The worst balance change since Warsong

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Exactly one deck runs Mana Wyrm and that’s Tempo Mage, a tier 2 decks and Wyrm isn’t even the main source of its problems. If it even warranted a nerf, it should have been to nerf its stats from a 1/3 to a 1/2. Atleast that wouldn’t completely kill the card.

Aviana was the LAST CARD they should have nerfed in the combo druid deck. The main problem is that 4 mana draw all of your combo pieces in one turn. Aviana SHOULD NOT have been touched. Now she is 100% unplayable. A 10 mana 5/5 do nothing.

Giggling inventor did not need the 2 mana treatment. Cards should not change in mana cost unless the EFFECT has been under/overstatted. Summon two 1/2 taunt divine shields is not worth 7 mana. The nerf should have been to change the card to a 1/1 and nerf it to 6. If you’re playing giggling inventor at 7 mana against aggro, you probably already lost. It wasn’t even game breakingly strong in the first place. It had viable counters. This card is also dead.

GG bliz.
The issue is that there's clear evidence that this plague of polarizing matchups makes the game un-fun.

Only one class can counter combos while everyone else has to resort to aggro.

So what does Blizz do? They... nerf Tempo Mage.

I feel like they could've done something more proactive and creative than boosting a few mana costs.
I agree they should have nerfed psychmelon instead of avianna, but the latter is far from unplayable, just need innervate and kun
At least warsong commander actually addressed the issue - things getting charge. We can argue whether or not one of the things getting charge should have been nerfed instead, or about the severity of the nerf, but at least they went directly to the source.

This nerf just misses the mark on every level.
10/16/2018 01:00 PMPosted by Luffy
Exactly one deck runs Mana Wyrm and that’s Tempo Mage, a tier 2 decks and Wyrm isn’t even the main source of its problems. If it even warranted a nerf, it should have been to nerf its stats from a 1/3 to a 1/2. Atleast that wouldn’t completely kill the card.

Aviana was the LAST CARD they should have nerfed in the combo druid deck. The main problem is that 4 mana draw all of your combo pieces in one turn. Aviana SHOULD NOT have been touched. Now she is 100% unplayable. A 10 mana 5/5 do nothing.

Giggling inventor did not need the 2 mana treatment. Cards should not change in mana cost unless the EFFECT has been under/overstatted. Summon two 1/2 taunt divine shields is not worth 7 mana. The nerf should have been to change the card to a 1/1 and nerf it to 6. If you’re playing giggling inventor at 7 mana against aggro, you probably already lost. It wasn’t even game breakingly strong in the first place. It had viable counters. This card is also dead.

GG bliz.

You place Aviana as if it was a Legendary Priest Minion when you only need one more card to do that Kun combo: Innervate.

Mana was a Snowballing card. The nerf hammer went a little strong there but not that much.

Giggling is acceptable. It was too much value for 5 mana. Maybe without the divine shields or being 0/2 taunts but the hammer went after it.
Mana worm Nerf is a premeditated move so blizzard can make more good cheap spells. Fear of mana worm is probably why we got "minion mage" last expansion and all the big mage push.
10/16/2018 01:14 PMPosted by RhokDelar
I agree they should have nerfed psychmelon instead of avianna, but the latter is far from unplayable, just need innervate and kun


Innervate
Twig of the World Tree
Emperor T
Coin

Any of those 4 things make the aviana combo work exactly as it does currently.

All the nerf did was add a card to the combo and made psychmelon only add 1 of the two (avi or kun).

It was a minor hit to the combo. Blizzard could have gone much, much further, like only allowing the mana discount on a single minion per turn.

Warsong actually got her effect stripped away, I don't know how you compare the two.

I'm wondering a bit why they bothered nerfing ancient of lore though... since for 3 more mana they thought drawing +4 more cards and gaining 5 armor was fine.
10/17/2018 10:00 AMPosted by Kasz216
Mana worm Nerf is a premeditated move so blizzard can make more good cheap spells. Fear of mana worm is probably why we got "minion mage" last expansion and all the big mage push.


No thats not if by a long shot. Blizzard has sets created months in advanced. They already knew what was coming for this entire year maybe the order of the cards coming out changes but they know what cards are coming. Mana wyrm could have been nerfed with WW or boomsday or even in december with the new set but they nerfed in MID expansion while its not being abused. It was nerfed just to say they nerfed something and nothing more.
So they remove the main neutral defense tool available, and nerf the main truly aggressive deck, and people are surprised by this turn of events? Zoo is annoying and it is aggressive, but it also runs larger bombs and has to burn it's own health away in order to keep cards in hand. Mage just equips a weapon and spams boosted spells AND has secrets to counter both removal and attempts at board presence by the opponent proactively. And a way to cast them for 0 mana while building the board.

Mana Wyrm has been too strong for quite some time to exist in a class with so much damage from hand.
10/17/2018 11:59 AMPosted by Sagevallant
So they remove the main neutral defense tool available, and nerf the main truly aggressive deck, and people are surprised by this turn of events? Zoo is annoying and it is aggressive, but it also runs larger bombs and has to burn it's own health away in order to keep cards in hand. Mage just equips a weapon and spams boosted spells AND has secrets to counter both removal and attempts at board presence by the opponent proactively. And a way to cast them for 0 mana while building the board.

Mana Wyrm has been too strong for quite some time to exist in a class with so much damage from hand.


I agree mana wyrm and tempo are strong but was it doing anything ridiculous? Was it eve denting warrior or druid armor gains? All it served to do as hold back slow warlocks and quest rogue(thank god). Now look at the meta and explain to me how mana wyrm needed to be on the very short list of standard cards nerfed MID EXPANSION.
Hey OP, not nerfing Psychmelon was FINE. It's not like Blizzard is ever again going to print a key card in the 9 slot for Druid OR Neutral. Ever.
GI had the same issue corridor creeper had it was in too many decks. Aggro? Sweet three bodies two of which equal 4 blocks. Control? Sweet lemme just slam these GI back to back and stuff every midrange/aggro long enough to dump a board wipe on them when they attempt to play but over commit instead. Combo? Same as control but it had the added benefit of being a massive win con for quest rogue as they drop 6 now buffed bodies if by some ungodly reason you actually stalled them to turn 10.

At 5 mana GI honestly had no reason not to be in pretty much every deck. It has shield synergy, mech synergy, battlecry synergy, blood lust effect synergy. It just did too many things at 5 mana.
10/17/2018 01:17 PMPosted by Zlumpy
At 5 mana GI honestly had no reason not to be in pretty much every deck. It has shield synergy, mech synergy, battlecry synergy, blood lust effect synergy. It just did too many things at 5 mana.

You forgot taunt synergy. I used GI I'm a token Druid deck very effectively to get the +2/+2 buff. Time to look for a substitute.
10/17/2018 01:17 PMPosted by Zlumpy
At 5 mana GI honestly had no reason not to be in pretty much every deck. It has shield synergy, mech synergy, battlecry synergy, blood lust effect synergy. It just did too many things at 5 mana.

You forgot taunt synergy. I used GI in a token Druid deck very effectively to get the +2/+2 buff. Time to look for a substitute.
Also agree that the Giggling change was kinda stupid.
Don't get me wrong: The card needed a nerf ASAP but a bump in 2 mana is just ... meh from a balance standpoint. They should have at least boosted Giggling's stats with it (and since 1 mana is statistically more or less worth +1/+1 that means Giggling itself should have become a 4/3).
Im not surprised that the nerfs is going to be a failure since this entire game is a failure. Having a bunch of money greedy idiots come up with nerfs for a game they obviously dont care about is far beyond their reach. No idea why they create sets months in advance when they can take a month extra and just actually think wtf they are doing. I play wild and i wont play standard because there is not one card from standard that is as cool or awesome as a wild. If you want to know what is HS. Its not what you see in standard, its what you will see in wild. So devs wake the !@#$ up. Im so glad this game will be dead in a couple of months so they can say ah
oops we fcuked up.
10/17/2018 01:26 PMPosted by frugivore
10/17/2018 01:17 PMPosted by Zlumpy
At 5 mana GI honestly had no reason not to be in pretty much every deck. It has shield synergy, mech synergy, battlecry synergy, blood lust effect synergy. It just did too many things at 5 mana.

You forgot taunt synergy. I used GI I'm a token Druid deck very effectively to get the +2/+2 buff. Time to look for a substitute.

Actually I just gave up listing stuff and should just ended it with an etc.
Tier 2 Mage deck that can win this n turn 1 gets nerfed: WAAAAAAAH, NOOOOO! CHANGE BACK!

Is this the same crowd who want the tier 2 druids and tier 3 quest rogues to get nerfed just because they occasionally win on early turns aswell?

That’s pretty rich, I have to say.
10/16/2018 01:00 PMPosted by Luffy
Aviana was the LAST CARD they should have nerfed in the combo druid deck. The main problem is that 4 mana draw all of your combo pieces in one turn. Aviana SHOULD NOT have been touched. Now she is 100% unplayable. A 10 mana 5/5 do nothing.


I strongly disagree with you on this part. Aviana/Kun was the main problem.
There were at least 3 different versions of combo decks only because Aviana/Kun. Even before Juicy psychmelon existed(Malygos, towaggle, there was even one with multiple copies of leeroy jenkins)
So i do think Aviana was a problem. Of course juicy psychmelon is very powerful and should also be nerfed but Aviana/Kun was the main problem.
The combo is still possible, very difficult to pull off but it is there.

About the other 2. I don't know how to feel about them. Giggling inventor was a problem but they literally kill it with these. And the Wyrm, maybe it's because of upcoming cards. I don't know.

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