counter to mephisto global. L2P or OP?

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What are the thoughts... people always get caught off guard by new mechanics. Is this L2P or OP?

The way I see it, it’s like pyro... just keep your self invuln, self armor, self shield talents on standby or make sure you are by your healer when it is channeling.

The only gripe I have is that this ult is a littler unfair to abathur and TLV (until they get jump... not that they are ever picked)

PS: Zeus in dota has been around for over 10 years, he has an insta cast global nuke that can be modified to do more damage as well as double cast. I get dota isn’t the same but that community has figured out how to adapt to that global nuke for a while now...
I think it is definitely Overturned a little. At level 20 it can basically kill abathur by itself. Deleting a hero globally is never a good mechanic
Big time OP, cheesy game skill.

Its one of those things you have to ask, "how did that get past development?"
09/05/2018 12:12 PMPosted by Geisard
I think it is definitely Overturned a little. At level 20 it can basically kill abathur by itself. Deleting a hero globally is never a good mechanic


I recall seeing numbers crunched on this that even with the double cast at level 20 it still would not kill abathur. I might be mistaken but I remember hearing that during gamescom. If there's a level difference yes but on its own no. If that's not correct and the double cast can kill abathur at the same level and full health it should be nerfed a little but it is far from the OP monster so many people here are complaining about
09/05/2018 12:29 PMPosted by mada7
I recall seeing numbers crunched on this that even with the double cast at level 20 it still would not kill abathur.

Without the other boosts, abathur would barely be able to survive. He is going to be below 200hp. And thats at equal levels.

When mephisto however gains spell power boosts, abathur will not be able to survie the 2nd hit. This is because he can get over 40% of spell power easily.

To be honest, its not a problem in any draft modes. For those modes, if you chose abathur when the enemy can counter you, you kinda deserved to die. And even on that, if you had a last pick abathur, if the enemy chose to counter you, they might have lost on some other aspect.

But even then, in theory you should always be able to get away by digging into the spawnroom (which causes invuln), since that takes less than 2.5s to perform, and can still be done after the first hit.
If its realy showing to be a problem, they are probably going to nerf it. But i suspect its just another thing for an abathur to learn (as if it isnt enough already though, abathur is difficult enough as it is).
Its very much a "L2P" issue, it gives you a visual during its 2.5 sec channeling time so everyone knows when they will be hit. Its damage at level 10 is around 500 which isnt a ton for 95% of the roster. Ice block and spell armor is the best counters outside of staying above 20% hp.

The hero is easily counter by staying within melee range and using his displayed teleport function to your own advantage. Honestly in a few weeks (once the misinformed and low skilled players open their eyes and try to learn something) this character is going to have a hard time due to the wide roster of heroes that can ruin his day easily.

Honestly with nearly every new hero (despite how much it was requested) the community whines and moans about little things they often know very little about often making a big deal/issue out of hardly anything. There is no "perfect" release for a new hero and Honestly he is much weaker than Fenix (even after his nerfs) in lane, quality of life, mobility and in damage/team fight damage.

I think Bliz did a good job with this release even though I do not like the hero itself.
09/05/2018 12:07 PMPosted by YoloBaggins
people always get caught off guard by new mechanics.
Like there is many counter play to a global unavoidable damage ult.
You have to face tank it somehow, or go protected/invulnerable.
09/05/2018 12:54 PMPosted by Alias

But even then, in theory you should always be able to get away by digging into the spawnroom (which causes invuln), since that takes less than 2.5s to perform, and can still be done after the first hit.
If its realy showing to be a problem, they are probably going to nerf it. But i suspect its just another thing for an abathur to learn (as if it isnt enough already though, abathur is difficult enough as it is).


^^this

Why does this never come up? As an abba player your multitasking needs to be impeccable. Canceling you hat to dig back to base is not very hard to do. Or going into a clone for that matter
09/05/2018 12:21 PMPosted by Firefly63
Its one of those things you have to ask, "how did that get past development?"


They probably use skilled players to test things.
Maybe it's damage could be reduced some, but overall I think Mephisto is okay. Most of the time the ult is just to pick off already low, already about to die anyway heroes. Even playing as Nova I thought it would be annoying being detected AND taking damage, but honestly, it wasn't that bad because I was normally at a safe distance from everyone. It wasn't used specifically to detect me.
Everybody just needs to jump in Blaze's bunker when they see the Ult going off...

;)
You mean that free damage boost Mephisto keeps giving me? Yeah OP

The counterplay is in the large delay it has before hitting. Plenty of time to get your team to heal through the damage, shield it, or whatever.

Some heroes flat out nulify the entire thing without any effort. Blaze with his bunker, Medivh with his AoE shield at 13. Another option i've seen is if Mephisto is using it snipe a low hp enemy, Ana's eye of horus ultimate is a massive counter since Ana can snipe heal whoever it is regardless of where they are. And if he's sniping Ana with it, she can just grenade herself, which most of the time will heal her enough to survive the blast.

If he's using it for burst damage in teamfights. Either CC him or heal through it. Any AoE heal will basically nulify most of it.

Another fun counter i've done is Hanzo if your good at predicting where he is firing it from. Dragon arrow him while he is channeling it.
The biggest counter to the Double Cast of Consume Souls:

People not laying off the guy that is at 10% health and killing him in the 2.5 second window, thereby making it so the first cast of Consume Souls doesn't get a kill and therefor doesn't get a second cast.
09/05/2018 12:54 PMPosted by Alias
For those modes, if you chose abathur when the enemy can counter you, you kinda deserved to die.

Wrong. That's bad game design.
There always needs to be a way to play around your counters.

But if it were too strong, probably reduced damage, and reduced cooldown, maybe increased slow.
I'm not going to say that it's OP, but it is pretty cheesy to have a hero press a button to use a nonskill shot to deal damage to an entire team forcing the players on that team to try to avoid it either by tanking it or saving CDs for it.

As such, I really dislike this ability.
in qm at lv 20 it deletes most of squishy in team fight
So the team with Abathur has to have a level disadvantage even though, by design of Abathur, his team shouldnt be trying so hard to maintain equal level or higher especially after level 10 when Abby can help win team fights.

Sounds like the team with Abby and a level disadvantage were doomed to lose anyway.
09/05/2018 03:53 PMPosted by FoxBlade
I'm not going to say that it's OP, but it is pretty cheesy to have a hero press a button to use a nonskill shot to deal damage to an entire team forcing the players on that team to try to avoid it either by tanking it or saving CDs for it.

As such, I really dislike this ability.


Flat out a very bad mechanic, and Developers should be ashamed of not coming of with a better idea, or at least make it a more difficult skill than just pressing a button and damage everyone. It's BS heroic even if it is on such long CD
09/05/2018 04:01 PMPosted by DudeMan
So the team with Abathur has to have a level disadvantage even though, by design of Abathur, his team shouldnt be trying so hard to maintain equal level or higher especially after level 10 when Abby can help win team fights.

Sounds like the team with Abby and a level disadvantage were doomed to lose anyway.


It is only an "ista-kill" on Abathur after level 20 and ONLY if the second cast procs (which requires someone dying to the first cast.)

And even then if the Abathur player burrows during either of those casts (or clones someone, like he would be doing in a team fight anyway...) then he will survive.

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