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it will be easier to tone down the gold find if it ends up being to powerfull than having to tone down gold sinks and other things if there is not enough gold in the economy to support it at a healthy level
11/29/2011 06:13 PMPosted by Jacka
just because we may have a game where 1 $ buys 500k gold or 1 million gold does not make gold worthless.
<br />But if there is nothing to spend that 500k gold on, it does make the gold worthless. The same problems we ran into with the previous games, abundant gold and the only sink was gambling which was a highly ineffective form of MF.<br /><br />WoW runs into a problem with gold being worthless and they don't have gold find. Of course this problem didn't become as apparent until the expansions started coming.<br /><br />
Now then.. D3, as opposed to D2, plans on using gold as a currency. Taking into account that the previous game had no gold sinks, there will be gold sinks in this game. There are a lot already. Also, since it is the currency, people will be trading it; meaning Blizzard will find a nice balance of gold dropped per hour farming. As well as what an appropriate amount of gold find should be. I haven't personally seen anything saying that this stat will even be in the game, but I don't really keep up with it anymore. That said, if gold find does make it into D3, it will be balanced and who better to do that than the Blizzards.
<br />You talk about beta, but you don't know that gold find is in the beta?<br />There will not be sufficient gold sinks to make up for gold find, unless they balance it on the gold find, in which case anybody not playing the game while wearing gold find gear will not be able to enjoy the game.



I guess I don't see what you mean about gold being worthless in Diablo 2, you obviously didn't utilize the game to it's fullest than. I used gold for crafting. I had a Gold Find Barbarian that could get between 250k-450k per Travanical run and I could do a run in about 8-12 minutes, I would do an hours worth of those gold runs and than blow all that money gambling blue amulets for crafting high level amulets with the cube. So basically I could blow through 4-6 Million gold in a day that way. I rarely had gold on my characters looking for the perfectly crafted amulet.
Edited for spam.
11/29/2011 07:28 PMPosted by Bottle
This is simple. There is no upper limit on gold. The market will simply settle towards an equilibrium of what seems equitable. In D2 the only reason gold was worthless was because there was a cap. A top gold finder could fill his 2 million gold capped stash in a matter of hours. Well, if there was no upper limit, it would have still taken him months, maybe over a year before he could get a billion gold. And maybe a top of the line impossible item to find (like a crafted item with all the ideal stats people want, to the max) could have gone for a billion gold.


Actually D2 did not have a cap except per level. I believe my GF Barbarian was 2.3 million and I could fill him in 50-70 minutes max but I had godly items and monster of a Hireling.
11/29/2011 06:47 PMPosted by Jacka
If you can prove to me it's not a problem, go for it.


Here is an idea, how about you prove that it will be a problem? Oh? You can't?

/thread
Crafting will be a big goldsink, at the very least you can buy blue equipment for gold from NPCs.

No matter how much gold is worth, it will remain useful.
If it takes 1 million gold to buy a low level sword, then that can work.
Just means that 1million is a symbol for 1 hour of goldfarming etc
The actual amount of gold per item shouldn't matter for those who've been playing since the start.

It's still trading time for items, and with no gold cap there shouldn't be a problem even if gold loses most of its value.

From what I've read about diablo2 , gold failed as a medium of exchange because the amount you could carry was similar to only being able to have 100gold max in the current diablo3 beta.
You couldn't hold enough of it at one time...if you were able to have an unlimited amount on your character, it'd be useful.

Highly exaggerated of course, but something like that.
That's how I understand it as someone who's read about what happened in D2, but I didn't play it online. (only singleplayer a few times)

If I have 10,000,000,000,000,000 gold, I'm only rich if I've got more than the majority, and if I can use that to buy a lot of useful things.

Repairs/crafting fees would be trivial with gold being worth 'nearly nothing' but the gold auctionhouse economy would be ok. You'd still have to farm for gold for x hours, to get a particular item.

Making more fun goldsinks would be a good idea, if they're optional and provide an enjoyable way to get rid of gold.
e.g
being able to marry Leah, have to pay child support etc
(she's high maintenance...but worth it.)
Or be able to buy a copy of Diablo3 (digital) for a friend: 500 million gold.
11/29/2011 08:08 PMPosted by Jacka
I guess I don't see what you mean about gold being worthless in Diablo 2, you obviously didn't utilize the game to it's fullest than. I used gold for crafting. I had a Gold Find Barbarian that could get between 250k-450k per Travanical run and I could do a run in about 8-12 minutes, I would do an hours worth of those gold runs and than blow all that money gambling blue amulets for crafting high level amulets with the cube. So basically I could blow through 4-6 Million gold in a day that way. I rarely had gold on my characters looking for the perfectly crafted amulet.
<br />I wasn't aware that they sold gems, jewels, and runes at vendors.


They didn't, it was items only. You had to farm your other mats but that was easy with a high level sorceress or Hammerdin in which I had both. I also traded high level items for mats. Remember 40 chipped gemss for a HR? Those blue amulets at the vendor were I beleive somewhere between 60k-110k per purchase. That eats up the gold fast.
I used to be a QQ'er like you, before I took an arrow to the knee.
Too much speculation in this thread. Hardly worth posting in but what the hell.

Let's take some of the facts we know for certain.
Gold Find will increase the amount of gold monsters drop.
Monsters drop greater amounts of gold per drop as difficulty increases (this is apparent even in the beta).
Magic find will increase the amount of magical items a player will find.

Now, the question becomes, will the amount of gold obtained with Gold Find gear make up for the amount of extra magical items found by someone wearing magic find gear.

The answer...we don't know. There's no way to know until we have the game in our hands and are actually playing it. We can make claims saying that people will stack gold find and farm hell difficulty over and over for gold, but we don't even know if that will be the most efficient way. Hell may not be farmable with stacked gold find gear. Or, stacking gold find in Hell may slow you down to the point that you'd actually get gold faster wearing regular gear and killing quicker. We don't know. Once the market's established, even more common inferno items that can be found in an hour of farming Inferno without magic find may end up being worth more than an hour's worth of gold farming in Hell decked out in Gold Find gear. Inferno might just be that difficult and people might just be willing to drop tons of gold on some relatively common Inferno gear, we don't know.

Bottom line, we don't know. It's irrelevant at this point to speculate what will and will not be broken because we don't have the facts to support the claims. Could gold find be broken? It could be. It very well may be. Then again, it just might not be. Hell, for all we know, Gold Find may actually be borderline worthless with the example I gave earlier and giving up valuable stats in place of Gold Find slows you down to the point that you don't even end up getting anymore gold...We just don't know.
11/29/2011 08:26 PMPosted by Kerplode
I used to be a QQ'er like you, before I took an arrow to the knee.


skyrim!!
My point is that people will be farming Hell for gold (which can begin before anybody steps foot into Inferno), and it will be extremely easy, and it will yield the greatest results for your time and effort put into the farming.


how can you possibly KNOW this? how do you KNOW it will yield the best results... oh wait... you dont know. youre guessing. it COULD be true but when you state it like its fact thats just absurd. there is no way to KNOW that hell + gold find will ruin the economy
I'm confused... does the rate at which you find gold really matter? Increasing the speed at which you obtain gold will only decrease its subjective value. In other words, inflation.

If gold is abundant, it will lose its value. If items are scarce, they will increase in value. I believe it was only mentioned once that if an item took one week to find, then it will take one week's worth of gold farming to buy. Supply-demand? Anyone...?

Like someone said, it would be dumb to trade an item found after days of farming for gold farmed in 30 minutes. Trust me, dumb is a great understatement.
11/30/2011 04:14 PMPosted by Jman
With Hardcore in mind, I find it difficult to believe that Blizzard would design even their most difficult setting to be nearly impossible to play without dying constantly.


Inferno might not be automatic death but it is supposed to be ridiculously difficult. It's specifically designed to kill you. All this means to the HC crowd is that only the bravest and most skilled players will have the balls to step foot into Inferno and even among those, only a very small portion will be able to finish it, let alone farm it without dying.

We know that Inferno's difficulty has no curve to it. Act I is going to be just as dangerous as Act IV. Even if it is a difficulty where a player doesn't die constantly, it will be a difficulty where death is fairly common. HC players have their work cut out for them.
I have this bridge i want to sell you. 1,000,000,000,000 gold please. Great deal.


Does this make sense to anyone else?
inferno repair bills will eat most of peoples gold, not to mention the different crafting systems

(the video of feedback from inferno testers (which made inferno sound REALLY HARD, btw) had people saying that they lost "soooooooooo much gold" to repair bills)


There is no way that repair costs from dying will be the main gold sink in the game. You guys forget that in Hardcore, you will never ever suffer this penalty. Add to the fact that gold is shared across the account, then there has to be a hell of a lot more done to keep gold in check.

Otherwise, Hardcore players and softcore people who aren't kamikazes are going to have ballooning accounts.

With Hardcore in mind, I find it difficult to believe that Blizzard would design even their most difficult setting to be nearly impossible to play without dying constantly.

I know what Blizzard said, but you have to take it with a grain of salt. It's a promotional video made for their most dedicated playerbase (blizzcon attendees/viewers). It makes sense to play up the difficulty for your hardcore audience. Especially after all the bad press about beta being too easy.


and inferno is made for the most skilled playerbase

just because hardcore exists, does not mean hardcore players are designed to regularly be running around in inferno

however, we cant really say at this point, well hafta wait and see
Farming Hell with gold find gear is going to be way too profitable. Consider the alternative, farming Inferno with magic find gear... What are you going to do if you're looking to maximize your profit? Guarenteed gold drops in massive amounts, or finding an item once a week worth the same amount of gold you farmed in Hell in about 30 minutes.

It's going to lead to the same problems we had in previous Diablos where gold was worthless because it was so readily available, and took no effort to amass large amounts of it.

Gold find either needs to be hard capped, or removed.

Other people's opinions?

You do realize that your theory contradicts itself I hope. Stacking gold find and farming hell is going to be profitable, yet gold is going to be worthless?

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