted by Phatty
07/05/2019 09:17 AMPosted by Alecta
You're hopeless, you can't even spell my name correctly. Expecting basic reading comprehension is obviously too much.


ALectRA, please stop.

You saw his other thread right? I mean, there's consistency in his thought pattern. He STARTED a new thread after he ACCEPTED our discussion.

Come on!!!


Do you really have a daughter that's autistic? Or are you just projecting?
Alecta,

You used ad hominen and straw men for your arguments.

The amount of rationalization you are doing to defend the OP is amazing.

It's clear that you do not understand my argument that states that paragon while important is not the _MOST_ determining factor in grifting. This has been a common thread through out the discussion. The counter argument that the OP had was that it was the determining factor.

Clearly, you are the one lacking the reading comprehension.

And yes, I do have a high functioning 12 year out autistic daughter.

Don't cross the line bud.
Write like a normal person and there will be no problems. Purposely spelling my nick wrong, just like you did with "Ebola", and you get what's coming. But I guess Ebola is quite fun since your daughter doesn't suffer from it.

07/04/2019 11:05 AMPosted by Phatty
Taking into account his first post and now admitting that he will "accept" that paragon isn't everything clearly shows his point wasn't that it was just a paragon points were important. It was paragon points were "everything".


This is your post. In here you're basically saying that the OPs main point was that paragon points were everything. I am merely explaining to you why it's silly to actually believe he thought nothing else matters. Hence the 0 gear 10k paragon scenario example I used but you conveniently keep dodging.
Alecta, again, I'm pretty much done arguing over this. If he wants to defend himself, he can. As far as I'm concerned, you taking up the torch for him makes absolutely no sense in the context of everything that has been said in this thread.

Your example is a classic straw man.

This is my _LAST_ post on this. Have a good life.
07/04/2019 08:36 PMPosted by ElobaCarcen
07/04/2019 07:28 PMPosted by ShadowAegis
But still it is played enough by a lot of people worldwide to keep the game going.

You keep thinking of Diablo 3 as if it's Marvel Heroes. As if it's a company like Gazillion, that released a single game. If a game fails and company shuts down, that's one thing.
But if D3 were to be shut down, while Blizzard still operates and supports their other IPs, I can absolutely guarantee you, that there will be outrage and Blizzard's rep would never recover. They are already the butt of so many jokes since last BlizzCon, and behind those jokes there's real criticism and outrage.

D3 servers still operating is in no way an indication of a healthy player base.


I wouldn't doubt that if the player level is as low as some are thinking. Then it could be low enough where the cost of running the servers is so high that it isn't worth keeping the game going.

Further how do you determine a healthy player base in a game that is designed around seasons. Where when a season starts you have a lot of people playing season. Then after the players get whatever they wanted done in season they stop playing till next season.

I say it is harder to figure out what is a healthy player based for such a game compared to one that is an mmo or any other game that has no seasons. Where in order to keep making progress you need to be playing every day. Those games it is easier to determine just how good the player base is.

What I am trying to say is real simple. There is a point in the numbers of actual players when it wouldn't be that much of a dent in their reputation to shut down the servers. Also it wouldn't make sense to keep making Themed Seasons if you don't have a decent player base to do such a thing. Even though it might not be that expensive to do. It still takes dev time and money to do.

How can you actually read what I wrote and reply with this garbage?
Again, it's really simple. Are you suggesting the OP thinks he can place high on the leaderboards with 10k paragons and no equipment on? If your answer is Yes, then you're something else. If your answer is No, then your whole freaking point is moot. Because then we establish that "EVERYTHING" was simply hyperbole, nothing more.

Too bad he didn't have the edited title to begin with. Then you poindexters wouldn't have to waste your time arguing over nothing.


The OP wouldn't have had to edit title if it was just such a hyperbole. I am sure that there are those that actually believe that paragon is the end all be all as far as who gets on the tops of the leader boards.

Just like there are those, in the minority, that wanted this game to be a prettier clone of D2. Even though some wouldn't admit it.
07/05/2019 10:58 AMPosted by Alecta
I am merely explaining to you why it's silly to actually believe he thought nothing else matters.

Despite his original thread title and early posts saying precisely that, you mean?

If what he meant isn't what he wrote that's not our fault. Perhaps he should be more precise with his claims / opinions rather than getting upset with people for not determining what he meant from what he didn't write.
...

Oh I see now it's click bait and this entire thread again if we assume was just to say higher paragon is important is pretty damn stupid.

I doubt that. His point is that higher paragon is needed to succeed in the leaderboards and "everything" as in the most important.

Lastly, he accepts the fact now. That is the nail in the coffin. Everything now is back peddling and rationalization.

Not sure where you come with your deduction, you his real life friend or something?


How can you actually read what I wrote and reply with this garbage?
Again, it's really simple. Are you suggesting the OP thinks he can place high on the leaderboards with 10k paragons and no equipment on? If your answer is Yes, then you're something else. If your answer is No, then your whole freaking point is moot. Because then we establish that "EVERYTHING" was simply hyperbole, nothing more.

Too bad he didn't have the edited title to begin with. Then you poindexters wouldn't have to waste your time arguing over nothing.

07/04/2019 09:02 PMPosted by SuperCuddles
Paragon is just as important as caldesaan or having perfect rolls/primals. Aka, it is an always evolving part of the process and nothing more. It's a piece of the puzzle. And I think it's a relatively balanced piece, honestly. 1 paragon, 5 main stat. 1 gem level, 5 main stat. normal item vs primal? +250-500 main stat. Just pieces in a puzzle, no piece is more important or better than the other. Imo


It's not though. Mathematically you're simply wrong. 13 pieces of caldesanns with 150 gem amounts to 13x150x5=9750 mainstat.
9750/5=1950 paragonlevels. 4k paragons is easily achievable by the zombies in seasons, so it offers twice the amount of raw stats basically. Gems are the same, since they also are capped. Paragon points trump caldesanns/gems and gear, since gear is easily obtainable in this game and everybody will have more or less the same.


ya but it's all just "stats" it makes no difference how much or little, really. A bigger difference will be what sort of enemies are in the rift, or what pylons you get, or what maps you get. Paragon just doesn't matter, really. Get 800 paragon and that's all you really, truly need.
07/02/2019 11:11 AMPosted by Fangskin
07/02/2019 10:58 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
If you really believe that paragon is the end all be all of the top spots on the leader boards. Then please tell me where those top spot players be if they had the following

1. No augments
2. level 25 legendary gems
3. Missing a lot of needed affixes on gear, such as crit, cdr, etc...

I highly doubt that your grandma would be able to be in the top spots with junk gear with a 7k+ paragon.
If you can achive top 20 in any class leaderboard with Paragon 1500 at non-seasonal, then everyone will accept your ground. Just upload the video first.


You keep coming back to this, why?
07/05/2019 11:14 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
I wouldn't doubt that if the player level is as low as some are thinking. Then it could be low enough where the cost of running the servers is so high that it isn't worth keeping the game going

This is a problem the devs themselves created when they made the game always online. If it costs them too much, they should release an offline patch.

Actually, the player base being low or high... I don't think it matters for a game, that is not monetized. If anything, the lower the players, the less capacity they need to dedicate.

Also, do we even know how Blizz handle their servers? I am not tech savvy, but does every single Blizzard game run on separate servers nowadays? Don't they utilize virtualization in some way? I would suspect they do, because I had this experience that D3 was awfully laggy during the pre-Legion invasion event for WoW.
07/05/2019 11:14 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
a game that is designed around seasons

How is the game designed around seasons? Seasons is... I would argue a small feature compared to the overall themes of the game.
Seasons are based on the D2:LoD ladder resets, and these were there to achieve stable in-game economy.
D3 however doesn't have trading. Seasons are about fresh start due to the crappy Paragon 2.0 and the poor handling of cheaters and bots.
When the game is rendered meaningless through many poor design decisions, how many players do you think still give a damn about the rather pointless rewards associated with Seasons?
07/05/2019 11:14 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
I say it is harder to figure out what is a healthy player based for such a game compared to one that is an mmo or any other game that has no seasons.

And why is an MMO different? MMOs have content patches. Of course the player base spikes around content patches in a similar manner it does when a new season for D3 is released. If you were to measure active player base, do so in the first few weeks, and compare.
However, Blizz no longer release numbers for their WoW subscribers and they are not going to release numbers for active players for D3. I suspect third party sites like Diablo progress might be utilized, so you can see how many players created seasonal characters, and that would still be rather poor indication, as there are those who stick to NS.

But if someone were to tell me, that D3 has a higher active player than PoE or Warframe, I would laugh in his face.
07/05/2019 11:14 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
it wouldn't make sense to keep making Themed Seasons if you don't have a decent player base to do such a thing.

I believe these exist for newer players to have whom to play with. If Seasons didn't exist, if you were to throw them directly into NS, they would find the game pointless... again due to Paragon.
07/05/2019 11:14 AMPosted by ShadowAegis
it wouldn't be that much of a dent in their reputation to shut down the servers

It would, considering, that they haven't shut down servers for a game like SC1, WC3, D2 etc...
Hell, I haven't checked recently, but I think D1 still can be played over battle.net.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum