Kerrigan needs some Ravage range back.

General Discussion
I'm not going to pretend I'm an expert player with Kerrigan, but I feel like her range on Ravage was nerfed way too hard and the rest of her changes don't really compensate enough for it. Her ability to secure kills suffers for it which seems to run counter to her design as a dive gank assassin.

Aside from that, I don't really have any complaints about the rework. I like having charges on Ravage now and Crysalis is an interesting talent to mitigate some burstier heroes such as Li Ming and Chromie.

I just feel like she could benefit from a small increase on Ravage's range. I wouldn't really change anything else about her except for that.
no she doesnt, she is probably the only hero that is pretty balanced after a rework, maybe just 1 or 2 talents that could give some dmg burst in some situation, but its nothing so big
09/26/2018 07:21 PMPosted by Bitterman
no she doesnt, she is probably the only hero that is pretty balanced after a rework, maybe just 1 or 2 talents that could give some dmg burst in some situation, but its nothing so big


She has a lot of awful talents actually now. She's a one build hero after the rework, she was a 2 build hero before the rework. I do think a lot of the rework is pretty good but they really gave her some awful talents at most of her tiers.
Yeah the range decrease on Q does feels really bad. I would give up the extra charge in a heartbeat for the original 8 range or even 7...anything but 6. You basically have to be right next to the target to Q them now, it's kinda silly. Her ability to chase down in those 1v1 situations now is basically gone.
With all the talents she has for jumping a lot, giving her that range would be a mistake, she is already more tanky, makes good damage, and you can still have a good chasing with the current ravage, and also you have a great mobility if you use the talent to jump 1 time to every hero, giving her more range is not necesary at all, unless you are in the middle of nowwhere you can still jump to something on the way and then to the hero
09/27/2018 12:35 AMPosted by Sunfire
With all the talents she has for jumping a lot, giving her that range would be a mistake, she is already more tanky, makes good damage, and you can still have a good chasing with the current ravage, and also you have a great mobility if you use the talent to jump 1 time to every hero, giving her more range is not necesary at all, unless you are in the middle of nowwhere you can still jump to something on the way and then to the hero

That's not how this ability works though, let's say you take Boundless Fury at 7 you still need targets to jump to get the reset which only works on heroes not minions or walls. Same with Queen of Blades on the same tier, only works on heroes. You can't chase people down anymore like she use to be able to.

Bouncing between the enemy team back on forth seems fun, but it's not practical and provides very little value. For example, would you want to Q onto the Arthas then Q again to reach BW in the back? Not gonna happen lol.
I still dont know why they gave her 2 charges of Q, its just too much combined with the amount of shields and ice block(lol).

I think the last thing we should worry about is buffing her right now.
09/27/2018 12:43 AMPosted by LCD
09/27/2018 12:35 AMPosted by Sunfire
With all the talents she has for jumping a lot, giving her that range would be a mistake, she is already more tanky, makes good damage, and you can still have a good chasing with the current ravage, and also you have a great mobility if you use the talent to jump 1 time to every hero, giving her more range is not necesary at all, unless you are in the middle of nowwhere you can still jump to something on the way and then to the hero

That's not how this ability works though, let's say you take Boundless Fury at 7 you still need targets to jump to get the reset which only works on heroes not minions or walls. Same with Queen of Blades on the same tier, only works on heroes. You can't chase people down anymore like she use to be able to.

Bouncing between the enemy team back on forth seems fun, but it's not practical and provides very little value. For example, would you want to Q onto the Arthas then Q again to reach BW in the back? Not gonna happen lol.


You have 2 charges to do that, 6x2 or 8 you do the maths and tell me which one goes further, and about the arthas and bw part, if you can't reach instantly bw after jumping arthas,,then old Kerrigan couldnt do it either because 8 range is not longer than 12
09/27/2018 01:02 AMPosted by Sunfire
09/27/2018 12:43 AMPosted by LCD
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That's not how this ability works though, let's say you take Boundless Fury at 7 you still need targets to jump to get the reset which only works on heroes not minions or walls. Same with Queen of Blades on the same tier, only works on heroes. You can't chase people down anymore like she use to be able to.

Bouncing between the enemy team back on forth seems fun, but it's not practical and provides very little value. For example, would you want to Q onto the Arthas then Q again to reach BW in the back? Not gonna happen lol.


You have 2 charges to do that, 6x2 or 8 you do the maths and tell me which one goes further, and about the arthas and bw part, if you can't reach instantly bw after jumping arthas,,then old Kerrigan couldnt do it either because 8 range is not longer than 12


6x2 is only longer if there is actually something at 6 to jump to. If you are trying to chase someone and they are at 7 Range and moving the same speed, you are never gonna catch them.
09/27/2018 01:10 AMPosted by Flinx
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You have 2 charges to do that, 6x2 or 8 you do the maths and tell me which one goes further, and about the arthas and bw part, if you can't reach instantly bw after jumping arthas,,then old Kerrigan couldnt do it either because 8 range is not longer than 12


6x2 is only longer if there is actually something at 6 to jump to. If you are trying to chase someone and they are at 7 Range and moving the same speed, you are never gonna catch them.


Its more the upsides than the downsides, if thats the case yes, its worst, but if you are at 6 and you jump to a li ming or some mage you can jump again to ensure the kill and also if there is anything in the way, a wall, a camp or a minion, you can use it, its far more opresive than before, if they buff the range its going to be like the old Kerrigan but with more jumps, i can't see them doing it and i didnt have such problems while using her, i find her more strong at chasing than before the rework, diablo also had range reduction for the people that using from the shadows and no one is complaining now, its just a thing of getting used to it, i find her in an excellent spot and in no way she is in needs of buffs
they gave her 2 charges because her q is now almost melee range lol. so that new fancy talent where you could jump to all enemies is usless. anyway the other cdr talent is better
The new lvl7 talent (boundless fury) actually allows you to Q 3x at the same target (the first one is free and the other two are form your normal cooldown). I also thought it will be difficult to get used to the shorter range but somehow i like it. Shorter range but more Q's.
09/26/2018 11:58 PMPosted by LCD
Yeah the range decrease on Q does feels really bad. I would give up the extra charge in a heartbeat for the original 8 range or even 7...anything but 6. You basically have to be right next to the target to Q them now, it's kinda silly. Her ability to chase down in those 1v1 situations now is basically gone.
now you know how I felt after they nerfed Valeera's death from above's range ;_;
09/26/2018 11:58 PMPosted by LCD
Yeah the range decrease on Q does feels really bad. I would give up the extra charge in a heartbeat for the original 8 range or even 7...anything but 6. You basically have to be right next to the target to Q them now, it's kinda silly. Her ability to chase down in those 1v1 situations now is basically gone.

Well apparently the other people downvoting do not feel the same way.

You basically have to put yourself in immense immediate danger to be able to dive anything other than the tank. Her short range runs directly counter to her design.
i want to agree but after adjusting to the smaller range, I realize the tradeoff for 2 casts was worth it. with either bladed momentun or the level 7 that grants a free ravage cast per enemy hero (once every 10 seconds per hero), you can literally jump on a single person with ravage at least 3 times (not counting 1 or 2 basic attacks woven in between each cast). i've gotten strings of nearly 12 ravage jumps+ basic attacks in a row, leading to double kills, triple kills and even a team wipe last night thanks to the W damage ramp level 4 talent. if they increased range more than she might ACTUALLY be overtuned and that isn't something you'll ever really see me say (since I think HOTS has a problem with undertuning heroes and would rather they apply more buffs to heroes than nerfing great ones).

To put this into perspective, I've successfully chased people under their towers and gotten the kill, then escaped, due to the sacrifice of range for 2 casts of ravage baseline. the sheer amount of chase down is honestly pretty ridiculous, often leading to kills you wouldn't be able to get with one cast.
09/26/2018 11:54 PMPosted by dcgregorya
09/26/2018 07:21 PMPosted by Bitterman
no she doesnt, she is probably the only hero that is pretty balanced after a rework, maybe just 1 or 2 talents that could give some dmg burst in some situation, but its nothing so big


She has a lot of awful talents actually now. She's a one build hero after the rework, she was a 2 build hero before the rework. I do think a lot of the rework is pretty good but they really gave her some awful talents at most of her tiers.
did you smoked a big fat one before typin gthis !@#$?, tell me where did you saw the second build on old kerrigan, im waiting.
09/26/2018 06:59 PMPosted by Drothvader
I'm not going to pretend I'm an expert player with Kerrigan, but I feel like her range on Ravage was nerfed way too hard and the rest of her changes don't really compensate enough for it. Her ability to secure kills suffers for it which seems to run counter to her design as a dive gank assassin.

Aside from that, I don't really have any complaints about the rework. I like having charges on Ravage now and Crysalis is an interesting talent to mitigate some burstier heroes such as Li Ming and Chromie.

I just feel like she could benefit from a small increase on Ravage's range. I wouldn't really change anything else about her except for that.


As a Kerrigan mainer i can to say what for me Q's range is no matter because i am use W+E first and only after that Q for finish a target not for initiation.
As someone who's been playing nothing but Kerrigan since the rework I'm actually really happy with the changes. The new QWEQ combo is hilarious especially if you get the right talents, and while the reduced range was a little odd for me I used to play Varian so the transition wasn't as painful for me as it seems to be for other Kerrigan mains. Also, I !@#$ing love the tank build I've been doing (though I will be sad once people figure out how to deal with it). Although, can someone please explain to me what's so bad about chrysalis? Every time I pick it up I always regret it because I just get focused and it breaks in seconds.
09/27/2018 10:15 AMPosted by Drothvader
09/26/2018 11:58 PMPosted by LCD
Yeah the range decrease on Q does feels really bad. I would give up the extra charge in a heartbeat for the original 8 range or even 7...anything but 6. You basically have to be right next to the target to Q them now, it's kinda silly. Her ability to chase down in those 1v1 situations now is basically gone.

Well apparently the other people downvoting do not feel the same way.

You basically have to put yourself in immense immediate danger to be able to dive anything other than the tank. Her short range runs directly counter to her design.


The thing is that i can't understand this lógic because before you just had one jump, now you have 2, you use the first to aproach and the second to the target you want, the outcome is the same, but you also gain a little bit of shield and that only if you couldnt reach it before, if you could then you have another ravage to keep chasing if someone like yrel knocks you back so, i don't understand the "before i have one charge of 8 range and now i have 2 with 6, but sometimes i have to jump on the tank and then on the supports/mage" the outcome in the last case is the same as before, you reach your target, and if this is how you need to play there is a talent to jump one extra time each hero so, i can't get why would you need extra range like before with 2 charges
No, because they basically made kerrigan an off-tank. Kind of like how xul is used as one.

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