Does the Witchdoctor seem out of place?

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This seems like something that could have been Easily learned from WoW and warlocks.

Took a few years for demonology to be useful and pets, along with hunter pets. Big reason is having your stats help them.
Beyond just scaling with your vitality.

Zombie dogs and garg both need a natural 100% life buff.
And each needs about 50% more damage.

I want to use at least the garg in inferno but it's just downright worthless past act 1 even with 600 all resists and 3k armor. And even in act 1 which it does actually survive fairly well i don't need it since i can take the hits and zombie bears kills everything for me.

Am i the best equiped? Of course not, but even if i did have 800+ resist all and 5k armor they would still crumple in act 3-4 in about the same time as the cast animation.
I'm sure its been said already, but instead of scaling pet health with vit, why not scale all of the pets attributes by your int? That way a WD can focus on being a DPS and have pets at the same time.


While the intent is for witch doctors to re-summon Zombie Dogs and Gargantuan fairly often, we agree that pets aren't living long enough in higher difficulty levels. Of course, the harder difficulties are supposed to be more challenging, but we don't think it's fun gameplay to cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly, wait for the cooldown to reset, re-cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly...etc. And this is happening even when players are wearing pretty reasonable gear.

We're looking into ways to improve witch doctor pet survivability at later levels, but we don't have any clear plans to share just yet. One thing we're considering, though, is having pets scale with your Vitality (which they currently do not do).


dont stop there. scale them with our resists and armor and dodge too

... im very surprised they already didnt scale with out stats... thats like the basic of basics as far as pets go


It seems a lot of people already seem to not know they already DO scale off our resists, armor and dodge...

It just doesn't matter eventually. No matter how much of it you get they will still get two shot in act 2 like a barb does. the difference between them and the barb is the barb gets an extra 30% DR for being melee and he can heal himself with revenge and furious charge, that's what keeps them alive. Pet's dont have any of that.

They do scale off of our int too, it makes them do more damage, because our damage goes up and their damage is tied to our damage. and it raises our resists, which raises their resists as well.

Vit is about one of the only things they don't scale off of.

They need to do something about the CD, and something to make them stay alive for a little while longer at least in proper gear. Resummoning them is fine and all, as long as we aren't petless for a long time before we can resummon them...

For comparison, I have 4.3k armor and 12.5k dps 724 physical resist, all other resists upper 600's. 1325 int 800vit Think that's all the relevant stuff.

I use the jungle fort passive, the zombie handler passive, and i even use the big stinker garg with bad medicine passive just for an extra 20% damage reduction for them.

In act 2 the very first trash mobs you see they get murdered before i can even kill the first couple mobs, all pets, dead. even the garg, who tanked the butcher just fine was gone in 2 or 3 hits.

In act 1, I can have them tank everything, only because I probably overgear it. And only need to resummon the zombie dogs occasionally. I even have them with life leech rune so they heal themselves a bit.
06/01/2012 10:24 AMPosted by Lylirra
I think you'd have less hating on the WD, in general, if our zombie dogs and gargantuan didn't require fairly specific and fairly rigid gearing requirements to be viable.


While the intent is for witch doctors to re-summon Zombie Dogs and Gargantuan fairly often, we agree that pets aren't living long enough in higher difficulty levels. Of course, the harder difficulties are supposed to be more challenging, but we don't think it's fun gameplay to cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly, wait for the cooldown to reset, re-cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly...etc. And this is happening even when players are wearing pretty reasonable gear.

We're looking into ways to improve witch doctor pet survivability at later levels, but we don't have any clear plans to share just yet. One thing we're considering, though, is having pets scale with your Vitality (which they currently do not do).


Bullsh!t !!! No One need Vitality in the Inferno Mode.... Stack it with Int...
06/01/2012 10:24 AMPosted by Lylirra
I think you'd have less hating on the WD, in general, if our zombie dogs and gargantuan didn't require fairly specific and fairly rigid gearing requirements to be viable.


While the intent is for witch doctors to re-summon Zombie Dogs and Gargantuan fairly often, we agree that pets aren't living long enough in higher difficulty levels. Of course, the harder difficulties are supposed to be more challenging, but we don't think it's fun gameplay to cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly, wait for the cooldown to reset, re-cast Zombie Dogs, watch them die almost instantly...etc. And this is happening even when players are wearing pretty reasonable gear.

We're looking into ways to improve witch doctor pet survivability at later levels, but we don't have any clear plans to share just yet. One thing we're considering, though, is having pets scale with your Vitality (which they currently do not do).


Firstly, scaling with vitality is a poor option. I have a WD in act 3 inferno with 1100 physical resistance 800 to elements and 5.5k armor along with 1.5k health per second applied through the fierce loyalty passive. My pets are "sorta" able to tank stuff, but die quite quickly to normal mobs and instantly to most champions. In order for them to survive long enough to be viable, I would need roughly 30% more defenses from my current gear along with enough offensive stats to give me 30k+ dps. The problem that arises is that each item REQUIRES 7 affixes in order to have a VIABLE WD build with summons. I run around with 7k health because I can't waste affixes on gear, and scaling with vitality doesn't fix the problem it just compounds it.

I like the way pet scaling functions right now, and quite honestly don't mind hunting for those "perfect" rares with that awesome set of affixes at high values. I think the solutions should come from our skill runes and/or passive skills. I REALLY like the +100% armor from horrify rune, and would like to see possibly more options similar to this that could enhance pets to create a more "summoner" focused build rather than darts plus a few pieces of cannon-fodder.

The fierce loyalty passive skill could be a simple fix for summons in my opinion. It is designed currently as one of the only summon augmenting skills that adds complexity to gearing and build structure. Perhaps doubling the amount of regen they receive would be a good measure to allowing greater survivability. The biggest issue I experience with my summons is not that they die in a single hit, it is rather that they don't regen at a rate a character might (due to only scaling with passive regen and not on hit or on kill effects) and when encountered with a group of several mobs quickly succumb to successive hits that they cannot recover quickly enough from to stay alive for any significant amount of time.

I can foresee that it may be possible at perfect gear levels for summons to be quite amazing, and I don't want to see a change that would deprive me of the hunt for that level of perfection in my gear. I would, however, like to be able to sustainably clear content on a level that is comparable to other builds and other classes in my hunt for that gear.

In a nutshell, don't make them scale with vitality. Buff existing effects or add new bonuses by means of skill runes or passive skills.
WD is one of the less "diabloishy" lore class I have ever seen....
06/01/2012 10:40 AMPosted by Alicor
I want a Necromancer.


This.
06/05/2012 09:37 PMPosted by bulba
One thing we're considering, though, is having pets scale with your Vitality (which they currently do not do).


...

What kind of retarded game design is this.


Only from the new Diablo team, which is clueless how pets should work despite having WoW as an example.
I think the only way to make pets viable late game would be to cheat.

Seriously, the game in inferno is designed to punish anything very fast and VERY hard that steps in the wrong place.

Your pets love stepping into the wrong place.

The only way to make them survive in inferno, w/o making them godlike, would be to just have them magically ignore some or all damage from champion special attacks, regardless of your stats.

Also, they would need to ignore some dmg even from reg mobs in inferno too.

Otherwise they will just be useless, imo.
Pets should ignore aoe dmg (they are to stupid to avoid it)
Pets should scale only from int (we want to do damage too, not only wait for our pets)
Pets should get life on hit ( if one dog hit he heals everything - others pets, garg, me) - only via fierce to loyalty pasive
Pets should have about 15 sec cd tu summon (to have fun with them)
If your going to make them scale, It should probably be something more realistic, like a pull of %life modifier off of existing vitality, A Res modifier off character based res's/int, base armor modifier off character armor, and scale damage with the actual damage of the character. I know its a lot to revisit the pet entirely, but this way the pet could be made to scale through the entire game properly by changing the ratio's involved by difficulty. Everything would scale based on native stats of the the character summoning. Just a suggestion! ;)

Cheers!
Personally, I find the WD to not be in line with the rest of the classes. The pets are speed bumps at best, even at lower levels, and the skills are arguably the worst. It's the only class where the primary attack has a mana cost. I can understand how ostensibly it's designed that way because, hey, you have pets to do some of your dirty work, but they're not nearly effective enough.

I am a type of player to try ALL classes, and it's by far my least favorite in terms of game mechanics.
maybe the answer is as simple as giving the pets a damage reduction that is based on what act you are in and what difficulty level you are playing.

example: Normal (no damage reduction), Nightmare (10% damage reduction), Hell (50% damage reduction), inferno (90% damage reduction)

i was just thinking of these numbers because of the number of hits it takes an enemy to kill a pet. in Hell mode, a dog dies in 2 hits... that is ridiculous and i dont think we need to get into inferno mode. in Nightmare, i didnt even need to go to the auction house to buy any gear to keep the pets alive, i just made use of all the passives. there is just such a significant leap between Nightmare and Hell mode, not to mention Inferno mode after that. the pets would be great if they just had some hardcore survivability like they did in Nightmare and Normal. if they exceed what they do in Nightmare or Normal, i feel it would be too over powered.

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