How to survive face as a Warlock.

Play Mode Discussion
I know this might sound weird but I am asking a honest question like I like to play a warlock but every "face" opponent I come against even with running the following heals I still lose, Which is what prompted me to ask this question.

What I mean is like for example a Priest/Warrior would have an easier time against Hunters/ or face mage(the one where all spells just go face and they use the 2/4 to draw cards when played the most right one).

The heals im running are
Dark Pact x 2
Plated Beetle x 2
Guldan
Lesser Amethyst Spellstone x 2
Zilliax
Rotten Applebaum x 2.
Voodoo Doctor x 2
High Priestess Jeklik

Now my question is how much more healing do I need to be able to survive whilst being able to use my Life Tap ability even with all this healing and playing a Twlight Drake (4/8) on turn 4 i still died....

Or as soon as I see that they are going nowhere but face do I just auto-concede the same way I would fold if I have a 2 of hearths and 8 of diamonds in my starting hand in poker.
Healing won't help you against aggro. You must have board cleaners: 2xDefile, 2xHellfire.
I find the Dire Mole + Razormaw to be the biggest probem as turn 1 dire mole 1/3 theres not much I can do for 2 mana to kill a 1 / 3 and then turn 2 Razormaw comes out and make sit a 4/3 by which time its too late and its already damaged my face for 5 damage in 2 turns.

I feel that 1/3 which can be buffed to a 4/3 on turn seems too strong for some classes to deal with and to use Hellfire seems too late as by then it can be a 4/3 with divine shield or +1/+1 or some other buff to put it out of range not to mention to 3 damage to myself as well.

Defile is usually no good as the dire mole HP is 3 and razormaw is 2 so I need to play a 1 hp minion and a Defile to be able to clean it
are you playing standard? in that case i would definitely recommend adding some Taunt minions, especially Voidwalker and Tar Creeper for the early board presence

see, you've probably also found out that healing up isn't really the way to go, especially v aggro, because while you use your turn/mana to heal up, your opponent is gaining more board presence, so more damage is coming your way turn by turn until you eventually can't heal up anymore

certain amount of heal is needed due to the nature of your ability, but as a Warlock you absolutely need to be able to grab and maintain board control from the get go

also, get used to being low on health, it's just the way it is ;)
02/21/2019 03:38 AMPosted by Drib
Or as soon as I see that they are going nowhere but face do I just auto-concede the same way I would fold if I have a 2 of hearths and 8 of diamonds in my starting hand in poker.


NEVER!!! :)
i'm playing wild Evenlock and there were countless games where i went down to 5hp due to an early rush of my aggro opponents, but as soon as i got to turn 4 i was able to completely stop the board damage with my 7/7 and 8/8 taunts, heal up a bit and kill my opponent in 2-3 turns from the point where they were sure they "had" me ;)
...that is one of the treats of playing Warlock ;)
Depends on what Warlock you run? (Even, discard, control, zoo?)unless your running zoo the first 4 turns is all about surviving as your rarely going to have anything that’s going to impact your opponent too much.

Board clears are all important, removing threats with hellfire and defile will stop them snowballing.

For minions You want early game taunts like vulgar homoncullious and stone hill defender to guard your life, remove little threats and force them to burn resources.

You can have access to allot of early game lifesteal which I personally like. Spellstones to remove those turn 4-5 threats and heal up. I would say if you running zilliax then corpsetakers are good as you get a taunt/divine shield/lifesteal 3/3 which is decent to get down on turn 4. I would also say felsoul inquisitor is worth looking at as it’s got health to stop you getting hit and even has a little lifesteal to prop you up (it also synergises with corpsetaker in case ziliax is out early).

Once you hit 5 you should be able to stabilise and turn the game into late where you should be beating most agro through sheer sustain off BRG and higher end minions.

In short there’s no magic answer to getting through those turns. You need to get some sort of a curve and if you don’t you f*cked anyway. The same as if the face player gets the all too often perfect opening hand you might not be able to do anything just the same. All you can do is get yourself the best chance you can and hope RNG doesn’t screw you.
That depends on the list you're running. Generally, you need minions that can soak/redirect some of their dmg spells or minion dmg (you have no minions to be targeted? your face is there as the only target).

Their strat rarely goes, minion dmg, dmg spell → all face. It's more about keeping the tempo, spell to remove your minions, preverse hp on their minion and go face. If you're one of those warlock that wants to tap tap tap Twlight Drake, then your face would've already been mangled against some of the aggressive decks.

You need minion cards that can hold tempo. Defence minion like Tar Creeper is likely to bait out KC or Fireball. If they don't have it, they will need to trade in around 2 minions to get through and go face. They may hold their attack, then you have board clears to get rid of several of their minions while yours live. Next, it's threat minion of your own. Minions that can value trade theirs, that will make you secure the board. Against these, they have to trade in, or they lose board, get their face mauled instead. Mind you, they may still have enough reach to finish you off, but normally, mindlessly slinging spells to face is not a good idea (4 mana Fireball is one time 6 dmg, 4 mana 4/5 Chillwind Yeti is a constant 4+4+4...as long as it lives).

As for your choice of healing, which list are you running? I would say Voodoo Doctor simply doesn't fit in any control warlock deck. Jeklik is questionable, but if it works, go for it.
I'd be interested in seeing your list. Jeklik is usually used in discard strata but I wouldn't imagine a very strong discard theme with all those healing cards.
My deck list is a kind of homebrew made thing so all the while not expecting to win a lot of games would like to think i could win something XD

I warn you its not a meta deck before handfuls of criticism comes my way, I like to experiment with various decks as the predictability of meta decks makes the game quite stale for me as the turns are HUGELY predictable.

### HealMore
# Class: Warlock
# Format: Standard
# Year of the Raven
#
# 2x (1) Dark Pact
# 2x (1) Voodoo Doctor
# 2x (2) Defile
# 2x (2) Demonic Project
# 2x (2) Plated Beetle
# 2x (3) Shadow Bolt
# 2x (4) Bright-Eyed Scout
# 1x (4) High Priestess Jeklik
# 2x (4) Lesser Amethyst Spellstone
# 2x (5) Carnivorous Cube
# 2x (5) Doomguard
# 2x (5) Rotten Applebaum
# 1x (5) Zilliax
# 1x (6) Glinda Crowskin
# 2x (6) Siphon Soul
# 2x (6) Soulwarden
# 1x (10) Bloodreaver Gul'dan
#
AAECAf0GBJfTAr/xAqCAA/CGAw2EAfcEkgfMCIjBAufLAvjQAojSAovhAurmAsXzAtaGA4CKAwA=
#
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone

The idea of my deck is to have as few demons as possible so you can cube Doomguard and eventually use Guldan for a 20 dmg combo at the end.

For fatigue style games depending on the discards you can go infinite if you can get a Doomguard to discard a Soulwarden and Guldan.

Like i said an experimental deck.
02/21/2019 05:22 AMPosted by Drib
My deck list is a kind of homebrew made thing so all the while not expecting to win a lot of games would like to think i could win something XD

I warn you its not a meta deck before handfuls of criticism comes my way, I like to experiment with various decks as the predictability of meta decks makes the game quite stale for me as the turns are HUGELY predictable.

### HealMore
# Class: Warlock
# Format: Standard
# Year of the Raven
#
# 2x (1) Dark Pact
# 2x (1) Voodoo Doctor
# 2x (2) Defile
# 2x (2) Demonic Project
# 2x (2) Plated Beetle
# 2x (3) Shadow Bolt
# 2x (4) Bright-Eyed Scout
# 1x (4) High Priestess Jeklik
# 2x (4) Lesser Amethyst Spellstone
# 2x (5) Carnivorous Cube
# 2x (5) Doomguard
# 2x (5) Rotten Applebaum
# 1x (5) Zilliax
# 1x (6) Glinda Crowskin
# 2x (6) Siphon Soul
# 2x (6) Soulwarden
# 1x (10) Bloodreaver Gul'dan
#
AAECAf0GBJfTAr/xAqCAA/CGAw2EAfcEkgfMCIjBAufLAvjQAojSAovhAurmAsXzAtaGA4CKAwA=
#
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone

The idea of my deck is to have as few demons as possible so you can cube Doomguard and eventually use Guldan for a 20 dmg combo at the end.

For fatigue style games depending on the discards you can go infinite if you can get a Doomguard to discard a Soulwarden and Guldan.

Like i said an experimental deck.


it seems that deck has no way of upgrading the spell stone. How do you feel about cutting bright eyed scout for hellfire?
Kobold librarian also upgrades spellstone and is q strong t1 body with hero power attached.

But more importantly, it provides a 1health body for defile to hit. That would be excellent for your dire mole/razor scenario. Either you drop him then defile, or you hit mole bringing mole to 1 for the same result.

Very few decks do not benefit from librarian

Hellfire is one of the best clears in the game, upgrades spellstone, and will save your bacon vs hunter spellstone
I will cut the scout and put hellfire. and maybe find some room for librarian as said hes a good "defile" activator.:)

thanks for the advice and not flaming to hell lol
Also, it would probably be best to cut the soulwardens and jeklik and instead add the traditional mana cheating methods, possessed lackey and skull of man ari. Then, add voidlords for a tauntwall that will provide possibly the best protection in the game. In your cubelock gameplan you're going to want cubes in hand when you're putting doom guard on the field, and hard casting doomguards, you WILL be discarding cubes and other cards you want a goodly amount of the time.

The soulwarden is an interesting idea but too erratic, I think- I recommend looking up traditional cubelock decks for ideas :)

I know that seems to stifle creativity, but cubelock is a very time-tested archetype
I think of the soulwarden as a 6/6 draw 3 cards as I generally hardcast the doomguard.

I have managed to pull off the dream a couple of times by having Guldan and Soulwarden discarded, Playing a guldan every turn was auto concede even if he didnt res any minions lol

But if you manage to get Guldan with some minions in the above scenario its like a free doomguard everyturn lol
i have been using even lock and generally its not the minions that concern me, i can more than stall them out of cards, my issue has actually been more with rexxar, the amount of poison, rush lifesteal minions they generate makes it really tough
to keep board control and do damage.

but its doable.
I find that skull of the manari is enough to beat out aggro if you can survive past turn 5.

A lot of those hunter decks don't even run weapon removal, though that might change soon. But once you start pumping out the voidlords, doomguards and despicable dreadlords to clear out their small crap, its over for them. Just keep one hellfire in mulligan incase you draw against a spell hunter and he spell stones on 5 or 6.

No defile neccessary, just value and a huge board constantly. I steamroll hunters. You need the Keleseth to out value early Rexxar, and it can be done. Especially once you start controlling the board. Hunters are usually bad at dealing with a big board, their clears are limited to single target and unleash the hounds which they will use to clear your minions instead of go face making it even more likely you will win.

Code: AAECAf0GDJMB08UCm8sCp84Cws4Cl9MCnOIC2OUC2+kCnPgCj4ADoIADCfcE8gW2B5vCAsrDAvfNAvLQAojSAujnAgA=

Look up Omega flame, or Omega control warlock. Its not a tier 1 deck, but it definitely poops on hunters if that's your goal.
02/21/2019 04:10 AMPosted by Drib
I find the Dire Mole + Razormaw to be the biggest probem as turn 1 dire mole 1/3 theres not much I can do for 2 mana to kill a 1 / 3 and then turn 2 Razormaw comes out and make sit a 4/3 by which time its too late and its already damaged my face for 5 damage in 2 turns.

I feel that 1/3 which can be buffed to a 4/3 on turn seems too strong for some classes to deal with and to use Hellfire seems too late as by then it can be a 4/3 with divine shield or +1/+1 or some other buff to put it out of range not to mention to 3 damage to myself as well.

Defile is usually no good as the dire mole HP is 3 and razormaw is 2 so I need to play a 1 hp minion and a Defile to be able to clean it
Yes, Razormaw is busted and is exactly what face hunter's bank on for wins. Mole is better than the old Razormaw-bases, but w/o Razormaw the 1/3's power isn't as fast.

You are running into a box-out 2017 expansion card named Razormaw.
It boxes out 2 costs for Rexxar + dictates the 1-costs.

These box-outs are also in the form of DK Rex f/e.
Cards/junk like these are so-obvious how strong they are, they box out creativity.
It's why every match feels the same, why deckbuilding is limited the more powered up they go example Razormaw.

"Play the powercreep into powercreep, or don't play"
That's basically what the game's becoming.
Drop some late taunts for more heal or more early game, use Stonehill to discover a few bigger taunts. Assuming this works for your game plan; I play Control Warlock so stall/live is the goal and Stonehill is good for that.
I have a very similar deck and I've popped in Abomination and saronite chain gang to help deal with non-paladin aggro. Abomination can be an alternative to hellfire. It activates the spell Stone, and is a solid taunt that often makes their board ripe for a defile,
02/21/2019 03:59 PMPosted by RinseWizard
I have a very similar deck and I've popped in Abomination and saronite chain gang to help deal with non-paladin aggro. Abomination can be an alternative to hellfire. It activates the spell Stone, and is a solid taunt that often makes their board ripe for a defile,


I had never thought of Abomination as a hellfire alternative but sounds good to me.

Thanks for all the replys guys!, Some very useful advice here.

As for Skull of the manari I find its too dependant on drawing voidlords early on and if you dont get either the skull and the voidlord byt turn 6 you are almost dead anyway, Albeit a kill command to the face or something.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum