Garden of Terror AWFUL changes

General Discussion
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09/14/2018 05:34 AMPosted by autobusik2
What are devs smoking?? Objective which can disable structures pushing every lane?? Seriously this will be the most broken map ever. Even with good draft and coordinated team it will be nearly impossible not to lose all three walls (1500 xp) unless the terror itself is weak as hell. With one or more teammates down, lvl disadvantage or worse team it will be so easy to lose all three forts, which is almost guaranteed loss.


ow and u can take merc camps before the push. ever take a bruiser camp, then put a pot down then run to another tower? image if u had an ai terror pushing at the same time. 1 or 2 ppl are not going to be able to stop that push if a team is attacking somewhere.
blizzard allways does crap like this and then blames the players...

blizzard doesn't give a ....
I just wish that the developers would be active the forums to show where they understand players' frustrations in the game. Probably due to the fact that they've been busy, but I remember when the developers promised to be more active and they haven't been lately.

I don't expect activity within our discussions, but a thread; letting us know:
- These are the complaints/frustrations we've received (with proof),
- These are the changes we're proposing and we'll most likely apply.

They claim their changes warranted; yet the vast majority of posts in this open thread shows confusion. As players, it is our right to know the exact reasons to changes to the game; not simply "this is frustrating to players ¯\_(ツ)_/¯" without proof.
09/13/2018 03:52 PMPosted by FoxBlade
No one said 'strategy' isn't a valid way to use the terror. The issue I have is that neither team has to fight to obtain the objective, both teams can avoid fighting and achieve a terror for themselves - which makes it easier for a losing team to prolong games.

Compare this to Dragon Shire where both teams fight over the objective and the team that wins the objective gets a clear advantage for doing so.


Then they should remake the map to be more like dragon shire, and not to be teamfight fest.
Maybe you should put this game into maintenance state.You're doing a lot of damage to the game by your ruinworks , map reworks.You simply have no idea for this game.I can't see you anymore becouse your head is somewhere in the asses of "professional scene" players.
09/15/2018 12:43 AMPosted by Bladerunner
No one said 'strategy' isn't a valid way to use the terror. The issue I have is that neither team has to fight to obtain the objective, both teams can avoid fighting and achieve a terror for themselves - which makes it easier for a losing team to prolong games.

Compare this to Dragon Shire where both teams fight over the objective and the team that wins the objective gets a clear advantage for doing so.


Then they should remake the map to be more like dragon shire, and not to be teamfight fest.

I don't even understand the problem in the first place. The possibility of avoiding teamfights, having to decide if split or not during objectives, etc, are things that give this map a way better comeback change than other maps. That's one of the things I like the most about it.
I have to agree with this, this changes are idiotic, ruining one of the best mechanics in the game: Competing/collecting for an armor of mass destruction on both sides. This is unique in the game. Changing it would be a horrible mistake
09/13/2018 01:35 PMPosted by Berengaria
It does seem Blizzard wants to lessen the strength of PVE games and keep this more of a brawler. Most of the players I'm matched with don't understand soak, map and lane control, heck, it's often almost impossible to pull them out of mid lane. Maybe Blizzards knows best the section of the player-base who wants this to be the focus of HOTS.

I'm not one of them, I like the variety in maps and the different strategies that come with them, I don't want to play a simplified five man brawler.


So, you're literally confusing the terrible PvE maps (such as Garden and BHB) with the mindless blind brawling players? The two have nothing to do with each other.
I'am in agreement with those speaking against changes for the first time since HOTS has been released. I used to defend matchmaking system and unpopular hero reworks, let alone new hero kits and character models. But this........ this is a single most uncalled and dumb redesign I've ever seen. Please Blizzard do not follow through with it, listen to community like you did with Hanamura.
I think the GoT map is fine the way it is and hate these changes that without a doubt will go through regardless of player base. I have literally won a match solely cause of the terror and using what is for but also lost matches cause had people who use the terror not what its intended for.
Dear Blizzard, please don't apply this map rework.
It was one o' the BEST maps in the game with tons o' different ways to win.
#SaveControlTerror
Glad to see this thread still "trending". And I see the likes to dislikes ratio on the Youtube video have only widened.
Talking about leaving the game... do both teams get a red mark when they close the game for 30 seconds?
09/13/2018 12:44 PMPosted by Wraithdagger
So, instead of having a unique map with cool effects and the strategic element of choosing where and when to fight for seeds AND when and where to attack with a Terror, we get a carbon copy of AP and CH which is decided in 5v5 mosh pits over objectives every couple minutes?

TERRIBLE decision.

This completely guts variety in the map pool. Some maps like Warhead and Cursed Hollow are very macro/PvE-centric spreading players out over a large area. Others are very PvP centric where action tends to occur in 1 specific area at a time - Volskaya, Alterac Pass. Changing Garden of Terror to be very team-fight-centric instead of the good balance we have now (medium sized map, 2 objective spawn) completely DESTROYS what makes the map great right now.

Not to mention, the video claims that players were "frustrated" by the current design but fails to explain what was frustrating. Again, this completely removes variety between maps and it may as well just be a reskinned Alterac Pass.

DO NOT go through with this change, Blizzard. I will be leaving every game I am forced to play on this trash and that's if I don't outright uninstall because I am quite happy with the current version of GoT and would love to know why it deserves to be removed instead of tweaked.

Garbage.

Maybe some one link this theme on reddit? And maybe they are shall see how many people against this changes on their own the site.
09/13/2018 01:35 PMPosted by Berengaria
09/13/2018 12:44 PMPosted by Wraithdagger
Not to mention, the video claims that players were "frustrated" by the current design but fails to explain what was frustrating.


They said that really? What players told them that, people who post on Reddit? There has been very little discussion regarding this map on the offical forums, what little of it was more positive than negative and I don't recall anyone saying they were "frustrated" by the design of the map.

09/13/2018 12:44 PMPosted by Wraithdagger
This completely guts variety in the map pool. Some maps like Warhead and Cursed Hollow are very macro/PvE-centric spreading players out over a large area. Others are very PvP centric where action tends to occur in 1 specific area at a time - Volskaya, Alterac Pass. Changing Garden of Terror to be very team-fight-centric instead of the good balance we have now (medium sized map, 2 objective spawn) completely DESTROYS what makes the map great right now.


It does seem Blizzard wants to lessen the strength of PVE games and keep this more of a brawler. Most of the players I'm matched with don't understand soak, map and lane control, heck, it's often almost impossible to pull them out of mid lane. Maybe Blizzards knows best the section of the player-base who wants this to be the focus of HOTS.

I'm not one of them, I like the variety in maps and the different strategies that come with them, I don't want to play a simplified five man brawler.

Blizzard should add some lessons in the game for new players.
Well, after actually playing in the new Garden Terror I have to say...

...it's exactly as bland and uninspired as we all thought. There's nothing unique about it anymore. It's just really a Cursed Hollow + Alterac Pass/Tomb of the Spider Queen.

I would like to read or listen an explanation from Blizzard on why this is better than old Garden Terror. It's just because old Garden Terror was too "complex"?
#NoMapsReworksLikeThis
09/14/2018 07:09 PMPosted by NicePants
I just wish that the developers would be active the forums to show where they understand players' frustrations in the game. Probably due to the fact that they've been busy, but I remember when the developers promised to be more active and they haven't been lately.

I don't expect activity within our discussions, but a thread; letting us know:
- These are the complaints/frustrations we've received (with proof),
- These are the changes we're proposing and we'll most likely apply.

They claim their changes warranted; yet the vast majority of posts in this open thread shows confusion. As players, it is our right to know the exact reasons to changes to the game; not simply "this is frustrating to players ¯\_(ツ)_/¯" without proof.
That's implying they use the PTR as little more than a smoking gun to point at the players for what is happening next.
That sometimes is the role of the PTR, which often seems like a "there's not enough time to fix it but it is enough time to figure out what needs to be kept an eye on" zone for numbers tweaking.

Going to echo many. The changes to garden of terror don't seem to fix any existing problems while also making the map less interesting.

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