Is the Sky Really Falling?

General Discussion
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01/06/2017 05:46 PMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
To put it another way, 99.74% of the community hasn't actually played with any of these changes.


Im really curious what possessed the team to mess with her damage. She currently already does pretty low damage compared to the other options. You cant nerf her defense/survability AND her damage. Look at where she was before. Not tanky enough to be called a tank, or even remotely useful as one. Not enough dps to actually compete with other picks. This is going to dva kill dva in comp. She wont be able to 1v1 and walk out with her mech with these changes.

Keep the armor/health nerf. Get rid of the changes to her guns. Consider BUFFING her guns and nerfing her defense matrix.
01/06/2017 05:46 PMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
To put it another way, 99.74% of the community hasn't actually played with any of these changes.


If its the whole game community, means players who got banned, people who plays in pc bangs

then it doesnt makes senese

i hope that you guys make stats based of average logged players daily/weekly

like if 100k players play daily/weekly on Live, then 0.26% of that plays on PTR.
01/06/2017 05:56 PMPosted by Taril
01/06/2017 05:49 PMPosted by PlayerTuck
I love when statistics actually highlight how people don't actually try stuff.


I'm curious as to the percentage of Overwatch players that use the forums.

Then further statistics of Overwatch players that use the forums AND go onto PTR.

Since, if people aren't on the forums or other OW related internet sites (Like Reddit) there's no reason for them to actually go onto PTR unless they're impatient to try a new exciting thing (Like Sombrero) because they're not going to give any feedback.


That would give forum users such as you and I more of an impact after a long game-testing session for the new changes. Unlike others who can only supply numbers that post elsewhere, we can include our overall experiences here on the official Overwatch forums and what we think could be improved upon for a better quality of life patch in the future.
01/06/2017 05:55 PMPosted by Ceratisa
01/06/2017 05:54 PMPosted by EMc73
...

Oh snap. Guess the panic really is just mains complaining before they even find out how it is game.
I mean, you can say that but people have been testing it on PTR and reporting how it feels and you dump on those posts too.


Everytime a hero who has a lot of people 'maining' them, there are a LOT of people who try them a bit and oh no, it's clunky, I'm getting killed where I wouldn't before etc etc. It's always an overreaction. We saw it with Genji, with Zarya, with McCree's FTH etc. People buy into the panic, complain.
01/06/2017 06:00 PMPosted by Ceratisa
<span class="truncated">...</span>

But I'm a second class console player so o can't

Anyways had a 72 elim to 2 death game last night on DVA riding it till the patch

You could literally deal 1 pellet worth of damage to 72 people (totalling 72 damage) and just always hide in the back to achieve those stats.


No kidding yet they could only kill me twice however I wasn't in the back anyways

You will be out of mech more with the patch so learn to use the pistol of death just wish mercy had such a reliable one
01/06/2017 06:04 PMPosted by EMc73
<span class="truncated">...</span> I mean, you can say that but people have been testing it on PTR and reporting how it feels and you dump on those posts too.


Everytime a hero who has a lot of people 'maining' them, there are a LOT of people who try them a bit and oh no, it's clunky, I'm getting killed where I wouldn't before etc etc. It's always an overreaction. We saw it with Genji, with Zarya, with McCree's FTH etc. People buy into the panic, complain.


Except D.Va is losing more than half of her health if somebody looks at her. I'm spending more time boosting to medkits or retreating to my healer than I do helping my team. The D.Vas on the other teams usually just explode.
01/06/2017 06:04 PMPosted by EMc73
<span class="truncated">...</span> I mean, you can say that but people have been testing it on PTR and reporting how it feels and you dump on those posts too.


Everytime a hero who has a lot of people 'maining' them, there are a LOT of people who try them a bit and oh no, it's clunky, I'm getting killed where I wouldn't before etc etc. It's always an overreaction. We saw it with Genji, with Zarya, with McCree's FTH etc. People buy into the panic, complain.

There's a major difference. None of them have been terrible since the start
But I have played the PTR, and D.va's getting wrecked in every single game... I mean, if the point was to make her useless, good job!
01/06/2017 06:04 PMPosted by EMc73
oh no, it's clunky

Being clunky and being worse are two very different things.
  • Widowmaker post scope-nerf was clunky. It didn't feel right (and in my Widow-maining experience, still doesn't feel right).
  • Genji losing two slashes of his ultimate was worse. It felt like the power had been reduced and that Genji's across the board were being brought down.
01/06/2017 12:49 PMPosted by pandabear1
01/06/2017 12:48 PMPosted by Larzyn
Yup. I'm having a harder time staying in her mech than when she wasn't buffed.


staying in the mech and actually dying are two different things


Everyone salty enough to downvote a dude to hell who had a legitimate point.
Dying and losing Mech are very different
01/06/2017 05:46 PMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
To put it another way, 99.74% of the community hasn't actually played with any of these changes.
I really look forward to playing, but wait times for a quickplay match are a bit long right now.

I'm certain it's not as bad as the folks on here are trying to make it out to be, and the instigators trying to stir up trouble aren't helping. This is why we have the PTR, to test these things on a wider audience. I'll be playing more this weekend. I hope the time I spend there will give you some valuable data. I'm a D.Va main so I'll be putting these changes through a lot of testing. Thanks for being patient with us despite the vitriol that gets thrown around here, Jeff.

You really are a patient man. Thanks for doing all you do.
01/06/2017 05:46 PMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
To put it another way, 99.74% of the community hasn't actually played with any of these changes.


i knew you'd come in here to settle the degeneracy eventually mate, thanks a bunch

now give us a murloc hero (Murky) pls :P

wallsticking (stationary position on wall, hell, maybe even slight movement on said wall, like a frog on a branch, aiming for his prey below)
poison gun. (3 stacks, right click= consume poison stacks for burst damage)
superjump (and tackle an enemy like the L4D2 Jockey, if you hit, doing 3-stack poison damage and healing yourself for a percentage of damage done)
pet-based ultimate (imagine, AI controlled ADHD-suffering baby murlocs who will attack whomever you paint with your guns poison attack, by jumping like superfrogs all over the map)

you know you want to Jeff ;)

i know we're all waiting for Doomfist (Terry Crews ftw) but it would be nice to get another glasscanon hero, who is also a pet-based hero.. especially one, as affiliated with the Blizzard universe as the Murloc.

Jeff, i have a guess to make; is your favorite animal the frog? because then we have something in common
01/06/2017 06:00 PMPosted by Ceratisa
01/06/2017 05:58 PMPosted by KugansMisare
...

But I'm a second class console player so o can't

Anyways had a 72 elim to 2 death game last night on DVA riding it till the patch

You could literally deal 1 pellet worth of damage to 72 people (totalling 72 damage) and just always hide in the back to achieve those stats.


i do that to paddle my stats :F
01/06/2017 06:00 PMPosted by GaleWeathers
01/06/2017 05:45 PMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
To answer the original title's question:

No the sky is not falling.

0.26% of Overwatch players have tested these changes on the PTR.

The average playtime on the PTR (including sitting in menus etc.) this week is 26 minutes.

I encourage people to log in and try these changes for a few nights -- not one anecdotal match -- and see how you feel about them by formulating your own opinion.


Except the PTR is for PC only which discounts console players and renders an entire chunk of the community unable to give feedback - but Blizz doesnt really seem to care about console players.


Now now, we all know why that is... I mean it sucks. If I was capable as a console player I'd be on the PTR right now.

Which is why, since I can't make certain judgements, I digest all of what everyone is saying(both sides), gameplay on PTR, and the actual numbers and how they compare to live and predict from that.

My initial opinion just from not playing the PTR is that Dvas nerfs were a bit much. I think the biggest reason I'm saying that is because before I ACTUALLY had no issue with Dva post-buff. Which I'm sure is because I play Zarya a lot while also playing Dva some too.

I've taken that into consideration at the very least. I'm actually surprised very few people have bothered to test these changes or very long(average 26 mins).
I mean as a console player, I would figure the Pc players wouldn't take that privilege for granted. I mean you Pc people can... where we others can't. Or is everyone just basing their opinions by listening to people, gameplay, and by not playing the PTR?

I'm doing the same thing but my stance isn't concrete. First impressions aren't always correct and I would figure people would test to be sure.
TBH, people acting like the sky is falling over minor nerfs to their favorite character is probably one of the main reasons Blizzard tends to ignore us when it comes to actual bad changes.

Remember when people said the nerf to Nanoboost was going to completely destroy Ana? Lol.
01/06/2017 05:46 PMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
To put it another way, 99.74% of the community hasn't actually played with any of these changes.

Given Blizzard's history of PTR changes going forward to live regardless of player participation or feedback in multiple games spanning the past decade, there's a feeling of helplessness among the player base that playing the PTR isn't going to result in changes anyway.

It also doesn't take playing with every change to realize what's going to happen in certain circumstances. D.Va's effective hp is lower than her release ehp in many circumstances when it was obvious at release she was having survivability issues. The defense matrix change alone wasn't enough to pull her out of it either, and then her defense matrix was actually nerfed after that initial change making her worse. If her stats return to being worse like at release and post d.matrix patch when she was considered unplayable except for last point stall, it's extremely likely she's going to return to the state she was in before. Then on top of that reduced survivability she's eating a pretty big, not small like characterized in the notes, dps nerf.

Also I haven't been able to log onto the PTR since the middle of 2 PTRs ago 'unexpected server error' and repeatedly posting in the bug report forum on my main account hasn't gotten it solved. This account can't either, but I don't care about PTR access on it.
01/06/2017 06:10 PMPosted by to0ty
01/06/2017 06:00 PMPosted by Ceratisa
...
You could literally deal 1 pellet worth of damage to 72 people (totalling 72 damage) and just always hide in the back to achieve those stats.


i do that to paddle my stats :F
Sshhhh we all do a little bit I think
01/06/2017 05:56 PMPosted by BrokenStylus
01/06/2017 05:53 PMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
Of course.


What's the threshold for that?

Because plenty of people were pissed about nerfs pre-dating PTR, and we basically got told to sit down, grin and bear it.


That "of course" was very painful to read....
01/06/2017 05:45 PMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
To answer the original title's question:

No the sky is not falling.

0.26% of Overwatch players have tested these changes on the PTR.

The average playtime on the PTR (including sitting in menus etc.) this week is 26 minutes.

I encourage people to log in and try these changes for a few nights -- not one anecdotal match -- and see how you feel about them by formulating your own opinion.
Thank you very much Jeff for the input. Cant wait til this hits console. Everything looks & sounds great.
01/06/2017 05:45 PMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
To answer the original title's question:

No the sky is not falling.

0.26% of Overwatch players have tested these changes on the PTR.

The average playtime on the PTR (including sitting in menus etc.) this week is 26 minutes.

I encourage people to log in and try these changes for a few nights -- not one anecdotal match -- and see how you feel about them by formulating your own opinion.

I've done more than one match and its the same. D.va is melted easily. Roadhog can reduce her hp from 600 to 66 in one combo or even destroy her mech. Her defense matrix does not last long enough to make her survive. She no longer feels like a tank.

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