D.Va damage taken: Live vs. PTR

General Discussion
As posted here: https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/5mbr8c/dva_damage_taken_live_vs_ptr/

D.Va on PTR now has 200 armor and 400HP, as opposed to 400 Armor and 200HP on live. Here are some stats for how much damage she takes from some characters on both live and PTR. All damage is done whiten range to avoid any falloff, and all new instances of damage were done at full HP, so armor had to be cut through first.

We were unaware that having just 1 piece of armor negated a lot of damage, so you will notice that a lot of the high damage per one shot characters like snipers will have similar damage to live on PTR, as opposed to the more high DPS oriented characters like Soldier or Tracer. We thought about doing an extra test by shooting her unarmored for all characters, since that is what her majority of damage taken will be now, but we didn't have time to try that. We did do it few a few characters on PTR, so ill toss in those values we well. You will notice that the damage she receives with no armor is increased significantly.

All damage values are formatted as LIVE / PTR

Rein
Charge: 295 / same as live
5 Swings: 350 / 360

Roadhog
Point blank crit: 325 / 370
Point blank non crit: 112 / same as live

Zarya
Full clip 0 energy: 341 / 395

Soldier
10 bullets crit: 350 / 370
10 bullets non crit: 150 / same as live
Full clip crit: de-suit. 6 bullet left / de-suit. 9 bullets left
Full clip non crit: 375 / 430

McCree
1 shot crit: 135 / same as live
3 shot crit: 405 / 410
5 shot crit: both de-suit
1 shot non crit: 64
3 shot non crit: 195
6 shot non crit: 390
Fan 240 / 245.
We did an extra fan with her armor at 0 and it did 270.

Reaper
3 shell crit: 544 / de-suit
The non crit data got mess up too. We did 3 shots on live which did 210, but we did 4 on PTR which did 357. We did an extra shell when D.Va has 0 armor on PTR and it did 231. Again, huge increase in damage once the armor is stripped.

Genji
3 fan crit: 464 / 484
The non crit data was recorded incorrectly, but on PTR it does 207, which breaks her armor. 3 extra from there, with no armor, does 252.

Tracer
Full clip crit: 280 / 308
Full clip non crit: 120 / same as live
With PTR D.Va at 388HP, so no armor, a full Tracer clip to her critbox de-suits her with a couple bullets to spare. As you can see again, the lack of armor increases her damage intake significantly.

Sombra
40 shot crit: 330 / 385
40 shot non crit: 120 / same as live
Pharah
3 direct: 345 / 350

Hanzo
2 full charge arrow crit: 490 / 495
2 full charge arrow non crit: 240 / same as live

Widow
Full charge sniper crit: 295 / same as live
Full charge sniper non crit: 115 / same as live
15 SMG crit: 315 / 340
15 SMG non crit: 120 / same as live

Bastion
22 turret crit: 580 / de-suit
22 turret non crit: 220 / 230
10 scout crit: 350
10 scout non crit: 150
We forgot to do the scout on PTR. This was a rather important test for the crit but we did not want to go back and re-do it.

Mei
3 crit: 435 / 440
3 non crit: 210 / same as live

Torb
4 shots crit: 545 / de-suit
4 shots back: 260 / same as live
2 shotgun blasts crit: 445 / 540
3 shotgun blasts back: 300 / 350

Junk
3 direct: 345 / same as live

Zen
Full charge shot crit: 435 / 445
Full charge shot non crit: 205 / same as live
Charge shot crit w/discord: 578 / 588
Charge shot non crit w/discord: 274 / 279

As you see, D.Va takes a lot more damage
now. Possibly too much damage. Now with Ana nerfed at the same time, and Soldier left alone, D.Va is going to take a very significant hit.

The damage she deals now is also pretty awful, but we did not have time to run tests of that. You just have to see that for yourself on PTR. When reading the patch notes, it does not seem like her damage took much of a hit, but in game it is extremely noticeable.

If I might add some personal opinion here, D.Va on PTR feels strikingly similar to the never used pre-buff D.Va. Borderline worse, if I am honest. They probably should have left D.Va be until they got Ana to a good spot, then adjusted D.Va as needed. If these changes hit live, I have a very big feeling she is going to fall into the "never picked" category again like Sombra. I know the PTR just came out, but her changes are just that quickly noticeable noticeable to me because I have 300 hours on her. Although i'v heard the same and/or similar from my friends who barely use her as well, so it isn't just a bias from me.

EDIT: CURRENTLY TRYING TO FIX FORMATTING BEAR WITH ME.
EDIT 2: Ok fixed it
EDIT 3: I honestly did not see the time. So this post might get deleted and reposted tomorrow assuming it gets no attention since it's such a text/stat heavy post. I'd really not like for all the hours of testing we did to go to waste.
EDIT 4: Copied the stats on Zarya wrong somehow. Fixed now. Her damage on PTR is much higher than live.
Plus her huge crit box. Funny how people acts like she gets 1 shot from only one player each second when we know the whole enemy team is actually melting her mech in 2 secs.
should bump this thread every now and then for significance. looks like everyone got a sledgehammer against her with the new changes.
Again, DVA cannot be crit from behind and only has a tiny crit box increase to compensate, this is a boon. She also gets a second chance if that doesn't work.

I should also mention Reaper is supposed to kill you, he was an anti-tank and was your counter before her overbuffed nonsense.
D.Va, ready for combaAuugGHhhhH
01/06/2017 09:00 AMPosted by Attlus
Again, DVA cannot be crit from behind and only has a tiny crit box increase to compensate, this is a boon. She also gets a second chance if that doesn't work.

I should also mention Reaper is supposed to kill you, he was an anti-tank and was your counter before her overbuffed nonsense.

Firstly, the size of Rein's torso isn't small.

Secondly:
01/06/2017 01:07 AMPosted by Lucky44

That MEKA is dying about 23.35 times per average comp match, more than any other 2 heroes combined. Even if we claim that the 16.81 times where the MEKA dies but she gets it back only count as a third of a death, that still puts her at just over 12 average deaths, more than any other hero. That's before factoring in the recent health nerf.

-so for all the parroting of "2nd chance!, 2nd chance!" you do, it obviously doesn't amount to much.

Thirdly, Winston is almost impossible to crit from behind, I don't see anyone trying to claim his 400 health is too much because of it.
01/06/2017 09:00 AMPosted by Attlus
Again, DVA cannot be crit from behind and only has a tiny crit box increase to compensate, this is a boon. She also gets a second chance if that doesn't work.

I should also mention Reaper is supposed to kill you, he was an anti-tank and was your counter before her overbuffed nonsense.


that's like saying she's supposed to face the other way when she wants to kill you so she wont get crit damage, then again how will she kill you if she faces the other way when her guns point the same direction as her Uy Scuti-sized critbox

and honestly speaking, people usually go reaper just to take out winston who murders the backline, for zarya, rein or hog, other heroes will do just fine against those. i've never seen in chat 'hey switch to reaper, they got zarya/rein over there' only when winston being pesky would people be forced to reaper
01/06/2017 09:00 AMPosted by Attlus
Again, DVA cannot be crit from behind and only has a tiny crit box increase to compensate, this is a boon. She also gets a second chance if that doesn't work.

I should also mention Reaper is supposed to kill you, he was an anti-tank and was your counter before her overbuffed nonsense.


Reaper isn't an anti-tank to every tank(e.g. Rein completely negates him with his shield, and Zarya stalls him).

Even without crits, she still dies very quickly, especially in the current patch.
01/06/2017 09:00 AMPosted by Attlus
Again, DVA cannot be crit from behind and only has a tiny crit box increase to compensate, this is a boon. She also gets a second chance if that doesn't work.

I should also mention Reaper is supposed to kill you, he was an anti-tank and was your counter before her overbuffed nonsense.


Wow people like you are... When shooting a character are you worried about doing critical headshots in the back? Or do you want to kill them fast, and have their headshots in the middle of the body? The great thing about middle of the body is that if they miss her head they still do damage on her. Meanwhile every other hero you would do ZERO damage if you miss the head.
This is super bad. Even at launch, D.VA had a chance against Reaper if they were really good and knew how to headshot. I don't think that's possible anymore. Reaper might actually hard counter her if this stays.
I don't understand why Blizzard are possibly the worst company when it comes to balancing. Wouldn't they OBVIOUSLY see that this is too much of a nerf to her? All they do to Ana is give her a token nerf. If we are complaining about tank damage we have a tank that can melt heroes and a tank that can one shot near all heroes. Like revert her damage back, revert her health back and just minus 100 armour. That's it.
01/06/2017 09:00 AMPosted by Attlus
Again, DVA cannot be crit from behind and only has a tiny crit box increase to compensate, this is a boon. She also gets a second chance if that doesn't work.

I should also mention Reaper is supposed to kill you, he was an anti-tank and was your counter before her overbuffed nonsense.


I don't get this whole notion of Reaper being a tank buster and that he should just blast through tanks like they're made of paper.

Reaper is first and foremost a flanker. His kit is to be used to get behind enemy lines within the shadows. Once he's behind enemy lines, he should take out the supports, snipers, and any other squishy targets that he can get a hold of. This is what Reaper truly excels at and I believe it is what Blizzard envisioned him to be.
01/06/2017 09:36 AMPosted by Azn
01/06/2017 09:00 AMPosted by Attlus
Again, DVA cannot be crit from behind and only has a tiny crit box increase to compensate, this is a boon. She also gets a second chance if that doesn't work.

I should also mention Reaper is supposed to kill you, he was an anti-tank and was your counter before her overbuffed nonsense.


I don't get this whole notion of Reaper being a tank buster and that he should just blast through tanks like they're made of paper.

Reaper is first and foremost a flanker. His kit is to be used to get behind enemy lines within the shadows. Once he's behind enemy lines, he should take out the supports, snipers, and any other squishy targets that he can get a hold of. This is what Reaper truly excels at and I believe it is what Blizzard envisioned him to be.


Surely, the fact that he has shotguns says "not meant for taking out heavily armoured targets". Exactly what D.Va was from release.

Yet somehow he's meant to counter the close-range mostly-armour hero? I don't get people.
gotta bump this thread
*bump*
01/06/2017 09:42 AMPosted by RainehDaze
01/06/2017 09:36 AMPosted by Azn
...

I don't get this whole notion of Reaper being a tank buster and that he should just blast through tanks like they're made of paper.

Reaper is first and foremost a flanker. His kit is to be used to get behind enemy lines within the shadows. Once he's behind enemy lines, he should take out the supports, snipers, and any other squishy targets that he can get a hold of. This is what Reaper truly excels at and I believe it is what Blizzard envisioned him to be.


Surely, the fact that he has shotguns says "not meant for taking out heavily armoured targets". Exactly what D.Va was from release.

Yet somehow he's meant to counter the close-range mostly-armour hero? I don't get people.


At this point it should be obvious that Blizzard balances around the most vocal playerbase. Back to forums being full of buff D.Va threads I guess.
your not taking account of the fact that dva slows down during exchanges and that her critbox is central mass...
So all the dps heroes she was good or even against will now shred her with ease if she dares to chase them down like she's supposed to, doubly because of her squishyness and secondly due to damage nerf. Bonus point if you're trying to tank anything but get shred by enemy team as soon as matrix drops off now. Dva had hard time surviving a hook from competent team, now Hog can hook her and solo her. Gold mark for not being able to shoot pharah out of the sky anymore while having a staring contest with her, waiting her to drop her ulti. Because that seems to be the only thing she will be good for anymore, eating ultimates. That is, if she afks somewhere so she doesn't lose her meka before that happens.

So what does dva counter after these changes anymore? Just widowmaker? And wouldn't a hero be very unviable if they lost to majority of the heroes in 1vs1? That's essentially what it looks like to me.

Healers will cry bloody murder when there's gonna be bazillion more flankers around again I wager.
mind boggling how a detailed post is largely ignored

bumping for the last time before sleep
Well, let's see if the PTR changes hit live... I really hope they just nerf Ana first (which was obviously needed with grenade) see how it plays out... then look at tanks in general. Anyone who plays this game knows Ana allowed heavy tank play to exist (especially if you play competitive).

Dva also isn't some kind of terminator when she can only really do effective damage to Reinhardts shield 100% of the time and most other players won't stay in her kill zone for very long. Just seeing them nerf DVa's damage makes me think Blizzard doesn't understand. The HP and armor is one thing but damage? Cmon... this is like catering to the people who say Pharrah is OP or that Mercy is completely useless please buff her, it stems from frustration and not knowing the game fully. Uncalled for nerfs, look back at how Dva used to be Blizzard and explain to us why this makes sense.

*Bonus Thought*
Am I the only one that thinks Reaper SHOULD have a tank that can fairly reliably COUNTER him? Why is there this perception that he NEEDS to counter EVERY TANK. I just don't get how that is balanced if one class is perceived as the defacto class killer. That is how you create a meta....

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