DISCUSSION: Marquis Ruby vs Marquis Emerald.

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I tried out both and ghom-time was about the same. Sheet dps is about the same (I'm >2.74) as well but emerald slightly edges out ruby if I'm solo'ing with scoundrel. Will play with ruby the next day or so to see how it compares to the emerald when farming :D The difference for me is tiny, within 1k so it doesn't much matter. Will play a bit and see how it feels, hehe.
02/16/2013 08:17 PMPosted by Grishnakh
Essentially, if you have over 2.7 aps as a true cm wiz should have, ruby all day. If you are an archon wiz or meteor/kite build, go for the emerald. And of course if you feel like wasting the slot, go for a topaz.

We need to see a stop to these blanket statements that say Ruby is always better than Emerald for case X. Those general statements have no mathematical basis and most of them have been wrong. In my case, Emerald > Ruby for my CMWW gear. Granted, I'm only at 2.5 APS but if I added IAS to my gear while keeping my other stats the same it wouldn't change that for the reason mentioned below.

As someone pointed out around the 3rd page, IAS on weapons have no impact on which gives more dps, emerald or ruby. Also, bonus elemental damage from zuni, Tals amulet, etc have no impact. Finally, weapon APS actually has no direct impact on which gives more char sheet dps.

As I posted earlier, the calculation for char sheet dps is
Char Sheet DPS = (([base weapon dmg + ruby dmg] * (1+BD) + offhand dmg + elemental dmg / (1 + %ED) + jewelry dmg affixes) * base weapon aps ) * (1 + cc*cd) * (1 + %ias) * (1 + %ED).

To compare ruby vs Emerald, look at the ratio of Ruby DPS / Emerald DPS. If it's greater than 1, ruby is better. If it's less than 1, Emerald is better. When you form that ratio the IAS and ED% terms cancel out, as does the base weapon APS because it's assumed to be unchanged for the gem comparison.

In short, what matters is weapon damage and CC/CD values. Weapon damage happens to be indiractly impacted by APS since for a given weapon DPS, a faster APS weapon will have less damage and thus ruby will tend to be better for faster weapons than slower weapons. However, overall APS doesn't matter for the comparison.
Hey folks, little late to the party but wanted to provide some input (I'm the guy behind D3Up).

The Ruby Calculations on D3Up.com are indeed accurate for MOST people, including my characters. However, I've gotten a few emails from people where they are off by like 5k-10k total DPS, so it's a big difference, and I'm trying to figure out what's causing it.

It's been hard over the past two days, as the API isn't responding and people aren't able to reliably sync their characters to the site. Hopefully that will be resolved soon and it'll make my debugging of the calculations a lot easier.

So be cautious while using the site. It is probably accurate for most people, but there are instances where it's not, and I'm working to resolve that!
Nice Jesta, thanks for the great site, hope to have all the sync issues fixed! I waited for a couple days and finally decided to just unsocket the emerald and try the ruby, hehe.
Do I hurr durr more weapon damage?
Do I hurr durr crit dmg as a DM for weapon damage?
How does one decide such groundbreaking build choices?
Please help I hurrrr durrrrrrrr.
Any comment from anyone thought about this or have done a test?[/quote]

well i have tested it little bit and i would definetely recommend ruby instead of eme for wizs with one handed weapon with decent AS, at least 1.5, cause it will calculate your dmg lot higher with decent AS. And especially for hydra users only way to go, cause Hydra dont crit :)
Wow, I got a comment from the guy behind D3up website. It made my day, I think it all comes down to sheet dips calc depending on the gem. Hopefully the calculation done by d3up is accurate so we know which one is the best for you. As I said, ruby gave me higher dps than emerald.
I test a little higher with emerald even though sheet is higher with ruby like 0.53x. My wand is a 45% 1100 DPS 1.65. I also test highest at lowest IAS feasible. Tested everything from 3.35 down to 2.5. 2.5 is best with 9.35x sheet. 3.35 is worst with only 6.69x. Anyway just thought i throw that out there. I don't really play anymore but if i did I'd shoot for 30 apoc 60 crit and max CD I could get @ 2,5.
But according to Arkane's calculation, if you have CD over 288 without Emerald, then go with Ruby. Below, then go with Emerald.

Yodatoy, when I told you that, it was only for my character :)

The amount will vary for other people depending on their other stats (which based on Loroese's post would be weapon damage and critical chance in addition to critical dmg when comparing ruby vs emerald).
As you can see, i have Marquise emerald in my mh (ef).
Before i had emerald in my mh, i calculated my dps by using d3up and emerald had edge over ruby on paper sheet dps. (it saids 10k tdps increase lol)
However, im wondering if i should change emerald to ruby.. why?
because i feel like i can benefit from higher average damage from ruby than emerald.
i have around 51 cc and 219 cd without emerald gem
i know that people say higher the cc, its probably better to have more cd = (marquise emerald) than having ruby in ur mh.

My question is, wouldnt skills with +weapon damamge %" benefit from higher damage weapon?
right now i am using weapon throw (130~169% from weapon damage)build with pretty decent attack speed.

i need some pro barbs to answer these questions for me lol before i waste gold to unsocket and make another marquise gem.
CM Wizard

CC 58%
CD 323% (433% with Emerald)
Attacks per Second 3.02

Over 300k damage in either setup.

Ruby wins out against against Emerald (slightly)
MP8 Azmodan Fight is the test.
It depends on two factors:

1) What weapon you are holding when you put the Marquise gem into.

2) What your CC/CD overall is.

I did the math with a Marquise Ruby vs Emerald on a Skorn for instance. On my current Skorn, my damage drops significantly.

If you had like 5% CC at the start and you equipped the Ruby, the damage would definitely be in your favor.
i think sb said is true, sb said ias n cc is the proc to cd not really affect the real dmg. what make the dps change is depands on your weapon. if your weapon got 40%+ enhanced dmg, ruby most likely will be better.

this page show i am using ruby, if i use emerald,
Damage per Hit, average Hit Range, average Hit Range (critical) will has slightly disavantage than use ruby, that mean theorically ruby did better sheet DPS n real DPS. and in real case, i test on MP8, it has slightly different between them, seems ruby did a very little bit better although ruby got 9k more sheet DPS

in another case my friend (DH) using Manticore with life steal, 2 soc nut no enhanced dmg, his test result is both 2 soc should use emerald, different from others with enhanced dmg manticore can use 1 ruby+ 1 emerald

ops, i see this topic in right hand corner of home page, and now discovered that this is wizard forum, sorry for offtopic ...
My opinion:
Emeralds are for players, rubies are for followers.
Cant u just test it out with. Radiant stars? Make your own conusion and do what u wanna do. Thats the nice thing about d3
So, I was playing with Phillz (a creative WD player who ripped me in PVP) last night and it came to our attention that possibly Marquis Ruby might be better with overall damage for OS Chanto Will.

Has anyone tested the actual real dps with Marquis Ruby?
For example, I unsocketed my Marquis Emerald by spending 5M, placed Radiant Ruby (don't have Marquis Ruby yet) and ran few MP10 Demonic Essence run in Warriors Rest.

I can't tell you the number but from strictly the pure feeling of the efficiency, Radiant Ruby with new min-max certainly took down the elite as fast or may be faster than having Marquis Emerald.

It can make sense b/c with Ruby wiih new min-max, you are causing the damage through out instead of just occurrence of critical chance and possibly Ruby might be better for faster APS like most of SNS CM wizzes.

Any comment from anyone thought about this or have done a test?

I would say on a char that doesn't have a great amount of crit the Ruby may be better. It's all on how much you crit. I have a monk with 41 - 45% crit chance plus more dex equals more dmg on the monk so for me the only choice would be the emerald.

With a 41 - 45% crit chance and a crit dmg increase of 350% and a base dmg buffed of 97K that's 300-400K dmg in a single swing almost every other swing. Now the emeralds I have now give me 70% increase if I replace those I lose 140% on dual wield which puts me at 210% crit dmg increase which equates to 200 - 215K dmg crits every other hit.

With my monk build rubies would only hurt me but you have to evaluate your build and see what would give you over all more dmg. If your crit chance is below 15% then I'd stick to rubies.

You can look at my profile but for some reason it doesn't show the values I see in game. Not sure why that is.
OK, I bump and derail at same time LOL

5x marquis topaz give me 2.3k DPS and 1.5k EHP. Looks like I will most definitely NEVER be upgrading my INT gems...

They would have to be +68 x5 to do anything meaningful...

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