So, we're gonna wait 8 weeks for next hero?

General Discussion
I'm just so happy they where able to cram as many Overwatch heroes as possible into the game during 2017, before "needing" to slow down releases now.

If only this game came out 2 years sooner, the slowdown could of happened during the launch of Overwatch and we would have all the most wanted WoW StarCraft and Diablo heroes in the game by now.
07/20/2018 03:30 AMPosted by Lightning
07/20/2018 03:25 AMPosted by GeorgeV
They've already announced publicly that they were slowing down Hero releases. Are you really that surprised that there are slower Hero releases?


Of course nobody is surprised that Hero releases are slower. However, I do think people are surprised at how little we are getting in return. If they slow down Hero releases, then you would expect them to finally start working on things like the reconnect system, or a total revamp of the matchmaker. But instead we get the occasional "Event" and some Hero reworks here and there.

The saddest part about all of this is that it's the community's fault we're in this mess because people aren't voting with their wallet. If the players on this game refused to let this business model work, we might actually see this game start to succeed for the players instead of for Blizzard.
Exactly! This is what i have been saying for months! The problem isnt the fact that they are simply slowing hero releases. The problem is that they are slowing hero releases for the purpose of making more improvements to the base game and they have not been doing so.

The last thing we need more of are skins and that seems to be the only thing they seem to he focusing on. Recent releases and reworks show that they arent doing alot of balancing internally. Fenix and Maeiv on release were absolutely rediculous and Raynor is almost game breaking right now with a near 60% WR in most leagues.

The reconnect feature is still broken, mobility is still a huge problem, Ect. Slowing down hero releases was a huge risk they took because that’s what keeps this game living a breathing, but they have yet to make it payoff in any significant way and it just feels more like just an excuse to release less overall content.
I think there will be a tease & reveal next week. No way they gonna wait til Gamescom 21th August for a hero reveal. :-)
07/20/2018 02:25 PMPosted by Remus
I think there will be a tease & reveal next week. No way they gonna wait til Gamescom 21th August for a hero reveal. :-)


It probably will anyway because it coincides with the conclusion of the ongoing event, Raiders of the Warchrome, which is slated to end at at August 6. So the only thing likely to follow that up would be a new hero release by August 7. So PTR would have to be the week prior, and prior to that the reveal trailer so yeah...
ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノ New hero or riot ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノ
07/20/2018 08:12 AMPosted by WereElf
Btw, what's with all the dislikes on my 1-st post on this thread?
I've noticed that solid facts, that people can't deny get downvoted a lot :P


Minus you're not posting facts, you're just claiming they are.

as of 7/26 of 2017 heroes of the storm had added 8 heroes and had reworked 7.
as of 7/10 of 2018 hots has added 4 heroes and reworked 7.

The claim blizzard did "3-7 reworks" in the span of two hero updates is false, but its also one you've repeated several times in several topics this year.

This might come as a surprise to you, but just having a hero show up in the patch notes doesn't constitute a 'rework', which would just about be the only way of getting the figures you so claim for the work put out last year. Now a couple of heroes could be said to say be 'retuned' by having a change in a trait, or given a baseline quest, but that's not 'reworking' the hero, and sure, that'd add a few more marks to heroes of note in 2017, but similar has also happened this year so the figures on that end, for month to date, are still similar.

The main difference is hero releases and the number of heroes that show up in a given patch note that have a number of small adjustments. Yea, the time interval between patches has been needlessly long and another hero release or event could have been fit into the year thus far, but its not as dramatic as you so claim from your 'undeniable facts'.

Its kinda funny how people can be so self-assured with general claims, but are likely the ones to not back their 'facts' with any specifics because they're so self-assured.
Hmm 8 weeks already? I only felt Deckard Cain was long
Are you guys crying becouse we have to wait 8 weeks for the next hero to come out?

I have been waiting 3 years for a proper fix to the matchmaking... and each time they try to do something it becomes even worst :(
<<<<<<<< HotS/DotA player crying because it takes 2 years for a new hero to come out in that game.

I'd rather they fix matchmaking.
07/20/2018 03:58 AMPosted by David
07/20/2018 03:44 AMPosted by WereElf
Before we were getting 2 hero releases + 3-7 reworks for the same amount of time it takes them now to release 1 hero + 2 reworks. Please, stop being ignorant and get your facts straight. If we moved from 2 + 3-7 to 1 + 5-10, then okay... although the list of heroes needing a rework would've been done quite fast. But that's not what's happening. We are getting less reworks along with the reduced hero release rate.

If they are indeed slowing down, I wish they'd at least make patches come every 3 weeks :P


I guess I am the only one that prefers devs not hurrying in delivering crap but instead taking their time to make a properly good product...


It's psychotic simple logic like this is being down voted.
As far as releasing skins goes: These are cheap to make, it gives the artists something to do, and all you have to do is make sure the new skin isn't buggy in some way. It doesn't need much (if any) coding, and who knows? Maybe you luck into something people really like and it gives you a new idea. At worst, you just have to come up with new visuals and call the voice actor back to do a really special skin.

As far as new characters- We've got plenty already, each very distinct (I'm not fully versed in every character, WoW ones largely don't draw me in enough to play them, but I see their place) and the screen is quite full when you go to character select. While it does help keep me interested in new developments, I don't mind having more time to get used to a new character.

As far as reworks- The game's been going for two years. Things have changed since the beta, and especially when you think about how some characters have shed abilities (didn't Naz have Bribe at one point? Bolt of the Storm anyone?) I think the devs are going back to try and get older characters re-tuned for the changes since beta while making sure they retain their identity.

Matchmaking? - I ain't touching that one. I haven't made my mind up one way or the other on it, and to help me decide I'll need a lot of info from Blizzard's servers... Ain't happening. Plus, I'm honestly of the opinion that no-one is gonna be happy no matter what gets done.
07/20/2018 03:25 AMPosted by GeorgeV
They've already announced publicly that they were slowing down Hero releases. Are you really that surprised that there are slower Hero releases?


That's deliberately misconstruing the post. They didn't for instance complain that it used to be 3.5 weeks on average and it's been a month now with no hero.

They complained they thought it would be closer to 8 weeks.

I.E. They know it's slowed down, they think taking 100% longer to release new characters is too much / more than we were led to expect / not compensated by any other development (indeed balance patches slower than their peak level currently and new features are as glacial or non-existent as has historically been the case, so more frequent reworks are pretty much the only thing and these appear rushed to say the least).

I don't disagree with the animus behind the post honestly.
07/20/2018 03:41 PMPosted by Xenterex
07/20/2018 08:12 AMPosted by WereElf
Btw, what's with all the dislikes on my 1-st post on this thread?
I've noticed that solid facts, that people can't deny get downvoted a lot :P


Minus you're not posting facts, you're just claiming they are.

as of 7/26 of 2017 heroes of the storm had added 8 heroes and had reworked 7.
as of 7/10 of 2018 hots has added 4 heroes and reworked 7.

The claim blizzard did "3-7 reworks" in the span of two hero updates is false, but its also one you've repeated several times in several topics this year.

This might come as a surprise to you, but just having a hero show up in the patch notes doesn't constitute a 'rework', which would just about be the only way of getting the figures you so claim for the work put out last year. Now a couple of heroes could be said to say be 'retuned' by having a change in a trait, or given a baseline quest, but that's not 'reworking' the hero, and sure, that'd add a few more marks to heroes of note in 2017, but similar has also happened this year so the figures on that end, for month to date, are still similar.

The main difference is hero releases and the number of heroes that show up in a given patch note that have a number of small adjustments. Yea, the time interval between patches has been needlessly long and another hero release or event could have been fit into the year thus far, but its not as dramatic as you so claim from your 'undeniable facts'.

Its kinda funny how people can be so self-assured with general claims, but are likely the ones to not back their 'facts' with any specifics because they're so self-assured.

I suppose it's all about the perception about what a rework is. Do you consider the Jaina rework (that came with KTZ's release) a rework? It was fairly small, but it touched what was needed.
Anyways... if what you say is true, than let me change my point:
1) We are not getting more reworks.
2) We are getting less retunes (which are not just number changes).
i dont buy anything with real money in this game now

coz i have much time to farm 15000 gold to buy new hero LOL
Okay, I spent an hour or 2, making a table. There I put all the hero releases in 2017 and 2018, all reworks, all retunes, all balance updates and all tweaks.
Sometimes I couldn't tell the difference between a rework and retune, or a balance and a retune, but I tried my best to be as accurate as I can.
So, from 14-th February until 11-th July last year we got:
- 7 heroes released
- 12 heroes reworked
- 4 heroes retuned
- 72 balance changes
- 16 heroes tweaked
And from 6-th February until 10-th July (a bit longer span) this year we got:
- 4 heroes released
- 8 heroes reworked
- 7 heroes retuned
- 93 balance changes
- 10 tweaks
For me reworks are changes to heroes, which change their talent trees, and sometimes their abilities.
Retunes are changes to heroes, which can change the functionality of an ability (or of the hero in general, like Malthael's basic attack splash), which can lead to changes of some talents. But a lot of number changes, along with some talent functionality changes can also be considered a retune.
Then balance changes are simply changes in the hero's numbers.
Tweaks are single changes in the hero's kit, that are not simply number changes. Like Greymane's ultimate upgrade, or allowing Ana to heal from structures, or giving damage to Cassia's W.

Also, last year we got total of:
15 heroes released
27 heroes reworked
10 heroes retuned
187 balance changes
23 heroes tweaked

But I admit I was wrong, we weren't getting a rework every patch.
4-th Jan - 1 hero, 1 retune
24-th Jan - 1 hero, 2 reworks
14-th Feb - 1 hero, 1 rework
27-th Feb - 1 retune
14-th Mar - 1 hero, 5 reworks
4-th Apr - 1 hero, 1 retune
25-th Apr - 1 hero, 1 rework
16-th May - 1 hero, 2 reworks, 1 retune
13-th Jun - 1 hero, 2 reworks, 1 retune
11-th Jul - 1 hero, 1 rework
8-th Aug - 1 hero, 1 retune
5-th Sep - 1 hero, 4 reworks
20-th Sep - 1 retune
26-th Sep - 1 hero, 1 rework, 1 retune
11-th Oct - 1 retune
17-th Oct - 1 hero, 2 reworks
14-th Nov - 1 hero, 1 rework
29-th Nov - 1 rework
12-th Dec - 1 hero, 4 reworks
20-th Dec - 1 retune
So yeah, we didn't always get reworks along with hero releases. I also didn't count changes that weren't related to the hero's performance as changes at all (like new UI and stuff).

EDIT: Okay, now I have some solid data. Let me see you defend the devs now.
07/20/2018 03:07 AMPosted by Akasut
Yrel came out June 12th. We have passed 5 weeks this week and yet no teasers, making me believe teasers are coming next week instead? That would be 6 weeks. One week PTR following the teaser-week, that would be 7 weeks and then release 7th of August for total of 8 weeks apart. Lets be generous and shave off one week... that is still 7 weeks.

Before: 3-4 weeks.
Now: 7-8 weeks.

Gotta love the new direction the ship is sailing.


This game has enough heroes already, which is why I'm more than fine with fact that new hero releases aren't so often! Right now they should focus more on fixing this game's problems.
07/20/2018 09:49 PMPosted by WereElf
Anyways... if what you say is true, than let me change my point:
1) We are not getting more reworks.
2) We are getting less retunes (which are not just number changes).


"if" as in... you haven't bothered to check, you're just claiming numbers for the sake of claiming numbers?

There's about 12 'non quite rework' type of changes on heroes that influenced their trait, baseline quests, or baseline talents prior to december in 2017. dec to jan brought a hefty slew of changes regarding lane balance and the stealth reworks so I wouldn't account for that to compare to 2018 as those were blizzcon announced changes and I'd stave off a direct comparison till the same event happens this year, but that time frame did influence a hefty number of heroes.

That said, I'd arguably say there's about ~7ish similar "not reworks" done so far this year — 'arguably' because there are more instances of such changes in both 2017 and 2018, but some were changes done one year, that were undone this year. If one is comparing similar time frames, then 2018 has seen more 'retuning' on heroes thus far than were done by this time of year for 2017.

If you concern were expressed as the span of the last 12 months seeing more changes in 2017 than in 2018, then yea, that's mostly a no-brainer cuz blizzcon was a thing, but otherwise, it seems you've been spouting that figure out of impulse and just asserting yourself to be right without actually bothering to check.

That sort of thing pretty much kills whatever 'point' you thought you had.

edit note:
Okay, now I have some solid data. Let me see you defend the devs now.

made this reply before your most recent post.

First item: I'm not defending the devs, I'm challenging your assertion that you claim as "fact" to which, you thus far having to look up the information and find out your claim was inaccurate pretty much already demonstrates you're spouting bias and pretending its objective.

This same issue is pretty much manifest in how you assert that I have to "defend" the devs, rather than express concern in you being elated by faulty and incomplete information.

Second: the basis of your conjecture in more on semantics than it is on 'hard data'. While this time you at least qualified the terms of how you view changes, what you propose for figures is based more on your assertion or 'feeling' of how you want to interpret the figures, rather than the jargon expressed in dev notes or used by blues. Some of the distinctions you make aren't wrong, but the extent of it does pretty much come off as skewed claim because you're trying to cast this as a polarized concern, ie, you vs the 'devs' as you so claim to need to be defended.

So rather than amend your perspective and realize your 'solid facts' (that you've were backing and repeating for... how long?) you hold the same arrogance of position, but rather demand i have to stave off your 'attack' and thus 'defend' something to suit your bias.

You might wanna go back to square one and figure out the inherent issue is what you even consider to be 'fact', let alone how that trickles down to influence your argument before you rile yourself up over some magical strawman to persist that bias you're touting.

My concern here isn't the devs, its people riling themselves up over lies. You want want to consider that before pretending people who disagree with you have to do so to be shills or whiteknights or whatever else the stupid crap you have to tell yourself to ignore pertinent information that doesn't suit you.
07/21/2018 04:40 AMPosted by Xenterex
"if" as in... you haven't bothered to check, you're just claiming numbers for the sake of claiming numbers?

Read my next post, please.
I just want to mention to those who are talking about "if hero releases are this slow, why aren't they working on matchmaking or better replays, etc etc." Those sorts of things are much more...background and backend oriented. It's not something that is regularly teased, flaunted, etc like new heros, reworks and skins.

Now, you might ask, why do we have no real info on those things? One reason is fear of backlash when they inevitably need to delay things. I'll use LoL as an example: there was a time they teased the replay system. It ended up taking them years to actually release one. For so long it was a huge joke in the community. Same with them creating a new launcher. Those things ended up taking far longer than (I assume anyway) they projected (I've been away from LoL for a couple years now so my time estimates and such may be off).

I can't fully defend the Blizz devs as it does often seem their priorities are in the wrong place, but sometimes it hard to see exactly what devs are truly doing behind the scenes. So I guess I tend to be a tad bit more lenient? Or give some of them the benefit of the doubt? Call it either a personal character strength or a personal character flaw depending on who you ask.

Though I'd be tempted tell them to drop literally everything until they get matchmaking for all modes in a reasonable state. At least, everything for devs that have cross-department abilities.
07/21/2018 04:49 AMPosted by WereElf
Read my next post, please.


I made an edit note, but the content of my concern on the original post doesn't change.

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