My problem with the game.

Play Mode Discussion
+50% of mages decks is face mage
+40% of lock decks is heal zoo
+45% of pally decks are odd agro
+40% of rogue decks are odd agro
+45% of hunter decks are death rattle and 30% secret.

So why haven't the devs made some changes to inspire deck diversity?
Im not asking for nerfs, but buffing the other stuff might be a good start...

Why is it so ok that i can spend a full day out of ranked and only face this 5 decks up to the point of insanity. And why is it ok that they are used non stop, like i got bored of them on the 1st day of the expansion not to mention that some of them have 28/30 cards from previous expansions...

Im not ok with this so i'm swapping games until the new expansion. This things better be fixed when i come back. Cause facing vs bot decks like this littrly 100% of the time outside ranked on my self made or net t3 or below decks is the most aggrovading thing i've expiriance since my time from beta up untill now, reminds me of the old and toxic days of face warrior or agro hunter. Decks that punish you the moment you want to try anything thats not a T1 decks by killing you on turn 4-5 when high rolling is just boring and sad. Not to mention that fact that this decks they just surrender the moment you start winning after a boardclear or a taunt/lifesteal shenanigan since for them its way faster to just join and try to win the next game by turn 4. And it's sad that blizzard supports this type of gameplay experience. Try to Cheese or surrender and try again but its sad since the cheese decks they run have more then 50% win rates on ranked let alone out of ranked vs every day folks who just want to have fun and enjoy the rest of the game.
I'm actually facing a lot of Druids. But even so, I think the decks are very diverse. Almost all classes have at least two viable decks. How much more do you want?
10/21/2018 08:16 PMPosted by frugivore
I'm actually facing a lot of Druids. But even so, I think the decks are very diverse. Almost all classes have at least two viable decks. How much more do you want?


In a normal day ill play hs for 4-5h's at that time ill face the decks i listed at lest 10 times eatch(outside of rank) up to the point that im happy that i still see some prists warriors and even druids even so i can go a day without facing a huge amount of the game since all i face is the dekcs i listed. Like one in every 3 game is vs face mage and zoo lock up to the point that its more safe for me to say that im not facing them in 1 game out of 3..

This isn't deck diversity the moment im out of rank it just feels like people only farm gold on aggro decks. Trying to win the game in 3-4 turn and surrendering the moment you make a comeback since its just faster to try and win a difrent game. This play style is to toxic for me so i started hating this game just from the amount of people abusing it.

Aggro decks are to good on top of the fact that they win so much faster then other decks. The moment an agro deck is T1 by win rate poeple love to ignor that the agro decks forsure played twice or trice the games other decks played and won.
I am sick to death of losing to Exodia mage.
Sure, run your control deck. Have unstoppably big creatures on the table.
It doesn't matter. It really doesn't matter.
Because the mage freezes you for as long as he needs you to, and
then drops fireball to zero, plays Antonidas, and takes another turn.

Fireball you to zero. It really doesn't matter how much you're winning by.
Boom. Boom. Boom. Boom.
WHAT FUN!

jeez. I am SO. SICK of this. I would rather lose to crystal caverns rogue (were it still a thing) than this deck.

I am beyond angry. I've been angry about losing to that for months.
And its still there.

WHY ARE THERE STILL !@#$%^- INFINITE DAMAGE COMBOS STILL IN THIS GAME?
THIS IS THE LEAST SATISFYING THING TO LOSE TO.
ABSOLUTELY NEGATIVE PLAY EXPERIENCE MINGLED WITH PURE RAGE.
10/21/2018 07:42 PMPosted by Wickedlike
+50% of mages decks is face mage
+40% of lock decks is heal zoo
+45% of pally decks are odd agro
+40% of rogue decks are odd agro
+45% of hunter decks are death rattle and 30% secret.


Source?
10/21/2018 09:28 PMPosted by Doomshadow
10/21/2018 07:42 PMPosted by Wickedlike
+50% of mages decks is face mage
+40% of lock decks is heal zoo
+45% of pally decks are odd agro
+40% of rogue decks are odd agro
+45% of hunter decks are death rattle and 30% secret.


Source?


https://hsreplay.net/meta/
I get you Wicked on the issue; however, how do you really fix it?

More cards?
HS Wild has the same issue
MtG has a similar issue

More balancing within class?
You start having that class become very, very strong as if you wind up with let's say an aggro deck and control deck from the same class that are both equally strong they'll actually enhance each other's strength due to mulligan becoming an issue.

10/21/2018 07:42 PMPosted by Wickedlike
Try to Cheese or surrender and try again but its sad since the cheese decks they run have more then 50% win rates on ranked let alone out of ranked vs every day folks who just want to have fun and enjoy the rest of the game.

*looks at list above*
So cheese is aggro? If aggro is cheese then run Control right now and you'll match-up well against most of them.

I'm not loving this meta but I honestly fail to see how Aggro is cheese right now. I have enough tools at my disposable as multiple classes to do decently well against aggro. My bigger issue personally is Combo but that shouldn't really surprise me as only one of my decks is aggressive enough to make Combo uncomfortable (Even Shaman)
10/21/2018 10:07 PMPosted by Lykotic
I get you Wicked on the issue; however, how do you really fix it?

More cards?
HS Wild has the same issue
MtG has a similar issue

More balancing within class?
You start having that class become very, very strong as if you wind up with let's say an aggro deck and control deck from the same class that are both equally strong they'll actually enhance each other's strength due to mulligan becoming an issue.

10/21/2018 07:42 PMPosted by Wickedlike
Try to Cheese or surrender and try again but its sad since the cheese decks they run have more then 50% win rates on ranked let alone out of ranked vs every day folks who just want to have fun and enjoy the rest of the game.

*looks at list above*
So cheese is aggro? If aggro is cheese then run Control right now and you'll match-up well against most of them.

I'm not loving this meta but I honestly fail to see how Aggro is cheese right now. I have enough tools at my disposable as multiple classes to do decently well against aggro. My bigger issue personally is Combo but that shouldn't really surprise me as only one of my decks is aggressive enough to make Combo uncomfortable (Even Shaman)


Heal zoo can basicly summon 4 minions on turn 1 with coin or turn 2 without at that point he just needs to go face and top deck the doomguards and soul fires but even so fungalmancer or such can be as effective. I know that this woun't happen every game but decks like that are so consistent on top of the cheeses like this one that they can pull or just flat out turn two Prince Keleseth as a cherry on top.

In my perfect world ill nerf aggro(just a little) to discurige its over use. Then ill add a counter OKT/control cards like dirty rat and boom the game is once again balanced. With everything outside of the meta i play the moment i face a deck that's full gole is to eather play temo/agro or to just clear and survive untill it OKT. There is no more value play in this game whatsoever and that saddens me.

I know aggro needs to be strong just so it can beat the T1 OTK decks but damn thay just made aggro so strong that it just crushes every non meta deck by turn 5. Atleast with OTK/control decks you get to see past turn 5 and that makes it feel much more better then aggro when im facing it.

And speed matters. A deck like Odd warrior has 51% win rate but a total of 140k games played this season now when we take a look at something like heal zoo that has 54% win rate but has 430k games played thats more then 3 times the game meaning 3 times the wins for the heal zoo players. This just feels unfair to me.
10/21/2018 10:47 PMPosted by Wickedlike
10/21/2018 10:07 PMPosted by Lykotic
I get you Wicked on the issue; however, how do you really fix it?

More cards?
HS Wild has the same issue
MtG has a similar issue

More balancing within class?
You start having that class become very, very strong as if you wind up with let's say an aggro deck and control deck from the same class that are both equally strong they'll actually enhance each other's strength due to mulligan becoming an issue.

...
*looks at list above*
So cheese is aggro? If aggro is cheese then run Control right now and you'll match-up well against most of them.

I'm not loving this meta but I honestly fail to see how Aggro is cheese right now. I have enough tools at my disposable as multiple classes to do decently well against aggro. My bigger issue personally is Combo but that shouldn't really surprise me as only one of my decks is aggressive enough to make Combo uncomfortable (Even Shaman)


Heal zoo can basicly summon 4 minions on turn 1 with coin or turn 2 without at that point he just needs to go face and top deck the doomguards and soul fires but even so fungalmancer or such can be as effective. I know that this woun't happen every game but decks like that are so consistent on top of the cheeses like this one that they can pull or just flat out turn two Prince Keleseth as a cherry on top.

In my perfect world ill nerf aggro(just a little) to discurige its over use. Then ill add a counter OKT/control cards like dirty rat and boom the game is once again balanced. With everything outside of the meta i play the moment i face a deck that's full gole is to eather play temo/agro or to just clear and survive untill it OKT. There is no more value play in this game whatsoever and that saddens me.

I know aggro needs to be strong just so it can beat the T1 OTK decks but damn thay just made aggro so strong that it just crushes every non meta deck by turn 5. Atleast with OTK/control decks you get to see past turn 5 and that makes it feel much more better then aggro when im facing it.

And speed matters. A deck like Odd warrior has 51% win rate but a total of 140k games played this season now when we take a look at something like heal zoo that has 54% win rate but has 430k games played thats more then 3 times the game meaning 3 times the wins for the heal zoo players.


In your perfect world, hearthstone is run into the ground by terrible balance changes based on immaturity, bias, and lack of basic statistical knowledge. The player base dies off and blizzard goes bankrupt.
It’s player’s choice. We have a rather boring and whiny community in HS. They don’t want to figure out builds or understand the card interactions, they want that done for them.

Few people want to experiment. But there’s a fantastic sense of you satisfaction if you build a deck idea and months later it gets picked up by some streamers.

Try Arena. I’m finding it very refreshing.
Thats just what decks people enjoy these days.

Also still works:

priest -anything with divine spirit & inner rage
shaman- anything token bloodlust
paladin- baku tokens into anything

People just dont bother playing those decks because its very old and stale or just too boring. Meta could be even more diverse.
10/22/2018 01:26 AMPosted by Marcoscongas
It’s player’s choice. We have a rather boring and whiny community in HS. They don’t want to figure out builds or understand the card interactions, they want that done for them.

Few people want to experiment. But there’s a fantastic sense of you satisfaction if you build a deck idea and months later it gets picked up by some streamers.

Try Arena. I’m finding it very refreshing.


How is calming down certain overly powerful cards or decks "figuring out builds or card interactions"? Can’t really experiment in this game without getting run over by the usual stuff. I think a lot of people would love to mess around more on ladder but the general population won’t allow it.
10/21/2018 07:42 PMPosted by Wickedlike
+50% of mages decks is face mage
+40% of lock decks is heal zoo
+45% of pally decks are odd agro
+40% of rogue decks are odd agro
+45% of hunter decks are death rattle and 30% secret.

So why haven't the devs made some changes to inspire deck diversity?
Im not asking for nerfs, but buffing the other stuff might be a good start...

Why is it so ok that i can spend a full day out of ranked and only face this 5 decks up to the point of insanity. And why is it ok that they are used non stop, like i got bored of them on the 1st day of the expansion not to mention that some of them have 28/30 cards from previous expansions...

Im not ok with this so i'm swapping games until the new expansion. This things better be fixed when i come back. Cause facing vs bot decks like this littrly 100% of the time outside ranked on my self made or net t3 or below decks is the most aggrovading thing i've expiriance since my time from beta up untill now, reminds me of the old and toxic days of face warrior or agro hunter. Decks that punish you the moment you want to try anything thats not a T1 decks by killing you on turn 4-5 when high rolling is just boring and sad. Not to mention that fact that this decks they just surrender the moment you start winning after a boardclear or a taunt/lifesteal shenanigan since for them its way faster to just join and try to win the next game by turn 4. And it's sad that blizzard supports this type of gameplay experience. Try to Cheese or surrender and try again but its sad since the cheese decks they run have more then 50% win rates on ranked let alone out of ranked vs every day folks who just want to have fun and enjoy the rest of the game.


You forgot that 100% of druids are ramp->draw->combo. (It doesn't matter that they can combo you with 4 different win conditions, they are all essentially the same deck with a slightly different flavor of how you lose to it.) I suppose that's slightly unfair. Taunt druid is a bit different than the rest of them.

But yeah... hearthstone has never been known for diversity within a class. The pool of cards is too shallow to get much of it, and when weird alternate deck strategies get pushed, they either end up dominating the others or being too weak to use.

It has a decent diversity across all of the classes right now. Each one plays pretty significantly differently. I just don't much care for how strongly matchups are currently determined by the portrait that appears as the game starts.
10/22/2018 02:21 AMPosted by Mikey
10/22/2018 01:26 AMPosted by Marcoscongas
It’s player’s choice. We have a rather boring and whiny community in HS. They don’t want to figure out builds or understand the card interactions, they want that done for them.

Few people want to experiment. But there’s a fantastic sense of you satisfaction if you build a deck idea and months later it gets picked up by some streamers.

Try Arena. I’m finding it very refreshing.


How is calming down certain overly powerful cards or decks "figuring out builds or card interactions"? Can’t really experiment in this game without getting run over by the usual stuff. I think a lot of people would love to mess around more on ladder but the general population won’t allow it.


Ladder is precisely for competition. But even in casual I run into far more tier 1/2 meta decks than off meta decks.

And the second I post suggesting folks try some other stuff, I get massive angry replies from the casual try hards.
10/22/2018 04:04 AMPosted by Marcoscongas

And the second I post suggesting folks try some other stuff, I get massive angry replies from the casual try hards.


Trying to stop people from netdecking is a fight one can not win I'm afraid.
Just post your deck ideas and it will mostly at least get some thumbs up.
10/21/2018 11:03 PMPosted by Haunter187
<span class="truncated">...</span>

Heal zoo can basicly summon 4 minions on turn 1 with coin or turn 2 without at that point he just needs to go face and top deck the doomguards and soul fires but even so fungalmancer or such can be as effective. I know that this woun't happen every game but decks like that are so consistent on top of the cheeses like this one that they can pull or just flat out turn two Prince Keleseth as a cherry on top.

In my perfect world ill nerf aggro(just a little) to discurige its over use. Then ill add a counter OKT/control cards like dirty rat and boom the game is once again balanced. With everything outside of the meta i play the moment i face a deck that's full gole is to eather play temo/agro or to just clear and survive untill it OKT. There is no more value play in this game whatsoever and that saddens me.

I know aggro needs to be strong just so it can beat the T1 OTK decks but damn thay just made aggro so strong that it just crushes every non meta deck by turn 5. Atleast with OTK/control decks you get to see past turn 5 and that makes it feel much more better then aggro when im facing it.

And speed matters. A deck like Odd warrior has 51% win rate but a total of 140k games played this season now when we take a look at something like heal zoo that has 54% win rate but has 430k games played thats more then 3 times the game meaning 3 times the wins for the heal zoo players.


In your perfect world, hearthstone is run into the ground by terrible balance changes based on immaturity, bias, and lack of basic statistical knowledge. The player base dies off and blizzard goes bankrupt.


How am i bias and to what?(i dont like okt control decks as much as i dont like aggro so in my perfect world they are a little weak) I just want to nerf whats most played or buff the things that aren't getting played. I see nothing bad in this. w.e you are free to your opinion as i am, so must i !@#$ on your opinion now as well? And what will that bring the discusion? Just get back to your cave or bring something to the discusion on why its ok that 90% of the game is the same, troll boy.
10/22/2018 03:59 AMPosted by Smeet
You forgot that 100% of druids are ramp->draw->combo. (It doesn't matter that they can combo you with 4 different win conditions, they are all essentially the same deck with a slightly different flavor of how you lose to it.) I suppose that's slightly unfair. Taunt druid is a bit different than the rest of them.

But yeah... hearthstone has never been known for diversity within a class. The pool of cards is too shallow to get much of it, and when weird alternate deck strategies get pushed, they either end up dominating the others or being too weak to use.

It has a decent diversity across all of the classes right now. Each one plays pretty significantly differently. I just don't much care for how strongly matchups are currently determined by the portrait that appears as the game starts.


As unfun as druids are at lest i get to see past turn 5-6 and i can respect that.
Like theirs a huge difrence in a 3 min game vs aggro decks and a 10-15 min game vs druid.

Non the less my opinions on druid is negative but i've seen token and hadronox decks but i know that most druids run 2-3 win conditions hense why i think that a card like dirty rat is ok atm. Cause lets face it aggro decks are so toxic cause they need to be this toxic to counter OKT once. So my best suggestion is to nerf aggro a little and bring back some OKT counter play cards. Even buffing unplayable cards might help desk diversity somethings that i have yet to see from blizzard. I think its fine if they buffed cards and didnt offer dist refounds just to make some rare cards more popular.
Just as an idea a game mode that exclused all the toxic gold farming decks will be so nice. Might make me want to play this game again. Currently i only do my quest since i've moved on to other games but even so when im doing my quests on "casual" i still end up facing nothing but people who want to farm gold.

In general a game mode without OTK or Zoo/aggro decks will be so fresh.. Since this is the only thing that's geting played atm. Either ignore your oponen minions or only care to clear minions and survive so you can OKT. Both play style are set on not even careing what your oponent ill do.
One will remove everything you summon and OTK you the other will ignor it or just go for the trades that matter. And thats what this game calls "casual"? Same decks i face of in legends but with abundance of aggro decks on the side. Might as well call it "babyrage i need to farm gold mod".
10/22/2018 05:29 AMPosted by Wickedlike

As unfun as druids are at lest i get to see past turn 5-6 and i can respect that.
Like theirs a huge difrence in a 3 min game vs aggro decks and a 10-15 min game vs druid.

Non the less my opinions on druid is negative but i've seen token and hadronox decks but i know that most druids run 2-3 win conditions hense why i think that a card like dirty rat is ok atm. Cause lets face it aggro decks are so toxic cause they need to be this toxic to counter OKT once. So my best suggestion is to nerf aggro a little and bring back some OKT counter play cards. Even buffing unplayable cards might help desk diversity somethings that i have yet to see from blizzard. I think its fine if they buffed cards and didnt offer dist refounds just to make some rare cards more popular.

Wait, are aggro decks toxic? And what supposed that decide which decks are toxic and which don't? What supposed that "toxic" mean?
If you said that is because don't let to other decks play, is kinda wrong because this happen also with control decks, the unique difference is that one kill you fast and the other slow with its super strongs win conditions, which is better way to die is very subjective
10/22/2018 07:03 AMPosted by Wickedlike
Just as an idea a game mode that exclused all the toxic gold farming decks will be so nice. Might make me want to play this game again. Currently i only do my quest since i've moved on to other games but even so when im doing my quests on "casual" i still end up facing nothing but people who want to farm gold.

In general a game mode without OTK or Zoo/aggro decks will be so fresh.. Since this is the only thing that's geting played atm. Either ignore your oponen minions or only care to clear minions and survive so you can OKT. Both play style are set on not even careing what your oponent ill do.
One will remove everything you summon and OTK you the other will ignor it or just go for the trades that matter. And thats what this game calls "casual"? Same decks i face of in legends but with abundance of aggro decks on the side. Might as well call it "babyrage i need to farm gold mod".

Farmer is a different problem, at least to aggro decks (I can't talk about OTK, because I don't have experience with this), they don't just ignore to the rival, what is the problem with remove minions? Control decks also do this
Wait, are aggro decks toxic? And what supposed that decide which decks are toxic and which don't?


They are toxic once cause they are olver used in the casual format.
And its my opinion that they are toxic. Since for me they limit the decks i can play with their overuse. And this is "casual" we are talking about. The place i just want to relax and maybe make a friend or two.

10/22/2018 07:33 AMPosted by Brandon975
Farmer is a different problem, at least to aggro decks (I can't talk about OTK, because I don't have experience with this), they don't just ignore to the rival, what is the problem with remove minions? Control decks also do this


The farmers best tolls are aggro decks thou.
Ill just say that for every game a win an aggro deck will win 3-5 times that. I know that the win rate isnt the problem.

Basicly all OKT does is remove/survive to OTK the moment the other deck isnt aggro is has no hope of wining. When control decks do that there win condition isnt so clear as OTK or Aggro deck's is.

Aggro is basicly pump out good minions and only go face only taking good trades and hoping that you'll get the burn/finisher cards.

And OTK is basicly control your oponent untill you OTK him.

An OTK will surrender the moment you stop its(with the standards warlock exclusive cards) And Zoo will surrender once they start to lose on board. This decks are to one dementional and they are really good at that demention but as you can see the moment they are wining there is no place for the other player t ohave fun yet all it takes is a little to crush them and once that happens they jsut FF and join a difrent game to not waste any time. Persoanlly when i play casual i wanna expriance the other part of the game. Im fine with this decks if people only used then in ranked since they are good decks but the moment i start to not see anything but aggro decks in casual a problem happens for me so i come here to complane.

Like the moment i miss a 1 drop(and i dont run a lot of them unlike the agro decks i listed) i just lose the game since i can never catch up on the tempo lost. Every time i face one of this decks they somehow happen to all have the same standards openings on top of the cheesey once like zoo summoning 4 minions turn 1. My problem with control/OTK decks isnt that big but since i want aggro to take a little hit im expecting that OTK decks will dominate so following this logic is the main reason i think the OTK is problematic and i do see alot of people who hate OTK more then aggro(unlike me) so i just want to be fair with everything. I want to see less aggro and OTK not recking everything once that happens. It will open alot of space for new decks to have some chance.

All in all anything that discurigases aggro play and does not promote OTK will be the best thing that will ever happens for me in this game. At times i will want to use the rest of my card collection even buffing the least played cards might make something positive happen.

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