Rogue UP

Play Mode Discussion
02/21/2019 07:27 PMPosted by Valeera
Rogue is UP right now. Cold blood nerf killed the class

Nah. A class being carried by a single spell is bad design. It was a fair nerf.
02/22/2019 06:36 AMPosted by HailFall
02/22/2019 12:39 AMPosted by Melomaniac
I have to agree. Rogue is in a very bad spot right now. Rogue got a lot of control cards to use, but they are all meme cards.

Those cards are the following. Pick Pocket, Tess Greymane, Pogo Hopper, Face Collector, Lilian Voss, Academic Espionage, Spirit of the Shark, Myra Rotspring.

Cards are too slow for competitive play and too meme orientated torwards memes and random RNG to use vs other real control decks. Decks that don't rely on RNG nearly as much.

Rogue could use some non-RNG bases control cards...

Seems Blizzard is set in stone to keep rogue only relevant in wild and to focus on it mainly being a tempo or meme style deck. Very unfortunate.
Tess is exceptionally powerful. Zuljin/yogg level impact. The main issue is that the burgle core is way too slow for the game right now


Zuljinn dupes YOUR cards and effects. Tess dupes random cards you played that can often hurt you.
02/22/2019 11:51 PMPosted by Swift
02/21/2019 07:27 PMPosted by Valeera
Rogue is UP right now. Cold blood nerf killed the class

Nah. A class being carried by a single spell is bad design. It was a fair nerf.


Prep got nerfed?
02/23/2019 12:54 PMPosted by Nightmare
Zuljinn dupes YOUR cards and effects. Tess dupes random cards you played that can often hurt you.
Yes and zuljin is 10 mana and tess is 8 and comes with a 6/6 body. This is just like people saying yogg is fine. The fact is that it is overall far more positive than negative to play. Especially as she can replay minions which don't hurt you.
02/22/2019 11:51 PMPosted by Swift
02/21/2019 07:27 PMPosted by Valeera
Rogue is UP right now. Cold blood nerf killed the class

Nah. A class being carried by a single spell is bad design. It was a fair nerf.


Rogue decks have been hit in the last 5 nerfs, whether via class or neutral cards.

It’s not a single card, it’s 6.
It's funny that no matter how mediocre Rogue is doing people will still complain. Coldblood is balanced to be the same power level as a paladin spell, and even thought paladin is a stronger class it's the rogue version that gets nerfed. Naturally.

One of the posters on here used a game against a super RNG deck (burgle/academic espionage) which high rolled and still lost as an example of how it still has strong decks. In reality it showed how weak the deck was, because not only is it extremely unreliable but even when it does get lucky it's only about on par with the other decks running around right now.
02/23/2019 05:06 PMPosted by HailFall
02/23/2019 12:54 PMPosted by Nightmare
Zuljinn dupes YOUR cards and effects. Tess dupes random cards you played that can often hurt you.
Yes and zuljin is 10 mana and tess is 8 and comes with a 6/6 body. This is just like people saying yogg is fine. The fact is that it is overall far more positive than negative to play. Especially as she can replay minions which don't hurt you.


Yes and the hero comes with an extra 5 armor worth 1 mana and an improved power worth 2.

Zuljiin is also a cornerstone to a crop of successful hunter decks and Tess isn’t even the core component of a meme deck.

Also if you don’t understand the difference between duping your own op cards (gss anyone?) and duping inconsistent trashthat you try to play for cheap, you don’t comprehend the game.

Bet you think drawing a card is the same as getting random opponent class trash too right?
02/25/2019 04:01 AMPosted by Perfidious
It's funny that no matter how mediocre Rogue is doing people will still complain. Coldblood is balanced to be the same power level as a paladin spell, and even thought paladin is a stronger class it's the rogue version that gets nerfed. Naturally.

One of the posters on here used a game against a super RNG deck (burgle/academic espionage) which high rolled and still lost as an example of how it still has strong decks. In reality it showed how weak the deck was, because not only is it extremely unreliable but even when it does get lucky it's only about on par with the other decks running around right now.


Cold blood isn’t equivalent to any paly spell. BoK confers 4/4 for 4. That’s 1/1 for each mana. Cold blood does either 1/1 (2/0) for 2 or 2/2 (4/0) for 3.5 since you have to combo to produce that effect and that means blowing a card(pulling a draw) to make it. If you think combo has no downside, you’ve never played rogue. The pt is to sac more cards per turn to improve an effects value, not to match the potency of other cards at a higher card cost.
02/25/2019 04:46 AMPosted by Nightmare
02/25/2019 04:01 AMPosted by Perfidious
It's funny that no matter how mediocre Rogue is doing people will still complain. Coldblood is balanced to be the same power level as a paladin spell, and even thought paladin is a stronger class it's the rogue version that gets nerfed. Naturally.

One of the posters on here used a game against a super RNG deck (burgle/academic espionage) which high rolled and still lost as an example of how it still has strong decks. In reality it showed how weak the deck was, because not only is it extremely unreliable but even when it does get lucky it's only about on par with the other decks running around right now.


Cold blood isn’t equivalent to any paly spell. BoK confers 4/4 for 4. That’s 1/1 for each mana. Cold blood does either 1/1 (2/0) for 2 or 2/2 (4/0) for 3.5 since you have to combo to produce that effect and that means blowing a card(pulling a draw) to make it. If you think combo has no downside, you’ve never played rogue. The pt is to sac more cards per turn to improve an effects value, not to match the potency of other cards at a higher card cost.


He's talking about the similarities between Blessing of Might and Cold Blood, whil e Cold Blood gives you +4, you have to meet your requirements while BoM always will give you +3.

Blessing of Might has also been in most aggro-oriented Paladin decks, like Odd Paladin which is ten times worse than an Odd Rogue.
02/25/2019 04:41 AMPosted by Nightmare
02/23/2019 05:06 PMPosted by HailFall
...Yes and zuljin is 10 mana and tess is 8 and comes with a 6/6 body. This is just like people saying yogg is fine. The fact is that it is overall far more positive than negative to play. Especially as she can replay minions which don't hurt you.


Yes and the hero comes with an extra 5 armor worth 1 mana and an improved power worth 2.

Zuljiin is also a cornerstone to a crop of successful hunter decks and Tess isn’t even the core component of a meme deck.

Also if you don’t understand the difference between duping your own op cards (gss anyone?) and duping inconsistent trashthat you try to play for cheap, you don’t comprehend the game.

Bet you think drawing a card is the same as getting random opponent class trash too right?
I don't think you can accurately assign a Mana value to each individual component of zuljin. Tess would be strong if the deck supporting her was strong. She has incredible impact when played, but as I said the burgle core is too slow. Obviously zuljin is in more decks as it's requirements are pretty simple. Yogg was beyond broken pre nerf, and Tess does something quite similar when played.

Of course, Tess isn't broken because of the deck building restriction, but there is no denying that dropping Tess is one of the biggest power plays in the game.

I don't appreciate the way you are talking to me. I am being respectful, and it'd be nice if you could do me the same courtesy.
I understand exactly what he saying. What people don’t understand about what I am addressing is the fact that cold blood is a far far less efficient important card now then bok.
Rogue has never been funner to play then it is now. Cheesy unlikely wins against overpowered decks when you draw that 1 mana cost death knight. Not to mention the effective zihi aggro deck where you fill your deck up with a 6 card cost at the highest, play zola and lap recruiter and hilarity ensues as the OTK scum concede in shame as you stall the game to 6 mana over and over again.

Rogue decks feel kinda different from each other. This was supposed to be how the game works, but instead everyone plays the same version of the same class.

Lets salute Valeera, a true underdog.
02/25/2019 04:41 AMPosted by Nightmare
...

Yes and the hero comes with an extra 5 armor worth 1 mana and an improved power worth 2.

Zuljiin is also a cornerstone to a crop of successful hunter decks and Tess isn’t even the core component of a meme deck.

Also if you don’t understand the difference between duping your own op cards (gss anyone?) and duping inconsistent trashthat you try to play for cheap, you don’t comprehend the game.

Bet you think drawing a card is the same as getting random opponent class trash too right?
I don't think you can accurately assign a Mana value to each individual component of zuljin. Tess would be strong if the deck supporting her was strong. She has incredible impact when played, but as I said the burgle core is too slow. Obviously zuljin is in more decks as it's requirements are pretty simple. Yogg was beyond broken pre nerf, and Tess does something quite similar when played.

Of course, Tess isn't broken because of the deck building restriction, but there is no denying that dropping Tess is one of the biggest power plays in the game.

I don't appreciate the way you are talking to me. I am being respectful, and it'd be nice if you could do me the same courtesy.


Hail.. seriously.. I get that Tess can be incredibly powerful if you're highrolling/lucky as hell, but calling her one of the biggest power plays in the game is far, far from reality.

One, she's not consistent at all due to the nature of the entire deck.
Two, She's rendered absolutely useless against another rogue.
Three, as with Yogg, she can also do more damage to yourself than the enemy.

While I agree, that is a powerplay IF you get the right cards and IF you try to limit the RNG to the minimum.

Trying to compare her til Zul'jin is just.. comparing a glock to a gatling gun, both can kill but their area is destruction upon usage is soo much different.

If you build your deck right, Zul'jin can;
Annihilate your opponents board.
Summon a wall of taunts or charge or buffers or doggos (depending on cast order).
Refill your hand.
Refill your secrets.

And it's always this happens, it's same things you can expect from him each time unlike Tess.

Hell, Zul'jin can be a OTK itself if you summon enough huffers + a Lerokk or two.
02/25/2019 01:00 PMPosted by Flarkyou
Rogue has never been funner to play then it is now

02/25/2019 01:00 PMPosted by Flarkyou
Cheesy unlikely wins


That's a personal preference thing. Not everyone likes "cheesy"

In a competitive environment (which I assume is what people talk about when they say a class is OP or too weak), people tend to not want "cheesy" decks. Cheesy decks tend to be less reliable because of too much RNG, which usually makes wins/losses feel like it's not a result of meaningful player decisions, but just roll of the dice.

02/25/2019 01:00 PMPosted by Flarkyou
Rogue decks feel kinda different from each other. This was supposed to be how the game works, but instead everyone plays the same version of the same class.


From the latest vs, the most viable rogue decks are miracle and odd rogue (odd rogue is a lot weaker though), with maly rogue being a distant third. None of those rely on random enemy class cards the way the cheesier rogue decks do.

To speak to the thread topic, I see in vs report that miracle rogue is high tier 2 (low tier 1 at legend), with odd rogue still hanging on in low tier 2 despite the cold blood nerf. Rogue representation isn't the best, but still above 3 other classes. They are in a position to prey on some of the popular classes/decks (priest mainly)

So I'm not sure what the issue is.
02/25/2019 06:35 AMPosted by HailFall
02/25/2019 04:41 AMPosted by Nightmare
...

Yes and the hero comes with an extra 5 armor worth 1 mana and an improved power worth 2.

Zuljiin is also a cornerstone to a crop of successful hunter decks and Tess isn’t even the core component of a meme deck.

Also if you don’t understand the difference between duping your own op cards (gss anyone?) and duping inconsistent trashthat you try to play for cheap, you don’t comprehend the game.

Bet you think drawing a card is the same as getting random opponent class trash too right?
I don't think you can accurately assign a Mana value to each individual component of zuljin. Tess would be strong if the deck supporting her was strong. She has incredible impact when played, but as I said the burgle core is too slow. Obviously zuljin is in more decks as it's requirements are pretty simple. Yogg was beyond broken pre nerf, and Tess does something quite similar when played.

Of course, Tess isn't broken because of the deck building restriction, but there is no denying that dropping Tess is one of the biggest power plays in the game.

I don't appreciate the way you are talking to me. I am being respectful, and it'd be nice if you could do me the same courtesy.


I don’t really care how you feel. I haven’t insulted you but comparing random opposing class to card draws is pure nonsense. Either you know this, like everyone else and you’re being disingenuous, which isn’t respectful or you don’t understand the game, and I was being honest.

Zuljiin produces cards that are 100% valuable and Tess is a crapshoot... at best.

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