Game changing legendaries? Let's go deeper

General Discussion
Hi guys,

The latest Developer Journal about itemization update is something I was waiting for a long time. I, and few people before and after me, proposed flexible ilvl idea long time ago (see this topic for reference: ), and I'm glad that this will be introduced to the game.

In that Developer Journal Travis Day also wrote this:

Increased Item Diversity:

Item diversity is a topic that comes up a lot. Right now when people are talking about the best items in the game or looking for ways to improve their power they gravitate towards items with Critical Chance, Critical Damage, and Attack Speed. While these stats are great for boosting your damage they aren’t necessarily interesting or what we like to call "game changing."

We want players to feel like entire new builds can open up if they get their hand on the right items.

My proposition is to introduce items that will really impact the way this game can be played. I'll focus on three general ideas in this topic, and provide a link to the other one, with lots of possible changes as well.


Problem with this class is well known. There are only two valid builds with only slight variations, that are effective, and one really shines on higher monster power levels. Freezing CM build and Archon build, are simply the way to go. A Wizard Orb that allows for two Hydras to be active at once, that was mentioned by Travis in blog, while sounds like a lot of fun, can't make a real difference, as this spell is used mainly in pvp, which isn't the core of this game.

In "Ask the Devs" Round 1, Don said:

Since launch, we’ve been increasing the damage on the Wizard’s Secondary abilities to try and make them useful tools in specific builds and for specific play styles. While we believe we’ve made them viable for specific builds and specific gear setups, these builds are being overshadowed by the ease and effectiveness of CM and Archon. We don’t want to just keep on increasing numbers, as that would make that class spiral out of control balance-wise.

So why shouldn't we introduce new legendary set, that can give us at least an option to try something different? Like this one, for example:

New Set
Aranoch's Lost Heritage

The Prophecy
Legendary Set Wand

777.4–1302.0 (high possible dmg here because of low dmg of orb, and low aps of wand)
Damage Per Second

1.40 Attacks per Second (we need to be sure it won't be used for cm wizz)
+(numbers to tweak) Arcane Damage (so it won't make rares and Echoing Fury obsolete, and won't be used for Archon Build with Triumvirate)
+41–50% Damage
+150–169 Intelligence
Critical Hits grant 9–10 Arcane Power (Wizard Only)
+1 Random Magic Properties (making socket possible)

Helded once by powerful archmage Viz-Ghul from Aranoch, who protected the city of Lut Gholein.

Alliance of Aranoch
Legendary Set Orb

+(28–110)–(29–405) Damage
+170–200 Intelligence
+13–15 Maximum Arcane Power (Wizard Only)
Critical Hits grant 9–10 Arcane Power (Wizard Only)
Critical Hit Chance Increased by 9.0–10%
Increases Attack Speed of Secondary Skills by 9-20%
+1 Random Magic Properties

The source of unlimited wisdom and arcane power. Emanates with glowing energy.

Set bonus:

2 armor spells can be active at a time
Reduced Arcane Power cost of Secondary Skills by 50%

Numbers can be tweaked but the idea is simple - make secondary skills a valid option and fun to play. Make people want to try this and leave that cm build for a while. Let's have two armor spells active at the time, that will draw people to give it a shot, but because of lowered aps of the wand, no ias on orb and increased speed of secondary skills - freezing isn't the best idea with this, Chantodo's will be still way better for cm folks. Archon build will still be better with Triumvirate and Echoing Fury, or amazing rare 1h. That's how I perceive "game changing legendaries".

Now you could combine this with new Helm of Command, for free casting of secondaries, and the item itself could be a source of diversity and viable alternative to Mempo for all classes:

The Helm of Command - new version can't be crafted

+184-189 Vitality
+8% Chance to Block
+40 Physical Resistance
+61-80 Resistance to All Elements

One of 25 Magic Properties (varies):
Reduces cooldown of Call of the Ancients by 10-20 seconds. (Barbarian Only)
Reduces cooldown of Earthquake by 10-20 seconds. (Barbarian Only)
Reduces cooldown of Wrath of the Berserker by 10-20 seconds. (Barbarian Only)
Reduces resource cost of Rage Skills by 25-50 Fury. (Barbarian Only)
+13-15 Maximum Fury (Barbarian Only)
Reduces cooldown of Rain of Vengeance by 3-9 seconds. (Demon Hunter Only)
Reduces resource cost of Secondary Skills by 12-20%. (Demon Hunter Only)
Increases Attack Speed of Archery Skills by 12-20%. (Demon Hunter Only)
Reduces cooldown of Preparation by 6-10 seconds. (Demon Hunter Only)
+9-10 Maximum Discipline (Demon Hunter Only)
Reduces resource cost of Cyclone Strike by 20 Spirit. (Monk Only)
Reduces resource cost of Sweeping Wind by 25 Spirit. (Monk Only)
Increases Mystic Ally Damage by 35-50%. (Monk Only)
Reduces cooldown of Seven-Sided Strike by 3-9 seconds. (Monk Only)
Increases Spirit Regeneration by 1.00-2.33 per Second (Monk Only)
Reduces cooldown of Summon Zombie Dogs by 3-9 seconds. (Witch Doctor Only)
Reduces cooldown of Fetish Army by 10-20 seconds. (Witch Doctor Only)
Reduces cooldown of Big Bad Voodoo by 10-20 seconds. (Witch Doctor Only)
Increases Mana Regeneration by 11-15 per second. (Witch Doctor Only)
+155–169 Maximum Mana (Witch Doctor Only)
Reduces resource cost of Secondary Skills by 4-6 Arcane Power. (Wizard Only)
Reduces cooldown of Archon by 10-20 seconds. (Wizard Only)
Reduces cooldown of Teleport by 4-6 seconds. (Wizard Only)
Increases Life of Mirror Images by 35-50%. (Wizard Only)
+13-15 Maximum Arcane Power (Wizard Only)

Critical Hit Chance Increased by 3–6%
empty socket

Demon Hunter

Problem with this class? Low edps (not dps on paper, that's actually high) compared to other classes on high MP levels and effectiveness of Manticore build. Sure, you can try playing in a different way using Calamity with lower dps overall, but popularity of Manticore is overwhelming and beyond the question.

I'm absolutely against any nerfs - just make Dual Wielding for DH's a valid option. Change rolls on rare hand crossbows (anyone seen someone using a rare?), and change legendaries to the point, where you could at least try something different (mind this; we don't want to make Manticore obsolete).

For example, you could try to make this play style more attractive by adding few affixes to already existing legends and making Archery and Secondary Skills more desirable:

Danetta's Creed Set Bonus:

+130 Dexterity
Now Increases Damage Against Elites by 7%

add two more guaranteed affixes:
Reduces resource cost of Archery Skills by 25%
Increases Attack Speed of Secondary Skills by 12%

Danetta's Revenge

dps range 693.7–1202.5 instead of 693.7–1116.0

Danetta's Spite

dps range 693.7–1202.5 instead of 693.7–1116.0

Natalya's Slayer

dps range 612.0–1093.5 instead of 612.0–853.8
add 3 more guaranteed affixes:
Critical Hit Damage Increased by 66-100%
2.20-2.50% of Damage Dealt Is Converted to Life
Increases Attack Speed of Archery Skills by 12%

Also strong buff to unused skills and runes is mandatory - dh, class that was designed to be a heavy damage dealer ranged class that uses dark powers to avoid death, has a lowest effective dps of all the classes. I had top Manticore and happily switched back to my Monk with Echoing Fury and Wizz with Chantodo's Will.

Witch Doctor

Bears, Dogs and Acid Rains on low MP levels - not bad. What is the problem? Even if you're great at mana management, current regen value is so low, that you'll literally run out of resources while playing on highs mp with good gear. This is the only class in game with really significant handicap regarding resource regen - it should be adjusted.

But back to improving legendaries that change the way game is played. Gidbinn and Fetish Army skill has so much potential:

The Gidbinn

dps range increased to 652.4–1285.1
+220–260 Intelligence
31–35% Better Chance of Finding Magical Items
+205–219 Maximum Mana (Witch Doctor Only)
Chance to summon a Fetish when attacking
Fetishes fights till they die (includes summoned from Fetish Army)
+2 Random Magic Properties

Another item could give us ability to transfer Locust Swarm on dogs, and spread the disease! :)

That's all for now, hope to get some feedback from you guys and maybe even a blue post, who knows. You can find more of my ideas here (including shields, redesigning 2handers, and many many more):
i really like that new set for wizard. and new gidbinn - those little fetishes should run the show like in the Kurast :-).
really guys? not even "you suck" and those changes "suck" argument? :)
The Helm of Command - new version can't be crafted

What do you mean by new version can't be crafted?
04/03/2013 02:13 AMPosted by kenzou
The Helm of Command - new version can't be crafted

What do you mean by new version can't be crafted?

if it is a new alternative to mempo, with nice possible stats and a boost to particular skill, you shouldn't be able to craft it anymore, right?
feedback from eu forum:

The problem I see for WD's is that no sane player would ever equip a non-ls weapon in higher mp's.
Though, I love the idea of a legendary that makes summons proc loh, thus it would enable the use of items such as a gidbinn.

With such a weapon I would swap to summon dogs, gargant, fetish army, fetish on proc passive, zombie handler etc in an instant. :D

Give us a set that doubles or triples the amount of summoned zombie dogs/gargantuans! I want to zerg down enemies.

legendary item that doubles (or have 50% chance at least) the amount of summoned fetishes/gargantuans is a really good idea :-). dogs are too powerful with sacrifice, i'd say no to them.

bump for more ideas/opinions!
feedback from eu forum:

Off hands for wizards and WDs are NOT go so low on damage, no weapon can roll a damage that's low anymore (fire etc...) so why do off hands for WDs and Wizards?

It's a joke and makes our off hands costs an absolute fortune (or the good WD ones anyway) so it needs sorting out ASAP.

The idea of the itemisation patch should be that if a legendary drops it's actually useful even if not perfect, meaning if the source you mentioned rolled 28-29 damage which it could it would be an instant brim meaning a pointless useless legendary item.

Other than that I like the concept and ideas.

that's a valid point and i totally agree. if you'd take a moment and see my other topic ( ), you'd see that this is exactly what i had in mind. i presented damage numbers in a mixed formula (possible high dmg number but with a current philosophy that you can roll a useless one as well), because my focus is more on useful affixes on every legend (which now is more like few bis items, and rest of the items are meaningless), rather than on numbers.

i simply don't believe that they will change their stance to achieve effect you mentioned. the game is tuned for ah and rmah, if avg dmg numbers of off hands, for example, were more like "always useful", auction house wouldn't be that relevant, so i think we're speaking here in terms of utopia.

Gidbinn needs base MR on it plus the chance of CD and a socket and LS for it to be even bothered with.

i agree with possibility of 2 afixes to roll, but 3 would make gidbinn an ultimate weapon and that shouldn't be the case. the idea of this item is to mass produce free army of fetishes, that will fight till end, not another "upgraded" manajuma with crit and ls. if you want pure dmg, you should switch to carving knife, here you can play with something else for a while. i've increased mana and int bonus though, thanks for your feedback.

I don't like uber-legendaries or sets. I think all item types should have a use for. Right now blues make normal items obsolete, rares make blues obsolete, leg/sets make rares obsolete.

Uber-leg/sets will make everybody use the same stuff, which is already partly happening and hurts variety.

there are still slots for rare items - right now for example, lots of people focused on crafting shoulders, amu, gloves and bracers. there are rings with amazing damage, limited jewelry with affixes like life on hit, that are needed so much by wizards, and the list keeps going on.

actually mixing rares and legends in inventory, as it is right now, is quite ok to me. legendaries should have this feeling of uniqueness and be powerful by all means, they are legendary after all.

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