D.Va rework?

General Discussion
I have yet to hear someone say we need a dva. She is specified as a bruiser but she can't what other bruisers do effectively. She can't hold a lane and she can't take camps effectively (she can do that but other bruisers and assassins can do it way better than her).

It says in her description that she causes high disruption and peels for her team which is true but she can do that with one skill only and that skill is her only way to also initiate or escape from a fight and can easily be stopped by a root, stun, or silence and even if it is not stopped it won't really turn the tides of the game.

I can list so many bad things about her but I wanna keep it short. My point is she can be easily shut down with any form of cc and even if no one shuts her down she just doesn't make that much of an impact. I mean if a hero is so hard countered by any cc u would expect that hero to have a huge impact like Yrel or Sonya for example but dva doesn't at all.
Not many people play dva very well so it is natural that people will not ask for her in solo q with a bunch of randoms. However, I’ve seen nazmas destroy on dva and I personally find a lot of success with her as well.

While she doesn’t usually outright win a lane, holding it is pretty easy in most matchups. Try not lose your mech, but even if you do, it will be back in no time as long as you stay active and play safe.

Her boosters can easily turn the tide of key fights. You want to use it to interrupt the enemy and to push a target towards your team, or a corner, while pushing the rest of their team away from them.

You can become unstoppable at lvl 10 if you find yourself playing into a lot of cc, so it’s not really an impossibly hard counter. You just have to time it right. It also enables you to position more aggressivly and set up wombos.

Even if you insist on big shot, she is very mobile with boosters and can avoid most cc as long as you stay alert and play smart. Also, you can later get her a combat roll in pilot mode to make it easier to avoid cc while out of mech.

Being successful with dva is more about outplaying the opponent and finding creative ways to make plays than it is about having big numbers or being generally op.
The biggest problem with D.Va is that it's played by simpletons who ignore her massive AA damage output in pilot mode. I've topped Hero Damage many times with her, but everyone just immediately runs away and goes AFK when they lose the mech.
07/30/2018 12:23 PMPosted by Hexi
The biggest problem with D.Va is that it's played by simpletons who ignore her massive AA damage output in pilot mode. I've topped Hero Damage many times with her, but everyone just immediately runs away and goes AFK when they lose the mech.


Pilot mode does a lot of damage, i use it mostly to finish the backlines of squishies, unless stuned u can mech again and start the unending cycle again.
07/30/2018 12:31 PMPosted by VBlackWolfV
07/30/2018 12:23 PMPosted by Hexi
The biggest problem with D.Va is that it's played by simpletons who ignore her massive AA damage output in pilot mode. I've topped Hero Damage many times with her, but everyone just immediately runs away and goes AFK when they lose the mech.


Pilot mode does a lot of damage, i use it mostly to finish the backlines of squishies, unless stuned u can mech again and start the unending cycle again.


Tripleshots wins games, true story.
07/30/2018 11:50 AMPosted by TearGrants
I have yet to hear someone say we need a dva. She is specified as a bruiser but she can't what other bruisers do effectively. She can't hold a lane and she can't take camps effectively (she can do that but other bruisers and assassins can do it way better than her).

It says in her description that she causes high disruption and peels for her team which is true but she can do that with one skill only and that skill is her only way to also initiate or escape from a fight and can easily be stopped by a root, stun, or silence and even if it is not stopped it won't really turn the tides of the game.

I can list so many bad things about her but I wanna keep it short. My point is she can be easily shut down with any form of cc and even if no one shuts her down she just doesn't make that much of an impact. I mean if a hero is so hard countered by any cc u would expect that hero to have a huge impact like Yrel or Sonya for example but dva doesn't at all.


D.va niche is she's very good vs. Single dps hyper carry compositions.

Think Valla/Tass/Auriel, Grey/Aba/Uther or Cho"gall.

That's her niche.
she's one of the worst tanks in the game and one of the worst bruisers in the game.

she barely scratches 3% popularity in master league (even in diamond she's 3% of less) and her pro play popularity is a flat 0%. people at the height of skill in the game don't consider her worth a pick OR a ban which says a lot.

Not many people play dva very well so it is natural that people will not ask for her in solo q with a bunch of randoms. However, I’ve seen nazmas destroy on dva and I personally find a lot of success with her as well.


This stopped being an excuse like 8 months ago. D.va has been out for well over a year and not even pro players find her useful so it isn't a learn to play issue.

While she doesn’t usually outright win a lane, holding it is pretty easy in most matchups. Try not lose your mech, but even if you do, it will be back in no time as long as you stay active and play safe.
she really isn't. a decent solo laner like Malthael or sonya will easy keep healing and doing tremendous damage to you and outright kill your mech, bullying you out of lane. remember that mech kills still count for some exp so that adds up over time.


Her boosters can easily turn the tide of key fights. You want to use it to interrupt the enemy and to push a target towards your team, or a corner, while pushing the rest of their team away from them.


her boosters can be instantly shut down by most forms of CC. an auriel slap, malfurion root, Diablo charge, etc cancel it, leaving her stranded.

You can become unstoppable at lvl 10 if you find yourself playing into a lot of cc, so it’s not really an impossibly hard counter. You just have to time it right. It also enables you to position more aggressivly and set up wombos.
all people need to do is walk away when they think she'll start using Bunny hop and D.va now has no ult for 100 seconds. it also provides no protection whatsoever so % damage from someone like tychus will instantly shred her mech's health down to near nothing.

Even if you insist on big shot, she is very mobile with boosters and can avoid most cc as long as you stay alert and play smart. Also, you can later get her a combat roll in pilot mode to make it easier to avoid cc while out of mech.


dva's default speed is slow enough to get CC'ed and her pilot mode is easy to CC regardless of combat roll because she can't change how she exits a destroyed mech. if I play a malfurion root right below a destroyed mech, pilot mode D.va is trapped 100% of the time.

Being successful with dva is more about outplaying the opponent and finding creative ways to make plays than it is about having big numbers or being generally op.


you realize that you're basically saying the only way for D.Va to be successful is to be better than the enemy, right? you don't think that speaks to how bad she is?
07/30/2018 02:45 PMPosted by UncleGanon
she's one of the worst tanks in the game and one of the worst bruisers in the game.

she barely scratches 3% popularity in master league (even in diamond she's 3% of less) and her pro play popularity is a flat 0%. people at the height of skill in the game don't consider her worth a pick OR a ban which says a lot.

Not many people play dva very well so it is natural that people will not ask for her in solo q with a bunch of randoms. However, I’ve seen nazmas destroy on dva and I personally find a lot of success with her as well.


This stopped being an excuse like 8 months ago. D.va has been out for well over a year and not even pro players find her useful so it isn't a learn to play issue.

While she doesn’t usually outright win a lane, holding it is pretty easy in most matchups. Try not lose your mech, but even if you do, it will be back in no time as long as you stay active and play safe.
she really isn't. a decent solo laner like Malthael or sonya will easy keep healing and doing tremendous damage to you and outright kill your mech, bullying you out of lane. remember that mech kills still count for some exp so that adds up over time.


Her boosters can easily turn the tide of key fights. You want to use it to interrupt the enemy and to push a target towards your team, or a corner, while pushing the rest of their team away from them.


her boosters can be instantly shut down by most forms of CC. an auriel slap, malfurion root, Diablo charge, etc cancel it, leaving her stranded.

You can become unstoppable at lvl 10 if you find yourself playing into a lot of cc, so it’s not really an impossibly hard counter. You just have to time it right. It also enables you to position more aggressivly and set up wombos.
all people need to do is walk away when they think she'll start using Bunny hop and D.va now has no ult for 100 seconds. it also provides no protection whatsoever so % damage from someone like tychus will instantly shred her mech's health down to near nothing.

Even if you insist on big shot, she is very mobile with boosters and can avoid most cc as long as you stay alert and play smart. Also, you can later get her a combat roll in pilot mode to make it easier to avoid cc while out of mech.


dva's default speed is slow enough to get CC'ed and her pilot mode is easy to CC regardless of combat roll because she can't change how she exits a destroyed mech. if I play a malfurion root right below a destroyed mech, pilot mode D.va is trapped 100% of the time.

Being successful with dva is more about outplaying the opponent and finding creative ways to make plays than it is about having big numbers or being generally op.


you realize that you're basically saying the only way for D.Va to be successful is to be better than the enemy, right? you don't think that speaks to how bad she is?


U said exactly what I wanted to say.

The malf root on her mech and then pilot dva gets rooted when she exits is one of the worst things to experience as a dva player. This works with li ming as well she destroys the mech then throws her stuff at pilot dva again and she is deleted.
07/30/2018 02:04 PMPosted by Darmonic
07/30/2018 11:50 AMPosted by TearGrants
I have yet to hear someone say we need a dva. She is specified as a bruiser but she can't what other bruisers do effectively. She can't hold a lane and she can't take camps effectively (she can do that but other bruisers and assassins can do it way better than her).

It says in her description that she causes high disruption and peels for her team which is true but she can do that with one skill only and that skill is her only way to also initiate or escape from a fight and can easily be stopped by a root, stun, or silence and even if it is not stopped it won't really turn the tides of the game.

I can list so many bad things about her but I wanna keep it short. My point is she can be easily shut down with any form of cc and even if no one shuts her down she just doesn't make that much of an impact. I mean if a hero is so hard countered by any cc u would expect that hero to have a huge impact like Yrel or Sonya for example but dva doesn't at all.


D.va niche is she's very good vs. Single dps hyper carry compositions.

Think Valla/Tass/Auriel, Grey/Aba/Uther or Cho"gall.

That's her niche.


The presence of a shield support on a key target completely negates dva's dmg. While she might be able to annoy the support a bit, in the end she will be destroyed. How is this her niche?
Her biggest problem to me is that she is like a bonus EXP for the enemy team.
D.Va is pretty bad right now, I made multiple post in the recent days regarding her and for once I am actually glad there are a lot of people voicing their thoughts on her and how bad she is.

I made a while topic about her not so long ago if you want to check it out op

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/heroes/topic/20766136687#post-1
you realize that you're basically saying the only way for D.Va to be successful is to be better than the enemy, right? you don't think that speaks to how bad she is?


I thought that was how games worked. Unless you expect to be WORSE than someone and still beat them with D.va... go Genji if you want to do that.
Honestly I'd just settle with a few talents being rearranged first.
07/30/2018 11:50 AMPosted by TearGrants
I have yet to hear someone say we need a dva.
Probably because we don't. And never did.
Why does her Mech base movespeed have to be a more or less permanent slow ?

I get that her Boosters give her mobility and ability to rotate around the map alright, but the permanent reduced speed feels really bad. I would start with a change to that, and plenty of talents that could be rearranged.
07/30/2018 04:45 PMPosted by TearGrants
<span class="truncated">...</span>

D.va niche is she's very good vs. Single dps hyper carry compositions.

Think Valla/Tass/Auriel, Grey/Aba/Uther or Cho"gall.

That's her niche.


The presence of a shield support on a key target completely negates dva's dmg. While she might be able to annoy the support a bit, in the end she will be destroyed. How is this her niche?


See you don't even understand how that's her niche because you think it's damage related when it's more about her defense matrix offering the highest reduced damage Untalented and the fact her Q and E offer insane team displacement.

Putting defense matrix on the protect the dps comps shackles them greatly and generally they all stick together as well when D.va is good at separating them.
People simply ignore her mech and slaughter her team. She has too little threat and peel in mech form. She's almost like release Yrel where ppl can just walk around her.
My issue with D.va is that she actually feels a bit similar to Chen, in that it's often easy to ignore her in mech form, since she doesn't pose much of a thread then. Boosters are okay, but far from the best mobility or CC around, Defense Matrix feels floaty and easy to avoid, in spite of its powerful damage reduction, and Self-Destruct is good for temporary zoning, but little else. It feels like D.va is spread too thin across different abilities, and pays too steep a price for them with her lack of mount, and XP on mech kill.

Personally, I think it might help to take a page from her changes in Overwatch, and shift her abilities around so that she has access to micro-missiles. D.va is notable for having some waveclear on her mech autos, and good single-target DPS in pilot form. Given appropriate balancing, if she were to lose Bunny Hop (which is already an unpopular heroic), have Self-Destruct moved to her R, and had access to both Self-Destruct and Big Shot from the get-go, with Micro Missiles as her mech E, she would already have far better access to different damage tools, even if it would mean nerfs to her overall. I also feel it would help if destroying her mech granted only 25% champion XP on-kill, or no XP bonus at all (the focus would then be to finish off the squishy, immobile pilot it leaves behind). With this setup, she'd have much clearer strengths (i.e. waveclear and teamfight-oriented AoE damage), which her weaknesses would do a better job of justifying.
...

The presence of a shield support on a key target completely negates dva's dmg. While she might be able to annoy the support a bit, in the end she will be destroyed. How is this her niche?


See you don't even understand how that's her niche because you think it's damage related when it's more about her defense matrix offering the highest reduced damage Untalented and the fact her Q and E offer insane team displacement.

Putting defense matrix on the protect the dps comps shackles them greatly and generally they all stick together as well when D.va is good at separating them.


DM range is very small and duration is 3 sec and is locked in one direction. They can simply walk out of it since dva's movement speed is lower than all other heroes or it can be shut down with a stun or silence. DM is very unreliable and is not a counter to anything in this game.

Her boosters offer very little displacement to count as a good counter to anything also it is her skill for mobility and easily stopped by a stun silence root or a push so it is also unreliable.

Self destruct can offer some zoning but leaves dva vulnerable. Heroes with stasis will remain inside the self destruct to kill u and go in stasis before it explodes and high hp tanks will also try to kill u and not care if they take 50% dmg. So in the end best case scenario u delayed them for 4 sec and that's it.

This really isn't a counter to anything. You can easily counter dva and even if u don't counter her all she does is just delay or stall and that's it. She counters nothing in this game.
07/30/2018 05:25 PMPosted by Banshee
D.Va is pretty bad right now, I made multiple post in the recent days regarding her and for once I am actually glad there are a lot of people voicing their thoughts on her and how bad she is.

I made a while topic about her not so long ago if you want to check it out op

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/heroes/topic/20766136687#post-1


I also don't understand why bunny hop is on a 100 sec CD. Pitiful dmg and puts her in a vulnerable position. This ult should have 50 sec cd at max or add other game changing effects to it to make it worth 100 sec CD.

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