Cost... holy crap!

Play Mode Discussion
04/22/2018 10:21 AMPosted by Hazama
3 xbox games? Are you high? Maybe if they're 3 years old. Jesus what a lie. Now this is in US Currency for me, but a brand new AAA game is 64.19 with tax. So you're full of it even with the conversion considered.


Do you every wonder why you've been down voted so many times? Perhaps it's the misdirection? Doesn't matter if it's a AAA game or not, Hearthstone is crazy expensive. I honestly can't wait until Artifact comes out. I'll be on my way back to Steam. I know you won't miss me but Blizzard might. At least me and the millions of other players who have common sense. Enjoy playing against the Inn Keeper once that happens.
I have put $20 or maybe $30 into the game. What is that? 3 booster drafts in MTG?
3 movies?

Hearthstone isn't expensive, as long as you don't want to collect the full set. But other collectible card games get expensive at that point too.

But there is no resell value of the cards!
Yeah but what exactly is the value of the cards you get from a booster draft in Mtg? And can you find people that are willing to trade a good rare card for your 4 bad ones?
It is difficult to argue with kids who spend lunch money on YuGiOh booster packs, arcade machines or even drugs.

Human physiology has no reason.
04/22/2018 10:03 PMPosted by Bluefin


Do you every wonder why you've been down voted so many times? Perhaps it's the misdirection? Doesn't matter if it's a AAA game or not, Hearthstone is crazy expensive. I honestly can't wait until Artifact comes out. I'll be on my way back to Steam. I know you won't miss me but Blizzard might. At least me and the millions of other players who have common sense. Enjoy playing against the Inn Keeper once that happens.


Amen brother! See you in Artifact! We will be able to trade our cards there like a real TCG!
Mostly, Hearthstone isn't expensive if you've been playing a long time. For people just starting, it's quite an investment to get into it and to get to feel like you're participating in the game and not just a rank 20 doormat for returning players to wipe their shoes off on.

People arguing that it's not so bad, as long as you don't need to have all the cards are being disingenuous. I put over $100 into KotFT and I *still* didn't have all the cards. So, yeah, it's expensive, even if you don't have all the cards. The other thing this ignores is the way the meta functions. Regular expansions and card adjustments that follow, along with the impossibility of balancing the game leads to a rotating cast of powerful classes and cards.

Got a really developed Shaman collection? Well, too !@#$ing bad. Shutterwock, Grumble and Hagatha are in now. Your deck is %^-*. Git gud.

Most of your good cards Hunter? Well, tough. Hunter suck this meta. Git gud.

I stopped spending on HS after Frozen Throne and it made the game more difficult. I have to decide what deck I want to play first, then, if it doesn't get nerfed, I get to play that deck and maybe another competitively.

And I've got it good. I've been playing since launch and I can go back and cannibalize my collection if I really feel the need. And, you know, funny thing that. I used to be really hesitant to dust my stuff, but I just haven't been playing as much. Dusting anything doesn't feel like cutting deep, anymore. It's just whatever. Unless I love the card and know I'll get a lot of use out of it in Wild, who the !@#$ cares? Am I going to keep x legacy card on the off-chance it will be insanely powerful for a week during some wacky tavern brawl? Get real.

Keeping up with my quests in the lead-up to Witchwood felt like a chore and, sure, I'm having fun now but how long does that really last?

The answer I keep coming back to is that the dust economy is busted. Between the 800 dust you'll need for two-of the critical epics that flip games and the 1600 per legendary you'll almost certainly need a few of (especially since there's roughly 40% more of them now)... I mean, honestly, how many legendaries should a person need to burn to create a deck?

AND THAT'S IF YOU ONLY EVER WANT TO PLAY ONE DECK

Who the hell wants to play the same deck day in and day out for four months? If you said 'I do!' then, I'm afraid that's the wrong answer because the answer is 'Not everyone and not most people. You're !@#$ing weird.'

I mean, look, people are going to ignore my arguments and not really read it and they're going to say I'm bitter because whatever or I can't afford whatever. Or, you know, whatever. We all know it, they say the same %^-* everytime.

But this is all coming from someone who has 'enough' to get by. This is coming from someone who is going to play seriously for a month, then I will barely keep up with my quests until the next thing is announced. If Heartstone shut down tomorrow, I honestly wouldn't care all that much. More than anything, I'd be annoyed that the digital goods I don't technically own aren't there for me to oogle and fawn over.

But consider approaching all of that as a new player, who doesn't know they should probably dust their first legendary or if they should or not. Is it good? Will it be good tomorrow? Easy questions to us, not so to a new player.

Consider approaching it as a poor player who has the skills but is struggling to keep up with a meta that is constantly evolving (partially because it's a sales boost). Sure, if they're good they can compete. But what when they run into someone else that is good and HAS THE CARDS? Sucks to be you, scrub.

Consider approaching it as a dumb player. Someone that just isn't ever going to be real good but, you know, just likes to see cool, random !@#$ happen. I mean, really, that's like half the %^-*ing appeal of Hearthstone. How much fun is it going to be to have all the cool !@#$ happen at you, except the rare case that the other guy's %^-* just happens to backfire and you benefit from it?

Anyone who think Hearthstone is fairly priced is either (a) not paying attention, (b) loudly virtue signaling on an internet forum ('I can afford to waste money' or 'I'm so good, I don't need to waste money' wank wank wank) or, most likely, (c) all of the above.
This is a controversial issue because value is subjective. However, i wanna comment on a couple things:

1-My own point of view:

Honestly i think it is too expensive, yes. I've reduced considerably how much i spend in the game lately. Last year, i would spend 50 euros on preorder plus 64 euros on a 60-pack bundle.

I've decided to spend only 50 euros on preorder, and that's it, the rest of the packs i open are bought with gold. This is because, while i get fun out of the game for 4 months, at some point the meta becomes quite stale and i often just play to finish my dailies and hoard gold. This feels like a chore, actually. Those times i just look forward to finish my daily quest and move on to another game i actually want to play.

This is the result of having invested too much in the game, both money and time wise. I know for sure i wouldnt keep playing if i started today.

Anyway, i currently spend 50 euros for 4 months of more or less 'full' access to the game, mainly because i have a nice gold and dust stash which allow me to keep my collection acceptably complete, save for a handful of useless legendaries or epics (Nat Pagle, Skeleton Knight for instance).

But yes, overall i agree with the point the op is making. Some changes could be awarding a free arena ticket as a quest reward, giving out 1 random pack for the first win of the day, and increasing gold to 10 per 2 wins or 5 per win. The +20 packs on preorder should definitely stay, making preorders effectively 70 packs instead of 50, otherwise i'll have to consider to stop preordering altogether.

In my case it's not a money issue. I could go on spending 110 euros like last year, but imo i dont get enough fun out of the game, hence why i reduced the money i put into it.

2-The op's comparison:

Now here i wanted to comment on this. I agree with the op's point, but he is using hyperbole too much. Here in Spain, a 60 pack bundle is 64 euros. A new XBOX game is 65-70 euros.

You can buy used games (depending on how old, but assuming they are fairly new) for maybe 50 or so (same applies to ps4, and PC games are cheaper), but the op was implying new games clearly.

I am perfectly aware you can buy 2-3 used games with 64 euros, you can even buy like 7-8+ games in Steam for that money. But, you definitely cant buy 3 new Xbox games with that money.

Besides, there are many aspects you have to factor in. Hearthstone provides me with many hours of entertainment for 2 months, and then the next 2 become more or less a grind. However, most Xbox (or AAA) games just provide you with 15-20 hours of play, way less than Hearthstone.

So, the op is exaggerating a lot, and comparisons are not that simple. But the point still stands imo.
Before the first 10 pack legendary pit timer, it is crazy that you open 40 packs and get 1 useless legendary.

You have to dust 16 packs to craft a legendary.

If this is not expensive, I don't know what it is.

To be fair, I tried a few "generous" Hearthstone clones (Shadowverse and Eternal). They are actually more expensive if you PAY.
You get more from the daily.

It makes sense. Someone has to PAY .
If F2P players are not paying, then P2W players pay the rest of the bill.
04/23/2018 07:02 AMPosted by avatar
have to dust 16 packs to craft a legendary.

actually you need at least 40* if you don't pull any higher rarity cards or if the ones you got you also need so you don't disenchant...

that's TOO expensive for just 1 card in a 30 card deck
04/23/2018 09:33 AMPosted by RhokDelar
04/23/2018 07:02 AMPosted by avatar
have to dust 16 packs to craft a legendary.

actually you need at least 40* if you don't pull any higher rarity cards or if the ones you got you also need so you don't disenchant...

that's TOO expensive for just 1 card in a 30 card deck


You don't play the game with 1 legendary card, so that 40 packs - besides the obvious legendary - also give you access to roughly 70% the commons and rares of that expansion. Pretty sure people can start play the game competitively with such investment.

And HS is a card collecting game, you are not supposed to have everything on release day lol. The rest of the cards should be opened during your adventure.
04/23/2018 09:59 AMPosted by NOC
04/23/2018 09:33 AMPosted by RhokDelar
...
actually you need at least 40* if you don't pull any higher rarity cards or if the ones you got you also need so you don't disenchant...

that's TOO expensive for just 1 card in a 30 card deck


You don't play the game with 1 legendary card, so that 40 packs - besides the obvious legendary - also give you access to roughly 70% the commons and rares of that expansion. Pretty sure people can start play the game competitively with such investment.

And HS is a card collecting game, you are not supposed to have everything on release day lol. The rest of the cards should be opened during your adventure.

I start to believe you guys have a narrow sight, so here, step by step:
1- you don't make a deck full of legendaries, but neither you do one full of new cards which are all pretty random
2- let's say, you ALREADY have all commons and rares you need, you lack epics and legendaries
3- you need the dust of at least 10 packs for 1 epic and 40 for 1 legendary
4- even if you pull higher rarity cards from your packs you still lack more dust to craft the cards you were searching for
5- you don't play with only one legendary in a 30 card deck, true, but most top decks need 1 or 2, and some epics too
6- now, i mention top decks, because you would want to get to rank5 at least to get 505 dust from your season reward, but you need to have made and investment from the beginning or make a top deck that is cheap, which happens to be aggro on most cases, which also happens to be satanized
7- you make the deck, a new meta or nerf hits, your deck isn't as useful anymore, you still need dust to make a new one, the cycle repeats

at this point is clear there IS a problem regarding the cost of each card and the "resources" you win to make them, and that new players or casual players arr struggling thus finding the game unappealing on some cases

the game is not f2p as much as we want to claim it: it is true that no card game is f2p, but at least on irl card games you can trade your rare cards for another one with equal value or sell it for its full value, not a 1/4 of it!
@RhokDeler: not gonna quote your post, too long. But you are wrong in making an assumption that people need tier-1 decks instantly to play the game.

Tier-1 is for people aiming for super high legend or going to tournament. You never need them to reach normal legend or just getting to rank 5. Also, using rank 5's reward as the main source of dust is just wrong for many reasons. You would get the same amount in a week just by clear daily quests.

And 40 packs is 4,000 dust which is enough to get a lot of competitive decks in the meta (not Cubelock obviously, but control decks tend to be more expensive). Odd Paladin, another tier-1 deck costs only around 4,000 dust for example, just craft it.
If you think about it's basically like going to your local card and hobby shop and buying a box of card packs for the same price. Maybe a little less but almost that price range for that many packs.
It's to expensive in general that's true. In the end it badly effects the game for everyone,whales included. People playing cheap agro decks or old decks that are good simply because they can't afford to fool around with the new cards.
No game is really fun when the playing field is not level but it's just the way ccg,s work. You can't really do anything against it other then having a very opportunistic approach to the game as well,just like the game has a very opportunistic approach to its customers.

Best games are free and costs have little relation to the enjoyment you get from a game. There are free games that I spend more time on then I will ever do on hs. Hs still is fun though,just don't get involved to deep because you are bound to be disapointed at some point,it is not a fair game.
I used to buy packs in addition to the pre-order amounts, but the price in CAD now is just ridiculous. They only considered exchange rate, but not the Canadian purchasing power. $90 for 60 packs is not remotely viable for most people.
04/23/2018 04:36 PMPosted by Dilliox
I used to buy packs in addition to the pre-order amounts, but the price in CAD now is just ridiculous. They only considered exchange rate, but not the Canadian purchasing power. $90 for 60 packs is not remotely viable for most people.


Why would Blizzard consider purchasing power? GDP per capita of Canada and USA are pretty much on the same page (around $50,000). And that's not consider extra cost that Blizzard incurred by doing business outside of the US.
@NOC dude check your maths first: you get 40 per pack, 10 packs is 400, 40 packs is 1600, not counting you get higher rarity cards, just the minimum amount of dust

and sorry if it mislead you but when I said top I meant everything that is meta worthy and thus can fight: this doesn't include things like freeze shaman, memedeck and homebrews, you NEED the bare amount of epics and legendaries to rank up

and also, I wasn't refering to just using the season reward, I was obviously refering as maximizing your "profit", thus including rewards AND daily quests/gold -and you do need some cards to make goldfarming decks

don't be so narrow minded please, even you should admit you quitted playing razakus once the nerf hit and it wasn't a viable deck anymore, you of all people should know you can't keep up with the meta without a top deck
The 70 pack preorder and quest changes are both steps in the right direction. Hearthstone should be a bit more affordable than it was last year, with free players getting a collection boost from the quest changes.

That being said, HS could use another step or two to become affordable to a wider audience. I personally would like to see an option that makes acquiring full sets easier, maybe just buying all the cards in one package.

What changes would you all suggest?
04/23/2018 04:48 PMPosted by RhokDelar
@NOC dude check your maths first: you get 40 per pack, 10 packs is 400, 40 packs is 1600, not counting you get higher rarity cards, just the minimum amount of dust


There are multiple studies proved that the average cost of one HS pack is 100 dust. Just check reddit for more information, so I stand correct: 40 packs = 40 * 100 = 4,000 dust.
04/23/2018 05:13 PMPosted by NOC
04/23/2018 04:48 PMPosted by RhokDelar
@NOC dude check your maths first: you get 40 per pack, 10 packs is 400, 40 packs is 1600, not counting you get higher rarity cards, just the minimum amount of dust


There are multiple studies proved that the average cost of one HS pack is 100 dust. Just check reddit for more information, so I stand correct: 40 packs = 40 * 100 = 4,000 dust.

oh seriously? then i'm being robbed cause I've never gotten more than 2000 dust from said packs... so no, average doesn't work like that dude

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum