Tyrande Being Considered for Solo Support Role

General Discussion
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From Reddit AMA today (May 16th)

• Tyrande’s current play style and talent builds can be really unique and compelling for certain players, but she doesn’t really have a role in the current meta. Internally, we are currently exploring some design changes to Tyrande that would make her viable as a solo healer. Overall the changes have been received very positively by our team, but there is a tradeoff: She is losing a lot of damage and her ability to chunk people from long distances with her owl build. This is something that we recognize can be fun for Tyrande players, so we’re carefully debating if this is the right direction for her. I’m curious to hear any thoughts you all have on this. Obviously, we could go the opposite route for her and remove/reduce her healing mechanic and point her more towards a ranged assassin.

• As I’m sure I will be asked in response to what I wrote above: Why make Tyrande a Healer, why not Assassin? We’re exploring the healing side of things as the rest of Tyrande’s kit can really encourage a Support-y playstyle—she can provide strong scouting for her team using Owls (using them to deal tons of damage works, but it’s a bit odd), her trait debuffs an enemy and helps the rest of your team to set up kills. We could make the trait more selfish, but we like its current iteration that sets up your team and essentially calls out a focus target. For her stun, were cautious to put a hard CC (stun) on the base kit of most ranged assassins. We do break this rule from time to time so it’s kind of soft for either way, but we feel more comfortable putting strong CC on Supports and Healers. This allows them to set up your team do meaningful things outside of purely healing.


Blizzard, please! OH MY GOD YES! Please give Tyrande that solo healer role again! When I first started playing this game Tyrande was one of my favorite healers and it was extremely fun especially with the old team/map wide shadowstalk.

DO IT! (Palpatine Voice)
Highly Rated
The death of super annoying owl spam and a new solo support!? Sign me up.
05/16/2018 11:30 AMPosted by LCD
Blizzard, please! OH MY GOD YES! Please give Tyrande that solo healer role again! When I first started playing this game Tyrande was one of my favorite healers and it was extremely fun especially with the old team/map wide shadowstalk.

DO IT! (Palpatine Voice)


Omg bring one of my favorite healers back!!!!
DO IT!!!! (Shia le Bouf voice)
I was going to say, someone should go tell that LCD guy then I realized you where the OP
I don't know why this is so hard to imagine. Pre rework, Tyrande was still able to do damage with owls, it just usually came at the expense of doing better heals. When you don't have forced themed tiers, choosing damage comes at the expense of doing better healing usually and balance is still attained.
05/16/2018 11:50 AMPosted by Volun
I don't know why this is so hard to imagine. Pre rework, Tyrande was still able to do damage with owls, it just usually came at the expense of doing better heals. When you don't have forced themed tiers, choosing damage comes at the expense of doing damage usually and balance is still attained.


Exactly, before this horrible rework she was a very good healer if you gotn the healing talents +shadowmeld, at the expense of damage. Your team have 2 suports? no problem, get an A.A. or own build, starfall and do that extra damage, and less healing. We had choice and i realy dont understand what is the problem with that
05/16/2018 11:30 AMPosted by LCD
Blizzard, please! OH MY GOD YES! Please give Tyrande that solo healer role again! When I first started playing this game Tyrande was one of my favorite healers and it was extremely fun especially with the old team/map wide shadowstalk.

DO IT! (Palpatine Voice)


bahahaha...
i had to go see this one for myself. omg this one is priceless for anyone that played the old tyrande up to now.

old tyrande had kind of an identity crisis too. she wasnt a healer or dps. so they decided, with the reason of being a 'viable solo healer', to buff shadowstalk and her heals. after that she got a rework that destroyed her healing and turned her into a dps. when that got a bit too assassin like for a support though she got nerfed.

now.. she is back to identity crisis. i guess we are just moving around a circle with her.
What the heck is there to debate about? Allow her to deal damage with owls or heal well but not both in the same build.

I'm very pleased to see they are internally discussing Tyrande. She was my favorite character until literally EXACTLY one year ago today when they reworked her to take all meaningful choice out of her talent builds and gutted her damage and healing.

I solo healed with Tyrande all the way up to rank 1 and had hundreds of games of fun during season 0. It hasn't been the same since and I miss both her and Rehgar being able to be aggressive but also meaningful supports.
Seems like a good candidate for our 2nd multi-class hero. Let her pick an identity at level 1 or 4.
Mmm, I don't know how I feel about this.

I actually like Tyrande's offensive half-support, half-dps style, even though it doesn't really work that well. On top of that, owl snipes are hilarious.

That being said, I would not be against taking power from her base kit and shoving it into talents that sharply dictate whether she's a solo healer, an assassin, or somewhere in the middle.

As Sancho said, I wouldn't mind her being a Multi-class if they thought they could pull it off right.
the problem is she is based all around being a hybrid. imo they should buff both aspects a bit by baking some extra damage and healing into her base kit and then make more of her talents based around what the player wants to focus on (healing or damage). Severely nerfing one aspect only to apply some buffs to another is going to leave her in an equally doo doo or simply worse situation than before.
05/16/2018 01:04 PMPosted by sancho
Seems like a good candidate for our 2nd multi-class hero. Let her pick an identity at level 1 or 4.

In that same AMA they said they were removing multi-class category from the game when the role update comes.
Please please please solo support!

I miss the old Tyrande solo support so badly.
Absolutely hated when they turned her into a hybrid.

Honestly, I hate when Blizzard turns heroes into something entirely different in the first place! Like bring Tassadar back to solo support standard! We don't have many supports, and most of them are horrible compared to the meta healers... so I wish Blizzard would focus on bringing more healers up to snuff.

05/16/2018 01:27 PMPosted by LCD
05/16/2018 01:04 PMPosted by sancho
Seems like a good candidate for our 2nd multi-class hero. Let her pick an identity at level 1 or 4.

In that same AMA they said they were removing multi-class category from the game when the role update comes.


Wait, so what are they doing with Varian??
05/16/2018 01:31 PMPosted by M3kk
Absolutely hated when they turned her into a hybrid.


The thing is, she still WAS a hybrid if you chose to spec her that way. Even with her solo healing capabilities, it never quite rivaled the other healers, but was made up for it in damage.

Her talent tree was quite flexible, you could sort of tweak it based on what you wanted to play. You could do more damage, more healing, or somewhere in between. For example, I liked doing an AA build with lunar momentum, it was primarily based in damage but still get shadowmeld, but it still allowed me to heal, so I was able to roughly get the same damage and healing.
I'm not sure what to think about it. Should we make the pool of sustained support even smaller? In QM and their set of rules it might make finding games for the sustained supportive classes even worse. What remains there then is Medivh, Zarya, Tass and Aba? Or should they also be viable as solo healer?

Not so sure if this is sth. we really need right now(until getting more sustained supports).
05/16/2018 11:30 AMPosted by LCD
I’m curious to hear any thoughts you all have on this.
seems sort of obvious, really. Just make her a multi-class. Her level 1 talent would determine if she is to be a healer or assassin. As she currently is, without a level 1 talent, she doesn't scale well at all. If she were reworked to put in a 'healing' talent at level 1, suddenly she can choose between two assassin builds (owl or flare), an offensive support build (mark), or a healing build (tbd).

Then the solution is to simply nerf everything in her base kit, but increase the power of all her level 1 talents (including the to-be-determined healing one). You could even add synergy between abilities later on in the talent tree - i.e. if Empower also allowed owls to shield allies it passes through for 200% of the healing tyrande has done in the last 5 seconds (healing count starts over when cast). This would make the CDR meaningless with a healing build, and the shielding nearly meaningless with an owl build - but both useful in their own right. Her entire talent tree could be like this, and that would be cool.
05/16/2018 11:30 AMPosted by LCD
From Reddit AMA today (May 16th)

• Tyrande’s current play style and talent builds can be really unique and compelling for certain players, but she doesn’t really have a role in the current meta. Internally, we are currently exploring some design changes to Tyrande that would make her viable as a solo healer. Overall the changes have been received very positively by our team, but there is a tradeoff: She is losing a lot of damage and her ability to chunk people from long distances with her owl build. This is something that we recognize can be fun for Tyrande players, so we’re carefully debating if this is the right direction for her. I’m curious to hear any thoughts you all have on this. Obviously, we could go the opposite route for her and remove/reduce her healing mechanic and point her more towards a ranged assassin.

• As I’m sure I will be asked in response to what I wrote above: Why make Tyrande a Healer, why not Assassin? We’re exploring the healing side of things as the rest of Tyrande’s kit can really encourage a Support-y playstyle—she can provide strong scouting for her team using Owls (using them to deal tons of damage works, but it’s a bit odd), her trait debuffs an enemy and helps the rest of your team to set up kills. We could make the trait more selfish, but we like its current iteration that sets up your team and essentially calls out a focus target. For her stun, were cautious to put a hard CC (stun) on the base kit of most ranged assassins. We do break this rule from time to time so it’s kind of soft for either way, but we feel more comfortable putting strong CC on Supports and Healers. This allows them to set up your team do meaningful things outside of purely healing.


Blizzard, please! OH MY GOD YES! Please give Tyrande that solo healer role again! When I first started playing this game Tyrande was one of my favorite healers and it was extremely fun especially with the old team/map wide shadowstalk.

DO IT! (Palpatine Voice)
what they said about kerrigan?
05/16/2018 11:54 AMPosted by Rafaelfras
i realy dont understand what is the problem with that
05/16/2018 11:54 AMPosted by Rafaelfras
very good healer
The problem is that she wasnt.
She wasnt a very good healer.
The only real value she had was that her healing was global so she could heal gold tier illidans on blackhearts bay in QM from across the map.

05/16/2018 03:52 PMPosted by Volun
Even with her solo healing capabilities, it never quite rivaled the other healers
Which was the problem.
05/16/2018 05:49 PMPosted by Urza
Which was the problem.


Not really, because she did significantly more damage than other healers to compensate for it. If a Tyrande did like 10k less healing but 20-30k more damage, that's easily going to affect the battle. She was well within the ballpark of other healers and could compete, even if her overall numbers were lower.

If you had trouble healing with Tyrande, that's probably user error, as many people actually quite enjoyed that role she took on.
maybe just revert to the old ways of talent trees where you either have to pick either heal talents or dps talents on the same tier. then she can choose which role shes going for

currently most talent trees separate survivalibility/support talents from damage ones as to not pigeonhole certain heroes into a role. at least i think that was the reasoning behind it, since people got called out for picking talents that stray from their heroes' 'main role'. well at least i was. remember dps rehgar? heh

so yea, old ways of talent trees might work for tyrande

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