To Alpha & Beta players

General Discussion
Back then their was only like around 15 to 20 heroes, leveling was tougher back then and they screwed up the scaling today because it doesn't add all the xp we spent leveling those characters. The level scales and time spent in game are completely inaccurate. Stitches was very vulnerable to mages at the time, they changed his bile graphics I think because as he walked around it would leave a puddle of bile area possibly graphically demanding to some, especially during his ult. I liked it wish they didnt get rid of it. Nova use to summon 2 clones was very powerful and still underplayed because she had no mobile escape kit, but with rewind you could have up to 5 novas ambush one person and it was hilarious. Aba was one my first character and you could use Ults during Ultimate evolution I never thought it was that Op not anymore than whats going on in the game today. Sylvanas's old ult was made into a basic talent and everyone pretty much complained how underwhelming it was. Paid like 4.99 for skins 20 bucks for a unicorn not too much but now everyone is getting those same skins for free in drops which sucks, you're definitely paying a little more for skins in these bundles today. Be nice if I got a percentage off new skins considering the money I put in for those old skins. Tyrande was more of a utility talent and healer, but with certain talents she actually healed pretty efficiently back then, her reworks is a little along the lines of what she use to be like.
Back then it was simpler and the match up weren't so vastly lop sided and preseason ranked was mostly mirror matches. Before 2.0 things were shaken up a bit because every 3 weeks a new hero would come out for the next several years holy crap and I am probably among a small few who enjoyed the break of heroes coming out every 3 weeks. As far as the maps I think Mines was the only one that was a snowball event everyone had an issue with you could push the golem in one event. Pre 2.0 had its issues but afterwards it got exponentially worse. Whats going on now is similar to what use to go then massive changes to characters who needed it or to characters that should never have been touched. If I could go back to beta days I'm not sure, it had its drawback but I wouldnt want to be here in the state of the game as it is now, this game use to do a great job of keeping balance as much as possible considering they kept adding so many characters so fast it was bound to catch up but the game never felt like it settled its been ever changing for years. So many characters whom we didnt want added and nobody wanted Overwatch characters here they arent established characters in Blizzard history but they had to tow the company line despite what any of us wanted. So the game is vastly different from what we expected it to look like by this time had they not made so many changes to make this game look like so many other games. I dont think the way the game looks now was the intended vision. I still enjoy playing to some degree and dread playing as well. And I look back on all thats changed and has adapted and feel frustrated by the lack of direction. Where this game use to be about quality its turned into a game about quantity, reminds me of Wow. How much can you throw at me, versus refining and tuning what already worked. This is a great game that somehow lost its identity.
09/15/2018 12:11 PMPosted by Geisard
I wonder if players were complaining of OP hero releases as they do today


KT Johanna and Leo were the first 3 complaints I remember, but each one was actually true, release KT had a build that would destroy teams with 1 Flame Strike.

Johanna was immortal and did damage.

Leo could just walk to your fort and destroy it by level 5 and get the keep down by level 9, there wasn't much you could do about it, it actually was a core race from level 1 with him.

People whining about OP heroes on release have no idea of how bad it was with those 3, then you add in Li Ming, OMG was She a nightmare, if she landed an orb on anyone after level 4 they were dead.
I got in in late alpha. I missed the 'aspect' talent builds and artifacts, but a number of talents were all still fairly generic and balance of those talents was shared across the game, so stuff like 'battle momentum' reduced the same amount per hit on all heroes that had it, so heroes with faster ias or multiple hits benefited more from the effect. Given that the cdr also applied to heroic cooldowns, some of the balance was really skewed in how this affected certain heroics and heroes. More so on combo-centric heroes that had rewind in their kit at lvl 13 + battle momentum at 7.

The game itself wasn't very keen on set 'role' quirks for some of the heroes, such as azmodan having healing ward, and a lot of power for heroes were either tied directly through talents, or indirectly through level progression as back then levels increased character stats by a set amount, so heroes were balanced around early/mid/late scaling on which got the better benefit from levels.

Similarly, a number of heroes had too many talents to influence the same ability to make a build work, so while there were a number of options on heroes (4-5 on some tiers) some of the effects were filler, redundant, or too dependent on previous talents to encourage much by way of functional diversity — this was especially more problematic with the talent-gating system where hero progression outside of games (hero/player level) would unlock options beyond just having 2 talents only.

Personally, I liked the potential of the 'gating system' as a means to stagger player options to experiment with builds and need to spend time learning different parts of a hero, however, the talent-gates themselves weren't combinations designed to compliment the picks and show build options, and just happened to be whatever was set on the hero in sequence first and second. However, the gating itself was seen as an hinderance as it often gated out the 'meta' must-have build for the heroes, esp since a number of heroes were simply one-trick wonders that had a hefty power difference in one build over all others.

In that regard, a number of hero 'roles' were a bit too flexible, and while some players like to look back and think fondly for some heroes, part of the issue then is basic functions of say support and tank were tied directly to talent power, so tyrande wasn't alone in having options to spec for dps/heal/resource/etc, but most heroes were like that too. In that regard, any 'main healer' at the time could forgo their mana/heal talents and be terrible at healing and essentially sabotage their team by having one team with the 'correct' builds that brought enough ehp and sustain to keep their team up, or just get stomped.

in some regard, some aspects of the game were less stomp/not stomp because a number of players were vying for beta keys (could eventually pay to get in) just to ride the hype of the latest blizz game, and weren't keen on actually knowing how to play. Gameplay has some room for experimentation as people just did whatever because the phases of the game were less... formal. Player didn't break down into specific lanes for objective/merc rotations to maintain soak, and the game was essentially a cheese-fest of whoever had the better idea of how particular hero combos were more broken than others.

For instance, backdoor protection didn't exist then, so global heroes or specialists could skirt around the lanes and put suicidal pressure on forts and the core, esp with abathur clones to suicide heroic spam. Other quirks involved support heroes having minion-buffing talents to cheese the lanes to form tower-ammo to be spent and make structures useless and bypass objectives that would be stalled out with cc effects such as spamming blinds and stuns on vehicles — to which in some cases, hero line-ups could make it a liability to get the objective because it was so countered by select heroes and talents.

The other quirk with the older game was the staging of how players were grouped. With earlier players, they played against the same groups in the set alot, which would in turn inflate their mmr and keep the group close knit, while later players would be in a smaller niche and be outside that loop and play with a wider set of hit and miss players who may not know much about the game, or have had the time to pick things up. Early renditions of ranked allowed groups so players could form teams and easily ride ranks over solo players, esp the set that were trying to get to ranked asap and not bother to learn other heroes.

It was a fairly chaotic mess that was prone for abuse. Some of the accessibility of silly quirks may be why some of the 3+ year accounts with thousands of levels can seem terrible in the game today as they simply didn't need to learn much about it and could get 'carried' to some degree by 1-2 players that knew a cheese strat to get trough the game regardless of composition or objective.
09/15/2018 11:38 AMPosted by Geisard
How was the game back then, and how do you compare to now?

Well, I was lower than Bronze tier in Alpha / Beta as this was my first MOBA and I had no clue what I was doing.

However, I do remember the mechanics back then, and I liked the slower but more strategic pace the game had.

Back then, the focus of development was on map strategy, outsmarting your opponent, not just grouping up as 5 and deathrolling. The game roster was slightly more generic, while still having the Rock, Paper, Scissors element to it, it wasn't taken to an extreme. Pretty much the entire roster of 20 heroes was viable out of the gate.

The focus has changed, it's shifted toward flashy heroes that do less meaningful things more often.

I would have liked to have seen a larger roster but with less of the niche-ification.

Sure, the game had some OP heroes on release like Li Ming, Jaina, and Kael'thas, but I felt like most of the roster was viable and the game was more focused on meta map play rather than flashy micro.
I used to play in beta, but then quit for a while and came back semi-recently (1 year ago?).
The only thing i remember was getting kills was much harder as damage values seemed pretty low.
09/15/2018 10:12 PMPosted by Werbs
People whining about OP heroes on release have no idea of how bad it was with those 3, then you add in Li Ming, OMG was She a nightmare, if she landed an orb on anyone after level 4 they were dead.

Thats funny they nerf Nova when release Li-Ming. I think old Nova could be great vs released Li-Ming but we never know about it.
Not especially a alpha/beta thing but I remeber the days where everyone could play whoever they wanted and how they wanted, where there was freedom and silenced players were still able to play HL.
Since the reporting system, suspensions and bans the atmosphere that spreaded into the game stinks.
Open beta player, the game was roughly the same.
Except mirror matches in QM which made pubstombers less annoying because you at least had one with you (and butcher/nova were more berable to face than tracer/genji , illidan and sonya were a coin toss if grouped with tass or abathur).
The game was punitive to people playing in small groups because having to face single digit ranked players as a 5 stack because you wanted to pvp with your level 26 friend was a bit much (at least you had to man up though).
Ah very important thing, TLV and Abathur's locusts were something.
Also baddies spamming reports each time they were losing or got their ego bruised already existed.
09/15/2018 11:43 AMPosted by Remus
Beta player here. Lvl 1760 right now. It was less toxic back then. I noticed a huge spike in toxicity with the 2.0 release. I guess it became very popular and with more players obviously higher chance of more toxic people.


Same as this minus the level.
09/15/2018 08:36 PMPosted by Reaper
Back then their was only like around 15 to 20 heroes


No, the fewest we ever had was 23, in April 2014.

By the way, the most important thing everybody seems to have missed (in the sense of forgetting, not longing, that is) is that up until mid-2016, the icons used for the Abilities and Talents were taken from older games - WC3, WoW, SC2 and Diablo 3. Also, Talents on the same tier affecting a particular Ability used the same icon! Artanis from November 2015 was the first Hero to use different tints (even though I could never tell between the different shades of teal). And later, over the course of 2016, Heroes finally got unique HotS icons, one by one.
Closed beta player.

There was a lot less heroes, talents were gated, there wasn't loot boxes, ranks were 50-1, HL didn't have any limits on groups, and bans didn't exist.

There was also a lot of generic talents; sprint, blood for blood, battle momentum, focused attack, executioner, stone skin, first aid, bolt of the storm, giant killer, gathering power, envenom, rewind, etc.

Illidan defined an entire meta at one point, Stitches was the strongest hero in the game, Arthas used to be really OP, Nova used to be able to 100-0 most squishies, Sgt hammer used to have both graduating range and hover siege as talents on two different talent tiers...

Also, less maps. Haunted mines, black hearts bay, garden of terror, dragon shire, cursed hallow, and not sure when sky temple came out but I don't think it was out when I first started playing.
09/16/2018 07:10 AMPosted by FoxBlade
blood for blood


Many heroes had it, including healers like rehgar, you could stack 5 blood for bloods, and back then they did 15% damage. You could all target 1 hero and initiate on them with 75% instant damage.

The B-f-B meta. fun times.
When Kaelthas was originally released he could cast a living bomb on a minion and spread the bomb to everything it hit, minions included. You couldn't stand near your minions when KT was near.
09/15/2018 12:11 PMPosted by Geisard
I wonder if players were complaining of OP hero releases as they do today


Absolutely, yes.

The theory of "They release OP heroes so everyone can buy them, and then they nerf them later" is as old as the game is.

I've been in the game since Jaina was the new hero, and believe me, this complaining is nothing new.
If you think a hero is overpowered you never saw Thrall when he came out and would solo 1v5 no problem
You ask that question because you want to cry because you don't find something to cry about...

So you have to cry about the past...

When there's change incoming... Or when there's nothing even announced you also travel in time to the future and start to make up stuff that could happen, in the timeline you live where everything is destruction like... they changed kerrigan or whatever to death will they change this hero to and kill it like they did with bla bla bla bla...

That for you is a thread.

And people actually talk about stupid !@#$ like that.

You can't be helped.
Better when now. A lot.
You ask that question because you want to cry because you don't find something to cry about...

So you have to cry about the past...

When there's change incoming... Or when there's nothing even announced you also travel in time to the future and start to make up stuff that could happen, in the timeline you live where everything is destruction like... they changed kerrigan or whatever to death will they change this hero to and kill it like they did with bla bla bla bla...

That for you is a thread.

And people actually talk about stupid !@#$ like that.

You can't be helped.


Do you always jump into conclusions without informing yourself first?

I asked because I'm curious. I'm a new player and wanted to know about the situation this game was in the beginning.
09/15/2018 11:38 AMPosted by Geisard
How was the game back then, and how do you compare to now?

Anything in particular that you remember of that time and stuck in your memory?


Playing from the first day of Alpha, I remember vividly how Abathur was the first hero that came out. I was immediately in love with him and back then he was so broken because when you cloned someone, you were getting the exact copy of that character's build AND you also could do that character's ulty. This was pretty sick. People that had knowledge of all the heroes could really win almost any game with Alpha Abathur. Long live Alpha Abba <3
nice times without hordes of idiots, my win rate was 63% then,now with newb flow and dumb changes im at 57% and dropping cuz of the worst matchmaker in history of games.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum