Mephisto needs a buff

General Discussion
Lightning nova, skull missle
Change consume souls lvl 20

Discuss
You didn't provide why. How can we discuss when you leave nothing for discussion?
One would assume that something which needs buffed is a direct result of its under-performance.
Obvious troll.
09/26/2018 11:56 AMPosted by Dozer
One would assume that something which needs buffed is a direct result of its under-performance.

Ok, we’ve got a start.
What talents and/or what aspect is weak to you and how would you buff it?

Saying ‘Him bad, fix’ is not a way to start a discussion. You need to put at least some effort into it.
09/26/2018 12:00 PMPosted by Vanaheim
Obvious troll.


You sir couldn't be more wrong. This is a serious post. His winrate is at 45%. Down 10% after nerfs.
09/26/2018 12:04 PMPosted by Dagordae
09/26/2018 11:56 AMPosted by Dozer
One would assume that something which needs buffed is a direct result of its under-performance.

Ok, we’ve got a start.
What talents and/or what aspect is weak to you and how would you buff it?

Saying ‘Him bad, fix’ is not a way to start a discussion. You need to put at least some effort into it.


I didnt start the discussion that way, i listed his two main damage dealing abilities that needed buffed and his lvl 20 consume souls talent looked at to compensate.
Ok lets talk about Skull Missle. Let's compare this ability to Guldan's Fel Flame.

They both have similar level 1 quest talents to buff their Q. They both have a completion requirement of hitting 40 heroes. Both abilities deal similar damage. However in Mephisto's case, skull missle has an 8 second cooldown until question completion in which it becomes a 5 sec cd.

Just for the sake of argument, lets imagine that the enemy team grouped up as 5, you landed every single skull missle on the entire team. It would take 1 minute to complete this quest. Now let's imagine you are gul'dan in the same situation. It would take only 10 seconds to complete the similar quest.
09/26/2018 12:15 PMPosted by Dozer
Ok lets talk about Skull Missle. Let's compare this ability to Guldan's Fel Flame.

They both have similar level 1 quest talents to buff their Q. They both have a completion requirement of hitting 40 heroes. Both abilities deal similar damage. However in Mephisto's case, skull missle has an 8 second cooldown until question completion in which it becomes a 5 sec cd.

Just for the sake of argument, lets imagine that the enemy team grouped up as 5, you landed every single skull missle on the entire team. It would take 1 minute to complete this quest. Now let's imagine you are gul'dan in the same situation. It would take only 10 seconds to complete the similar quest.


I think you are forgetting to account for his trait here. Hitting 5 ppl with missile would leave him with a .5 sec cool down, much faster than Gul'dan.
Okay I played Meph to 16 and here's as good as any place to post my thoughts:

The main issue with Mephisto is Consume Souls, especially with 20 talent upgrade. This has made him a one-trick pony who's entire existence revolves around the power of his heroic ability and giving him the illusion of strength when his kit feels very slow most of the game.

Q: Skull missile feels horrible to use. It's unresponsive compared to a skill like, Cassia's lightening spear for example. It requires set-up (or foresight, when you know your enemy is inattentive) and the pay-off is mediocre. Only use for it is to proc trait cdr and to do something while waiting for W + E combo.

W: His bread and butter. It feels powerful and rewarding in teamfights, but one-on-one it's lackluster.

E: Extremely obvious counter-play unless casted from bush or across wall. Only plays to set-up W.

Durance of Hate isn't worth discussing.
I feel the problem to Mephisto's kit is that it lacks fluidity. The moments where I felt gameplay was fun and rewarding was when I landed significant amounts of Q's and could teleport around teamfights while casting W. The solution I propose is rework of Consume Souls 20 talent and some other changes, but a change to the Q missile speed to speed up his gameplay overall. I don't necessarily feel like he needs more damage, just a more fluid Q missile.

TL;DR
Remove Q delay to land easier to proc CDR (maybe even reduce it's own cdr), adjust damage numbers, nerf Consume Souls. He's dependent on positioning (E) for his bread and butter (W) so with increased cdr proc from landing Q will augment this playstyle. Take power from his heroic and put it into kit.
09/26/2018 12:06 PMPosted by Dozer
09/26/2018 12:04 PMPosted by Dagordae
...
Ok, we’ve got a start.
What talents and/or what aspect is weak to you and how would you buff it?

Saying ‘Him bad, fix’ is not a way to start a discussion. You need to put at least some effort into it.


I didnt start the discussion that way, i listed his two main damage dealing abilities that needed buffed and his lvl 20 consume souls talent looked at to compensate.

You totally tried to start the discussion that way.

09/26/2018 11:40 AMPosted by Dozer
Lightning nova, skull missle
Change consume souls lvl 20

Discuss

You simply listed his skills and said discuss.
Not what was wrong with them, not if they were weak or too strong, nothing about how they are used/countered talented.
You gave the same amount of information as saying ‘He bad, fix’.

But hey, you actually elaborated eventually. But you did ignore his trait, which is kind of important. In that his cooldowns are much shorter than shown unless you are the worst player.
——————-
Anyway:
The issue I have with Skull Missle is it’s payoff simply doesn’t match it’s needed skill.
To compare to another delayed skillshot, Chromie’s sand blast, it’s just weak. The penetration advantage really doesn’t help much because even if they clump up and you get to maximum spam it simply takes forever to do appreciable damage. It simply needs something more: a nondamage effect, more damage, faster, something to be good.

Nova has a different issue, it’s easy to counter. In a massive chaotic teamfight you can get people to stand in it but outside of that, or against good players, all hitting Nova means is that the enemy team is going to walk away or dogpile you.
And, awkwardly enough, it doesn’t synergise at all with Skull. They need opposite enemy positioning(parallel or perpendicular) to be effective and neither one is all that great alone.
To fix: Give the internal ring some damage. Make it a fraction of the outer ring, or only the outer ring ramps up, or talents only effect the outer ring.

As to the ults: Durance is a joke. It’s just kind of mildly annoying, a crappier version of Kelly’s ice ball with not real follow up. It needs a big change. The reward vs effect just isn’t there.

Consume souls, on the other hand, is a decently powerful ult that changes how the match is played. The 20 is a bit powerful when used right.
But to fix him it would likely get nerfed. Probably just a numbers change, but to fix the whole ‘Freshly spawned Mephisto gibs your team’ issue they could change it from a global nuke to a freakin ginormous AoE. Not enough to get rid of the whole ‘Run all you want but Mephisto’s gunna getcha’ angle but enough that he has to at least be in their zip code to hit them with the slim chance of them being able to escape if he’s far enough away.
Mephisto has only one problem: his ult. It needs to be nerfed to affect ONLY visible heroes. Period.
09/26/2018 03:55 PMPosted by Calskia
Mephisto has only one problem: his ult. It needs to be nerfed to affect ONLY visible heroes. Period.


agreed. This sounds like a solid nerf to me.

I love mephisto. He's fun to play, but imo they over nerfed him. His winrate droped by almost 10%. I really hope this gets addressed soon.
Mephisto's issues start and end with Consume Souls. That ult is so powerful and gamechanging that everything ends up being secondary. It needs nerfs so it's not such a dominant part of his kit that it kind of defines him after level 10.

This is the solution I think would be best:
09/26/2018 03:55 PMPosted by Calskia
Mephisto has only one problem: his ult. It needs to be nerfed to affect ONLY visible heroes. Period.
This would solve the most frustrating issues with Consume Souls without needing to put a ton of effort into balancing it's numbers.

From there, revert the nerfs to Lightning Nova and one of its talents. Keep either the Static Field or Static Barrier nerf, but absolutely revert the damage nerfs to the ability itself and the nerf to Lightning Reaction.

Tone down the armor talent at level 7. 20 armor for 5 seconds total on an assassin like this is a bit too much. I'd recommend reducing it to 10 or 15 armor or reducing the duration to 3.5-4 seconds total.

Buff Skull Missile a little bit. Not much, just a little. This is a hard skillshot to land, so it needs to be more rewarding. Maybe increase CDR from hitting heroes with it and/or increase its damage a bit.
imo his skull missile is trash (for the cast time, delay, damage done) even when talented... Honestly dont feel like i can push past level 14 and a half with him.

They should remove the delay and increase its travel speed or greatly increase its damage and maybe allow it to have some kinda of base line quest talent. Honestly It would take a lot for me to invest talents into his Q and his other heroic needs to be buffed to compete with consume souls because other heroes have better basic cc abilities than that heroic.
Sadly I think he is a weak character. I don't like his design either. Why did they give hima bone mustache? He did not look like this in Diablo 2. Or diablo 3 artwork.

he needs a lot of buffs imo. Only redeeming quality is his ult that keeps him from being utter garbage hero.
I knew they would overdo the nerfs, they never learn.
Mephisto needs a rework.
Durance is a good ult against a grouping team, if they have 3 melees, 1 tank 1 bruiser at least, you can melt them with your nova/skull spams over and over and its also a good enabler for other characters AoE
It still baffles me why they thought a global burst heroic was such a good idea in the first place.That ability alone is toxic to the game and needs a drastic nerf.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum