No new stealth heroes?

General Discussion
It's about time they brought Sombra to the roster.

All of her kit and gameplay would fit perfectly into HotS.

I seriously don't get why they didn't try that yet.
How about specialists? There hasn't been a new one of those in forever.
I think the problem emerges when a team can be entirely stealth heroes because then if you don't have quick AoEs or skillshots to knock someone out of stealth on the opposite team it could result in a gank squad with little recourse for the opposing team. You also can't get up to 4 stealth heroes because you run into a similar problem with 4 stealth heroes on the same team + Abathur. Stealth heroes are by necessity burst damage heroes so being able to make a whole team or whole team + abathur out of them would be the least fun match to play against.

The most I think we are going to see are heroes like BW, Tyrande, or Samuro that have temporary stealth
They're not gonna make any new stealth heroes because:

1) Stealth has been deemed "unfun" by bads

2) Blizzard wants to homogenize the game

a) Because they can't balance to save their lives

b) So that balancing is easier
The only stealth hero I'd be up for Is either Tosh or Akama.
I mean we got stealth covered by now right?

We have the stealth disruptor, stealthed AAer, stealth camp stealers, stealth mage, stealth diver, stealth supports too (although that could be more solidified granted).

What else is there?
09/29/2018 04:07 PMPosted by breadisfunny
sombra's kind of cute.


Boop!
09/29/2018 07:41 PMPosted by Melphegot
It's about time they brought Sombra to the roster.

All of her kit and gameplay would fit perfectly into HotS.

I seriously don't get why they didn't try that yet.


Because players tilt over stealth heroes having cc, which is exactly what Sombra's kit is. Lots of mobility, cc and stealth on top of it. I can hear the forum QQ demanding for her to be removed already. I'd love to see her in this game because I feel like I would love playing as her, but most players would absolutely hate it if she was added. Blizzard would have a hard time bringing her kit as it is on Overwatch into Hots in a way that would be balanced. As prior releases have shown, they try to stick to the original kits of the heroes they bring from Overwatch. This has caused a ton of issues already in terms of mobility powercreep.

If Sombra's kit was copy pasted from Overwatch she would most certainly have an overloaded kit. Her base kit Translocator would basically be one of Gul'dan's level 20 talents (Demonic Circle). That ability could also be combo'd with her EMP ult to basically give her Malfurion's level 20 (Astral Communion) talent except she could do it at level 10. I feel like she would likely have the ability to shoot while moving which is something players have hated about Tracer since she was added. She just seems like a balancing nightmare. I wouldn't want to be on the team of devs in charge of making her fit into HotS.
She would not need to shoot while moving, Hanzo, Genji and Zarya do not (but they do in OW).

Also her attack damage would be for balance reasons similar tracers but maybe half the fire rate but will be able to fire 50% longer before reloading (or no reloading at all).

-Translocation would expire after a sent amount of time unlike what is already in the game, thus limiting its range.

-Her heroic does not need to be an AOE silence, It could been a AOE damage reduction and maybe talented at level 20 for a short silence.

Her basic abilities might be:
> Hack - a channeled short duration single target silence.
> Translocation - throw a teleport device that expires if not used or has limited range of operation (reactivate to teleport tot hat location and it is visible to the enemy.
> Cloak - Limited stealth that also grant additional movement speed (similar to other stealth heroes)
> Trait: Ability to see opponents heroic abilities cooldown/availability or the ability to reveal low health heroes (activate to reload IF she used ammo like tracer).

This is a different enough hero to bring into the game and she would not "replace" anyone else. But I do not just want Sombra, I want just more stealth heroes in general.
Gabriel Tosh from Starcraft 2 is a MUST stealth hero... the clan lord of the Specters MUST COME FORTH AND PURGE THE WEAK!
Stealth as a mechanic is one of the worst things to try and balance. Whether it's HotS cloak or true invisibility, stealth characters always have to be weaker than normal characters when they're revealed. This often leads to the scenario of "if you can see them, they're worthless; if you can't you're dead". They almost universally have to rely on killing you instantly from stealth, or they're useless. This is also why no one likes playing against (strong) sheath heroes, because it's not fun being instantly killed by something you couldn't see- with no option to react.

I'm not saying I fully hate stealth- I'd still like Tosh to be added to the game- but I'm pointing out how complicated a mechanic it is.
Yeah, cause we really need more lolstealth in games. Ugh, i hate that invisibility crap.
stelth (hideing Chiken playstyle) should be compleatly removed from all moba games!:p
09/30/2018 07:17 AMPosted by Keigami
Stealth as a mechanic is one of the worst things to try and balance. Whether it's HotS cloak or true invisibility, stealth characters always have to be weaker than normal characters when they're revealed. This often leads to the scenario of "if you can see them, they're worthless; if you can't you're dead". They almost universally have to rely on killing you instantly from stealth, or they're useless. This is also why no one likes playing against (strong) sheath heroes, because it's not fun being instantly killed by something you couldn't see- with no option to react.

I'm not saying I fully hate stealth- I'd still like Tosh to be added to the game- but I'm pointing out how complicated a mechanic it is.


True in a way.. That is really only the nature of high burst damage stealth heroes, someone with sustain damage with some CC would not up hold to that style of game play that you described (which seems like the core of Valeera). Stealth heroes such as Sombra would not play into that "see them or I am death logic". Even out of stealth her talents would be useful.

Also with the stealth rework everyone can see them, it really only keep them off the mini map (better for rotations) and prevents you from targeting them with low skill point-click abilities and auto attacks. I mean people already get ganked all day because they stand around bushes and mostly do not pay attention to the mini map in the first place, I feel like blaming stealth post rework is just a poor excuse for the low skilled/ bad players that honestly always have a "problem" with something (mostly anything unique or different)

If it was up the the low skilled and "bad" players HOTS would just be filled with "vanilla" characters/abilities, nothing unique, challenging or experimental, just bland heroes with similar kits but different visuals. Might as well add a alarm to alert players when an enemy is near by or approaching. And the meta would always be head on clashes with basic compositions and everything will be predictable but the only ones playing are so bland and "sheltered" that they are often caught off guard by the same events that occur every game.

Need more exotic and unique builds for future heroes, Some might work better than others but each character would have his/her own fans and suit other peoples preferences. Why disregard people that enjoy the current "butchered" aspects of stealth that we currently have by limiting them to heroes that all has been made BEFORE the stealth rework (based off the old stealth). Bliz should take the chance to come up with completely new heroes/kits that take advantage of the new stealth, meta and so on.
09/29/2018 07:58 PMPosted by Scymon
How about specialists? There hasn't been a new one of those in forever.


damn I forgot about Akama on my list.
09/30/2018 08:36 AMPosted by FrostyPyro
09/29/2018 07:58 PMPosted by Scymon
How about specialists? There hasn't been a new one of those in forever.


damn I forgot about Akama on my list.

how about a new multiclass. i really dont understand why there are manny assassins, spec, support and varrior.
but only one god damn multicall wtf blizz
Multiclass*
The new stealth is a joke as even blind people can spot that. Instead of introducing a new stealth hero, they should just remove stealth from the game and rework Zertaul, Nova, and other stealth heroes to a real hero.
The new stealth is a joke as even blind people can spot that. Instead of introducing a new stealth hero, they should just remove stealth from the game and rework Zertaul, Nova, and other stealth heroes to a real hero.

How I wish that were true. I’ve played with so many people who can’t follow a stealth hero down a lane with a chain of pings.
Bliz stated that they will be removing the specialist role and adjusting its heroes to go into other roles (mostly assassins/mages).

They are also doing away with multi class (Varian).

I wonder what will happen to Vikings and Varian whenever we get that big class rework, Might be the start of HOTS 3.0 or something.

In addition to Stealth heroes I would Honestly like a true summoner, a hero with abilities and talents that all revolve around protecting themselves and enabling, summoning, and supporting their summons. I guess it would be kind of a mash up between Az, Rax, and Zag but with the focus being on the summons of course.

More unique heroes like Rag and Aba are welcome as well!!
09/30/2018 11:28 AMPosted by Uziel
The new stealth is a joke as even blind people can spot that. Instead of introducing a new stealth hero, they should just remove stealth from the game and rework Zertaul, Nova, and other stealth heroes to a real hero.

How I wish that were true. I’ve played with so many people who can’t follow a stealth hero down a lane with a chain of pings.
And they're definitely the same idiots who were complaining about stealth in the first place. The stealth rework may as well have made stealth heroes wear a giant flashing neon sign that says "I am here, please reveal and kill me." Anyone paying any attention to their surroundings can see it clear as day, but the same people who couldn't see stealth before are still too busy inspecting their shoelaces to look up and see said sign now.

The stealth rework didn't solve the problems it was supposed to, and instead made more problems the devs still haven't solved. This is now the standard development process at Blizzard right now.

If it's broken, break something else and fix that. Or don't and just leave that broken too.

If it isn't broken, break it and then fix it halfway. Or don't and just leave it completely broken.

Since Browder left, the current HotS team has broken easily 3 or 4 times as many things as they've fixed. Of the things that they have fixed, a good 90% of those were things they broke. These devs have no idea what they're doing, and I think stealth is one of the few places they're willing to admit it, if only indirectly by refusing to add any more.

For me, I'd love to see Tosh and Vorazun in HotS, but not if the devs are going to shove the new stealth down our throats with them. I say keep them out until someone with more than 3 neurons takes over from Dabiri.

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