I tested 1 handed and 2 handed, plz read

Witch Doctor
So for testing purpose I bought a top of the line manajuma's carving knife for 450 million gold, 1014 dps 95% crit hit damage 2.90% life steal. At first I thought it was alright, hitting super fast, but I was running out of mana much faster than when I use my skorn. Also when it came to leeching my life back, i was at 90k hp, it felt like I wasn't leeching AT all even with my really high damage. Now I met the first reflect elites, usually I just use fightening aspect the horrify rune and i can spam bears and leech some life using my skorn, but using the manajuma my life was going down slowly then again I would go spirit walk and leech my 90k life back in like 2 hits using my lovely skorn, with manajuma it wasnt the case. I would go spirit walk and watch my life SLOWLY go back up. So what I noticed is you hit faster with weaker attacks and leech less. Can you guys tell me why do you like that weapon and 1 handed in general over a top of the line skorn like im using? Please give me some arguments, this is mostly a follow up to a thread that was made yesterday talking about 1 handed vs 2 handed, you guys can't say I was negative and didin't try the 1 handed , i spent 450 million for testing purpose. Also I noticed a few people on my friend list liked 1 handed more BUT , they never tried a good skorn with life steal, you will see the diffrence when your lfie is low and you just leech it back up in 2-3 hits. Thank you for reading I know that was a lot of text, don't mind the mistakes aswell as english is not my main language.
i duno what you tested, but my manajuma is only a mediocre ~800 dps one, and i leech back my full health in 2-3 hits as well.

what you aren't understanding is that when paired with a good mojo, your 1hander basically hits as hard if not harder than a skorn, + you are swinging faster. the + average damage from our mojos basically makes our 1hand+mojo combo as hard hitting as a 2h if not harder. We just have to find full black damage 1handers. Manajuma is kind of crappy since its poison dmg, so its not really a good item to base off. per swing on your Skorn equipped on me i do about 180k DMG per swing, with a decent 1200-1300 dps 1hander its about 170k dmg per swing if its a spear.
But you leech 2x less and you dont hit 2x faster. I just explained what i tested, I tested a top of the line skorn and I tested a top of the line manajuma. It was a fair fight, the skorn hits much harder, what you just said makes no sense at all my friend, I dont wanna be rude but let's compare, a top of the line manajuma has about 378 - 1071 damage + add a 120-474 mojo to this ( im being generous ) . your base weapon's damage is now 498-1545 , while my skorn is 1149-1702 , i wont count the fact that my amulet and boots give me % elemental damage and my skorn is a black damage weapon vs manajuma is elemental which gives skorn even more damage, so how is your weapon hitting as hard as mine? when my minimum damage is like 700 higher and my max is about 200 higher? also my weapon can get up to 300% crit hit damage while manajuma can get up to 200% ? Now each time i am spending mana for a bear i get a much HARDER hit than you do so i end up wasting less mana, also when I am hitting harder I am leeching more, and I am leeching even more cuz skorn can get up to 6% life steal which is 2x what a 1 hander can get. Now you see that what you stated makes absolutly no sense. I tested both, and you didint go buy a skorn and test it yourself. So the only advantage I see to use a 1 handed over a 2 handed is the 10% crit hit chance you get from the mojo which doesnt compare to leeching twice as much.
But you leech 2x less and you dont hit 2x faster. I just explained what i tested, I tested a top of the line skorn and I tested a top of the line manajuma. It was a fair fight, the skorn hits much harder, what you just said makes no sense at all my friend, I dont wanna be rude but let's compare, your manajuma has about 350 - 860 damage add a 120-474 mojo to this ( im being generous ) . your base weapon's damage is now 470-1334 , while my skorn is 1149-1702 , i wont count the fact that my amulet and boots give me % elemental damage and my skorn is a black damage weapon vs manajuma is elemental which gives skorn even more damage, so how is your weapon hitting as hard as mine? when my minimum damage is like 700 higher and my max is about 400 higher? also my weapon can get up to 300% crit hit damage while manajuma can get up to 200% ? Now each time i am spending mana for a bear i get a much HARDER hit than you do so i end up wasting less mana, also when I am hitting harder I am leeching more, and I am leeching even more cuz skorn can get up to 6% life steal which is 2x what a 1 hander can get. Now you see that what you stated makes absolutly no sense. I tested both, and you didint go buy a skorn and test it yourself. So the only advantage I see to use a 1 handed over a 2 handed is the 10% crit hit chance you get from the mojo which doesnt compare to leeching twice as much.


youre comparing a skorn to a manajuma, skorn already has an advantage of being fully black damage. I personally went manajuma because it comes with natural crit dmg life leech and int. IDEALLY the best 1handed weapon would be a full black dmg wepaon with lifesteal/crit dmg/int, a top end 1H will be the same swing damage as a topend SKORN. Manajumas are NOT top end 1handers, i bought mine because i dont have the gold to shell out on a top end 1h atm, top end 1H will beat a top end skorn any day when paired with an offhand... what i said stands truth. you are comparing a top end skorn to a non top end 1hander. Top end skorns are in the 100s of millions, my weapon is just a 30-40m manajuma.

Top end 1H are 1100-1300 DPS black damage rares, not legendaries.
Again a top 1 handed weapon will not have 6% leech on it which is why I use a 2 handed. I agree i've seen some insane 1 handed weapons with a max damage that would be close to a skorn ( again the min damage is lower ) but you need to hit twice to leech as much, and a top 1 handed weapon like you're talking about would be a mace or a spear and those have 1.20 attack speed which is 0.20 more than my weapon. So in the end I leech my life a lot more with skorn than with any 1 handed. You may not notice it much with low hp but when im rocking my uber setup with 100k hp and I can leech my FULL life back up in 2-3 hits this is where you see why 6% life steal is by far superior to 3%. Did you ever test both weapons? Btw I love seeing people's point of view.. i'd like to see more people reply to this thread please.
First off, I'm open minded to any builds, as I've talked to evilal3x about it already. I'm definitely interested in trying out a skorn build, but I'm not gonna go out of my way to build one unless I happen to farm one by chance.

The big argument against 1h/mojo combos is that you go OOM. However, upto mp6, and sometimes even mp7, this is not an issue for me at all. The reason is because I can spam bears for several seconds. Specifically:

1.6 atks/sec x 140 mana per cast = 224 mana/sec x 85% (due to BR) = 190 mana/sec cost
84 mana reg (with 1034 max mana with SA) means I can spam bears for:
1034/(190-84) = 9.75 seconds (basically almost 10 seconds)

Anything upto mp6, and sometimes even mp7 (depends on how I position myself so bears charge in the right direction), everything including elites melt within those 10 seconds.

So the argument becomes, "what about mp8 and up???". Well, at mp8 and up, unless you have excessive amounts of resistance, armor, and health, odds are that fighting elites, you'll be moving from your stationary position within the 10 second timeframe. What happens when you move? You gain mana. Hence, again, mana hasn't been an issue.

Where the skorn and 2h-er comes into play is against ubers. The ubers stay relatively stationary (for the most part), so big crits and slower casts are beneficial. Widowmakers with bears works wonders (infinite bear spam), but it's a little awkward to use sometimes.

For me, I clear mp5 or mp6 so quickly and efficiently that I don't even notice OOM issues. If you farm mp7 or higher, you're doing it wrong lol.

Just my thoughts.
I would never build a spec for 1 affix, reflect is annoying and getting changed eventually. With Life Leach you will always get more back based on the damage output you do so a skorn will give you back more life then a manaj. Especially since you are doing more attack with 1h weapon so you are procing more reflect then you would with a skorn. However you should also be (in theory reflect is kinda buggy) taking much larger hits from reflect do to the increased damage. I donnu I just try to kill reflect when spirit walked or suicide on it until it's gone I've lost patients with it in general, and don't want to run ROT for one affix that may or may not show up in a game.

While I haven't had a Lifesteal skorn I've used last breath, sever, etc so I know how it works in general. I also use the skorn I was using the other nite 1450, etc etc.. so I'm used to playing both ways. The key difference is going to be burst damage, more damage over the course of a run, mobility, and extra perks.

Mana is a whole different issues. I don't know if you went with the mojo you showed me but it didn't have any mana replenishment abilities. For reflect with a 1h you can try jungle fort, and life link dogs. I haven't used a manaj I use a mace so my raw damage, and int combined with my mojo combo is rather to close to that of a skorn. It will take a little while to get the hang of it as you are used to playing with @ 1.16 as, you have to manage your bubble a little more and possibly change up your passives (i don't know what you are using atm). I donnu i'll catch you in game see if we can't get some of the kinks worked out.
Like i was telling soundb in game, If skorn had 3% life steal, I would be using a 1 handed right now, its what makes me go for a 2 handed mostly, its a MUST try at least once 6% leech is really that fun lol r . I really like the 10% crit hit chance you get from the mojo aswell as the extra vita and all the little bonus mods you can get ( pick up radius from thing of the deep ) damage % against elite from otehr mojos etc... So it really depends on what you farm and your play style mostly.
This has been beat to death. Blizzard actually did a pretty good job balancing the 2 options. People are always going to have their preference hence this arguement still going on with no clear winner.

The differences are:

2Her - 1Her+Mojo
Hit harder - Allows better mobility
Less mana used - Mana/s available
100 extra CD - 10 CC
Double the life regen - all the extra perks from a Mojo (Pu radius, life %, etc.)

And Soundb, Skorn isn't the top 2her just like manuj isn't the top 1her. There are 2hers with 1600+ dps which will crush the damage range on any 1her.
I have mixed feeling about lifesteal. I some times feel like it's a crutch to mask failures or better yet lack of interest on my part in terms of gearing for defensive statistics, but it sure does make things easier and allow me to stay a little on the GC side as long as I'm always attacking mob size or range don't kill me anymore as you are always getting something back, but it's like this delicate balance you have to play where you bubble is constantly going up and down and if you get unlucky it dips to much poof. Personally I've been trying to slowly replace any "pure" dps gear I have left with something that has a little bit more defensive stats as long as i don't drop DPS, which will open me up to moving away from life steal again.

For the majority of time playing this game I didn't run lifesteal only a couple weeks before 1.05 did I make the switch to LS weapon outside of just for testing. I spend a lot of time looking @ pure high damage CC/CD/OS/INT weapons lately. To me it's about balance so if I can improve my defensive in one area I'll drop them somewhere for more damage. If I wanted to build an immortal spec we all could..but the game would get boring fast. (think the original Tank Dr's). It's why my WD is in the high 70's and my Barb is in the 30's. Sometimes I fall asleep at my desk while spinning, with a simple ring change he is pretty much impossible to kill unless I really space out.
11/28/2012 02:35 PMPosted by eviLal3x
So for testing purpose I bought a top of the line manajuma's carving knife for 450 million gold,


First off, hats off to you! You are one crazy dude buying that knife to test it! Now what are you going to do with it besides resell it? :)

There is really no sense in going back and forth on this issue, people like what they like. All I can say is if you haven't tried a LS Skorn or Rare 2H and you have DPS over 100K, then you really should give it a go to see if you like it.

I got one a couple of weeks ago, it improved my DPS about 8K, but it is really, really, fun to rock that LS in MP6. I still have my one hand + mojo but they aren't coming out of the hut anytime soon.
If you ever want to kill MP5 and up fast use 2 handers, other than that play on MP 0-2 and call it a day.
11/28/2012 09:13 PMPosted by battletag
If you ever want to kill MP5 and up fast use 2 handers, other than that play on MP 0-2 and call it a day.


huh, that's weird I seem to have no problems killing fast in mp5+ with my 1h setup, nor do many of the other people I play with.. Hmm must be a mirage. This guy clearly isn't farming mp10 with a 1h setup.. http://www.twitch.tv/microfastsc2 It's all a MYTH!
11/28/2012 09:13 PMPosted by battletag
If you ever want to kill MP5 and up fast use 2 handers, other than that play on MP 0-2 and call it a day.


Uhhh... is MP5 supposed to take a long time? I can fly through MP5 and MP6 with my 1h/mojo setup lol
450m for testing... you have my respect.

brahm has a good point. eventhough 2 hand leeches more, it also reflects more dmg. i went a little over board with my dmg to defensive stats recently. and i was one shotting myself with big crits from dead rush.

i think it's important to find that sweet spot where you are hitting hard but not one shotting urself and getting hp back from ls and globe drops. i made a video before which i was at that sweet spot. but i upgraded my gear recently and went over board, and i am having trouble with reflects again... so now i've been working on boosting my defence again. oh well, or i can just use horrify armor.

one good surething about 1 hand is that you will unlikely to one shot urself vs reflects.
*sigh*

We've been round and round on this a dozen times here. 1-H and mojo will deal more damage provided you can feed it. At the top end, it's around 20% assuming all other gear remains constant.

The extra LL from 2-H makes you a LOT sturdier.

Which is more important depends upon the MP you intend to play. In general, if you want XP you want a 1-H/mojo for low MP speed runs, and if you want drops you want the 2-H to run middle MPs. If you want to kill ubers, the extra LL is indispensable.
*sigh*

We've been round and round on this a dozen times here. 1-H and mojo will deal more damage provided you can feed it. At the top end, it's around 20% assuming all other gear remains constant.

The extra LL from 2-H makes you a LOT sturdier.

Which is more important depends upon the MP you intend to play. In general, if you want XP you want a 1-H/mojo for low MP speed runs, and if you want drops you want the 2-H to run middle MPs. If you want to kill ubers, the extra LL is indispensable.


pretty much all that needs to be said on the matter.

though i would argue that a 1600+ dps skorn, using AC would 1 shot A LOT of stuff on screen at lower MP's and you could make arguement its just as good as 1h at that level.

but i digress...
I like the "middle ground" - slow one hand. Pretty good on mana, and low demand so they are cheap.

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