Duo queue now must be within 500 points of each other

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So competitive season two is going to have a maximum difference of 500 points to duo queue with a friend (skill will be rated 0 - 5000 in season 2). I really hope this allows me to continue to play with friends. I currently am a 43 and play with a 52 all the time (my son in fact), and am guessing this will fall outside the 500 skill point difference.

I'm hoping this is not going to be the case, but I don't have a good sense of how 500 points translates to current skill rank.
Where was the 0-5000 announced?
08/15/2016 10:37 AMPosted by Roy
Where was the 0-5000 announced?


It was a developer video just posted on youtube I believe. Seagull played it on his stream. I will try to find link.

Edit: Ok, here it is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nqh8tnHhIjg
500 out of 5000 comes out to 10 out of 100. So in your case you would be right at the cut off as there is an 11 rank difference. One of you would need to gain/loose a level in order to play together. Now while this might sound bad for your rank 52 is the top 45% and 43 is top 90%. This puts 45% of the player base between you and your friends skill.

There are worse situations than this. Last night I (55) was grouped with a 5 man of 52-55-32-38-64.

EDIT: Here is the developer link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nqh8tnHhIjg
Thanks I just saw another post on it :D sounds healthier for the community already
08/15/2016 10:42 AMPosted by Gamof
500 out of 5000 comes out to 10 out of 100. So in your case you would be right at the cut off as there is an 11 rank difference. One of you would need to gain/loose a level in order to play together. Now while this might sound bad for your rank 52 is the top 45% and 43 is top 90%. This puts 45% of the player base between you and your friends skill.

There are worse situations than this. Last night I (55) was grouped with a 5 man of 52-55-32-38-64.

EDIT: Here is the developer link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nqh8tnHhIjg


Thanks for the extra information about skill ranking to percentile translations. I knew he was better than me, but he is waaay better than me.
08/15/2016 10:46 AMPosted by SamuraiDog
08/15/2016 10:42 AMPosted by Gamof
500 out of 5000 comes out to 10 out of 100. So in your case you would be right at the cut off as there is an 11 rank difference. One of you would need to gain/loose a level in order to play together. Now while this might sound bad for your rank 52 is the top 45% and 43 is top 90%. This puts 45% of the player base between you and your friends skill.

There are worse situations than this. Last night I (55) was grouped with a 5 man of 52-55-32-38-64.

EDIT: Here is the developer link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nqh8tnHhIjg


Thanks for the extra information about skill ranking to percentile translations. I knew he was better than me, but he is waaay better than me.


I think you numbered it backwards. Looking it up it has you at a 52. I also was off a little, not on the % but 52-43 is only 9 so you guys are able to play with eachother (I did 53-42 in my head). If you take a look at your overbuff it has you in the 55% percentile.

https://www.overbuff.com/players/pc/SamuraiDog-1696
They are still unsure about how aggressive they should place the cap. 500 is being tested on the PTR. The end number that comes live will depend upon player feedback from the PTR.

I personally think a skill rating cap between 10 to 15 (current metric) should be fine. It's hard to define with the current metric, because skill rating correlates non-linear with player skill.
Based on what has been announced +/- 500 in 5000 rating I am very concerned. I am rank 70 and play with a friend rank 45 and to me the biggest problem is that the system does not take into effect current SR and game SR. If a 70 loses an average rated 60SR you should lose a lot of points and a 45 should win a lot of points for a 60SR game but it is not how the game works.

I realise it is to prevent these people who are abusing it (I saw a 6man where they had 3x lvl 77-78 and 3x lvl 34) who were obviously abusing the system to try and get top 500 but I don't like this new solution.
08/15/2016 10:58 AMPosted by Mattreh
Based on what has been announced +/- 500 in 5000 rating I am very concerned. I am rank 70 and play with a friend rank 45 and to me the biggest problem is that the system does not take into effect current SR and game SR. If a 70 loses an average rated 60SR you should lose a lot of points and a 45 should win a lot of points for a 60SR game but it is not how the game works.

I realise it is to prevent these people who are abusing it (I saw a 6man where they had 3x lvl 77-78 and 3x lvl 34) who were obviously abusing the system to try and get top 500 but I don't like this new solution.


You do note that you grouping with a 45 as a 70 is in a sense abusing it also? You are considered in the top 3% of OW players where as your friend is the bottom 40%? It pulls your average down to 57.5. That brings you, one of the top 3% of the games players down to the same games as myself, in the top 35% range. It is frustrating not only to your teammates but your enemies having to deal with that. Your enemies have to deal with you, who is someone outside their current skill range to deal with. And your teammates have to deal with your friend, who feels like dead weight in the game because he is not at their skill level.
500 points is a full tier of skill rating, which is roughly 15% of the total player pool in ranked. That is extremely generous on Blizzard's end. If you are more than 500 points apart, play Quickplay if you need to teach your friends to be better at the game, not tank other people's ratings who are trying to take Competitive seriously.

If you're queueing with people who are more than 8~ ranks difference currently, you're the reason why Competitive is epic garbage at the moment. A rank 70 is top 1% of the playerbase; a rank 40 is bottom 20% of the playerbase. You are destroying any semblance of balance in the system. The only way that would be fair to allow is if you lose a game with your friend, the 40 should lose 25%-50% a level and the 70 should lose 1-2 full levels. After the 70 loses 5 games in a row, he should wakeup and realize what he volunteered for.
08/15/2016 10:58 AMPosted by Mattreh
Based on what has been announced +/- 500 in 5000 rating I am very concerned. I am rank 70 and play with a friend rank 45


Quick-play together, that way you aren't screwing with the matchmaking of 10 other players.
I agree its not ideal - that is why I WANT it to de-rank me a lot when we lose but right now we win about 50/50 of our games and neither of us goes up or down in ranks. It's frustrating for us too!!
08/15/2016 11:21 AMPosted by Mattreh
I agree its not ideal - that is why I WANT it to de-rank me a lot when we lose but right now we win about 50/50 of our games and neither of us goes up or down in ranks. It's frustrating for us too!!


If you WANT it to de-rank you, then it sounds like you don't care about competitive play.

I say again - go quick-play.
08/15/2016 10:34 AMPosted by SamuraiDog
So competitive season two is going to have a maximum difference of 500 points to duo queue with a friend (skill will be rated 0 - 5000 in season 2). I really hope this allows me to continue to play with friends. I currently am a 43 and play with a 52 all the time (my son in fact), and am guessing this will fall outside the 500 skill point difference.

I'm hoping this is not going to be the case, but I don't have a good sense of how 500 points translates to current skill rank.


We'll see how everyone feels about the numbers we picked once everyone has placed on the PTR (it will be up soon -- this week). If we were too restrictive, we can loosen up a little. There are costs and benefits to both directions so this is a tricky number to get right. Too loose and we get the boosting/matchmaking issues we have now. Too tight and people cannot play with their friends...

We'll keep a close eye on our tuning here.
08/15/2016 11:33 AMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
08/15/2016 10:34 AMPosted by SamuraiDog
So competitive season two is going to have a maximum difference of 500 points to duo queue with a friend (skill will be rated 0 - 5000 in season 2). I really hope this allows me to continue to play with friends. I currently am a 43 and play with a 52 all the time (my son in fact), and am guessing this will fall outside the 500 skill point difference.

I'm hoping this is not going to be the case, but I don't have a good sense of how 500 points translates to current skill rank.


We'll see how everyone feels about the numbers we picked once everyone has placed on the PTR (it will be up soon -- this week). If we were too restrictive, we can loosen up a little. There are costs and benefits to both directions so this is a tricky number to get right. Too loose and we get the boosting/matchmaking issues we have now. Too tight and people cannot play with their friends...

We'll keep a close eye on our tuning here.


Thank you for the response! I do understand the need to keep abuse from happening and the fact that a top 5% player can really dominate a match against people even in the top 30th percentile. But it does feel like that at a 52-43 pairing, we were not overly out-of-our-league in either direction (me being overly bad, or him being overly dominant), which is why I hope the new system allows us to continue to play together.
Thanks Jeff - Can you explain why it is not preferred to give SR based on the match you won/lost? If I am 70 and friend is 45 (lets say group average of 58). If we on average go 50/50 shouldn't both of us migrate towards a 58 rating? If this happened, then you wouldn't need restrictive level caps as a 77 going for top 500 would not que with a rank 34 and risk a 3-4 rank drop.
08/15/2016 10:34 AMPosted by SamuraiDog
So competitive season two is going to have a maximum difference of 500 points to duo queue with a friend (skill will be rated 0 - 5000 in season 2). I really hope this allows me to continue to play with friends. I currently am a 43 and play with a 52 all the time (my son in fact), and am guessing this will fall outside the 500 skill point difference.

I'm hoping this is not going to be the case, but I don't have a good sense of how 500 points translates to current skill rank.
Hopefully you two can help other get better and become closer in rating. I think that's how it's supposed to work.
08/15/2016 11:37 AMPosted by Mattreh
Thanks Jeff - Can you explain why it is not preferred to give SR based on the match you won/lost? If I am 70 and friend is 45 (lets say group average of 58). If we on average go 50/50 shouldn't both of us migrate towards a 58 rating? If this happened, then you wouldn't need restrictive level caps as a 77 going for top 500 would not que with a rank 34 and risk a 3-4 rank drop.


The system is looking at both of your individual performances in that match compared to the performance expected on whatever heroes you were playing. Even though you are both grouped and both won, it doesn't necessarily mean you are the same skill. It's quite possible for one of you to carry the other and the system is actually pretty good about surfacing this.
08/15/2016 11:42 AMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
08/15/2016 11:37 AMPosted by Mattreh
Thanks Jeff - Can you explain why it is not preferred to give SR based on the match you won/lost? If I am 70 and friend is 45 (lets say group average of 58). If we on average go 50/50 shouldn't both of us migrate towards a 58 rating? If this happened, then you wouldn't need restrictive level caps as a 77 going for top 500 would not que with a rank 34 and risk a 3-4 rank drop.


The system is looking at both of your individual performances in that match compared to the performance expected on whatever heroes you were playing. Even though you are both grouped and both won, it doesn't necessarily mean you are the same skill. It's quite possible for one of you to carry the other and the system is actually pretty good about surfacing this.


Sorry I misread your comment.

We also don't want to penalize you completely for grouping with friends. You shouldn't always suffer for grouping with someone lower than you. We don't want to fully discourage that either. We're looking for a middle ground solution here. Basically with the goal of: I can group with friends so long as we are roughly the same skill level. If we're not, we should play Quick Play together.

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