Barbarian game balancing

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I guess when you talk about class changes it brings out the trolls, well any ways thank you to the people that responded. Figured I would share this as Im sure its fairly common knowledge but when itwas said then what do you propose every barb goes ww spec well actualy Travis Day just said how they dont like how barb's are beng pigeon holed into the build and they may be changing it.
Barbs are one of the few classes that actually have a few viable builds, I'd go over them, but then youd just ask for more nerfs.

You should be asking for the same flexibility for your own class, instead of suggesting changes made to classes you don't play.
03/01/2013 01:15 PMPosted by RagingKoala
Barbs are one of the few classes that actually have a few viable builds,

And this is truly what makes the best class in the game IMO. Not how "op" they are, just that there are so many good options that people actually get to fight over what's best.
Actualy they only have 2 builds all other are sub par and kind of a gimmick, ww and hoa thats it.
They do have plans to provide more flexible builds so players can branch out more but right now any thing else would be called less efficient.
Actualy they only have 2 builds all other are sub par and kind of a gimmick, ww and hoa thats it.
They do have plans to provide more flexible builds so players can branch out more but right now any thing else would be called less efficient.

So we have two builds you say, and you want changes to be made, making one of those builds' viability cut in half in order to help prevent us from being "pigeon holed" into the WW build?
If you really would like to split hairs ww is just second best and is not even close to the strength of hoa, but did you not read the post by Travis Day? or the q&a with wyatt cheng
Hota barb threads want their hate back. They got it 3 months ago. You're late.

While you Hota around, you can't tornado the shirt out of the monsters so you rely on your LS and hopre not to die.

So how is your permafreeze Wiz going so far?
03/01/2013 01:38 PMPosted by Kiro
ww is just second best and is not even close to the strength of hoa

Okay, you're absolutely clueless. It's painfully obvious that you have no experience with actually playing the class. I'd suggest refraining from posting any more on this topic to prevent you from embarrassing yourself any further.
As a barb 93 paragon, I want to rage at op. How about blizzard nerfs the class op is playing?

LEAVE BARBS ALONE. The devs said they want characters to feel op. They said they don't want to balance/nerf/weaken classes for the sake of pvp or for the sake of balance. This is diablo 3, an action rpg. This is not a World of warcraft.

I disagree with every nerf op wants the barb to have. Go away.
Your job is to use the most useless skills with your godlike gear and fingerskills to show everyone how it's really done and how cool you are.

Did I miss anything?

Ok, sorry that I have to ask this, particularly because I am using a barb... I might look very noob now, but I risk it:

1) How do you get 100% crit chance?

The tooltip says that you can have 1% increased crit chance (meaning on top what you already got) for every 5 fury.

My barb has 113 fury without having any maximum fury gear. The maximum fury you can have in addition is 35 fury having a belt, which gives 15 max fury, the IK set, which gives 5 additional max fury, and the ring Stone of Jordan with 15 max fury. So we will be at 148 maximum fury in total.

Now, casting HotA costs 20 fury. If you have the right ring, Stone of Jordan that is, it might be even only 16 fury because the ring reduces the casting cost by 4 fury. So we will be at 132 fury. Once HotA casted, we will have 26.4% additional crit chance. On top of what?

Let's check the top barb with highest crit chance in the world. According to DiabloProgress it is a barb with 63.50% crit chance:


So, we would be at 90% crit chance. Now, there are two passives that give 15% crit chance. And there is Battle Rage that gives 3% crit chance. So, if you are top crit chance barb you could cover up the 100%. Not easily, though.

2) How is this spammable?

Yes, there is no cooldown on the skill, but you have to gain those 16 fury back as soon as you spent it, otherwise your crit chance will decrease. Let's say we have Superstition for 3 fury, plus the IK set with 2 more fury. We need to produce 11 more fury with every hit. However, a hit gives like 6 fury (as far as I could see). We still miss 5 further fury. Do I miss something?

3) How this is unfair compared to other classes?

WD has 0 dog build, which isn't cheap or easy to obtain. Wiz can perma-freeze, which isn't easy after nerf, but still possible. Monk can (nearly) perma-stun. I saw even one reaching 100% dodging chance. DH can perma-gloom. And... [Insert here your own ideas of what could be op compared to other classes...]

I think, since it is not easy to obtain the 100% crit chance (or am i wrong?), and even more difficult to spam it, I think it should be fine the way it is. And yes, I am a barb, and no, I am not using this build (although it sounds interesting to try it out).

Edit: I just tested it and saw that a hit gives 3 fury only (not 6 as I said above). So there still need to be 3 more fury to be gained to make this build work...

Edit2: I don't know why my barb indicated 113 fury as base, but it is 100 only. So my whole calculation is actually influenced by this. Just wanted to point this out.
I want Blizzard to nerf ops highest paragon class, then he will see how it feels.
Ki vegetablebrain Ro, dont ask for a nerf. Ask for a buff to other class' skills instead. Like DH should have a skill like into the fray, which adds hatred per crit.
@ forelle
you get a stone and mara's and reduce the cost to 1( as you cant have 0 because then you cant use the skill) and then when ever you use the attack it generates fury. so all you would do is get enough crit chance to offset the difference from the skill, bringing it to 100%.

incorrect, ww is good but its just second tier. Hoa barb's right now do 5mill critical hits thats on a 100% crit chance. constantly laying down ww and getting more aps to make the generate additional attaaks is nice for trying to saturate damage for farming. but you can build a barbarian right now with a 100% crit chance that is then criting for 5million to a single target while the attack is an aoe one and a much larger radius then ww( just does not persist.)

balance does not need to exist in hack and slash arpgs. So what if one class is far superior to the rest. THIS ISNT WOW!There is no competition or content races. this is a sandbox sim. nothing more. quit the "nerf mentality" and understand that this game does NOT require class balance. farming more efficiently or beating inferno faster or even lame brawling requires ZERO balancing.
how do you know so much about a build that very few people even use and you do not even use that class?
The barbarian class with the right amount of gear required for this build breaks the game in the since of game balance. all other classes even with items such as SoJ and Mara's have their largest attack ability sitting either on a cool down or have a fairly expensive cost equaling to 50% of their resource bar.

What's the right amount? Sum of gear worth 10,000 gold? 10M gold? 1B gold?

To bring the ability in line with the rest of the game I propose these changes to the skill.
Increase fury cost by 10
reduce base damage to 206%
reduce smash to make 306% in total

Might as well take the skill out of the barbarian's skill set.

What these three changes will do with out destroying the build in the least is this.

If your definition of destroying something is making it better, then you're correct: your changes will not make the it better!

I am sure I will have player response of how expensive it is to accomplish this build. Price is not what I am trying to address but actual game balance.

It's very expensive to make it work --- especially for an ability that hits for a very small area (even smaller than with the smash rune).
Hi Kiro, oh, that is what I missed. Thanks!

So we have Mara's that will reduce the cost by 4 more fury, so that we are left with 1 fury more spending than gaining. Mathematically this is still a decrease... I don't want to be picky, but try to figure out how you can permanently use HotA without running out of fury.

Plus you need to be at maximum fury. A barb loses fury as long he isn't hitting anything (or hit by anything, considering Superstition; I consider Unforgiving not as an option since it would mean to sacrifice one of the two passives that give more critical hit chance).

I still believe it is hard to obtain (I have never tried it myself). Maybe a HotA barb with such a build could say something how easy it is to spam the skill... Would be interesting. Not for calling for nerfs or anything (I don't have that in mind at all). I just believe that it looks fine in theory, but is not really playable in game.

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