Support SR not broken? Just hit master solo

Competitive Discussion
Now obviously my story could be the exception and there might be an actual problem with supports SR, but here it goes.

This season I decided to be a 100% Mei main. I massed a ton of games and hovered around 3000-3200. I was always diamond in previous seasons.

Then I kinda grew tired of failing with Mei's right click and went full Mercy main.

Here's the interesting part. I started playing 100% Mercy solo queue at around 3150. Check out my Mercy stats:

Games lost: 50
Games won: 49
SR: 3505 (up 355 with a less than 50% win rate)
Avg. fire time/match: 26 seconds (btw I very rarely use my blaster)

I have routinely earned more than 30 SR per win and lost less than 20 per game (worst case I lost about 25 I think). I also had to leave a couple of games for -50 a pop, yet I still came out massively ahead.

All this doesn't invalidate other people's experiences though. I think the weirdest I've seen was two people smurfing together all of their games, and the dpser ended up hundreds ahead. Scott Mercer said that personal performance only accounts for a minor SR adjustment, so that couldn't have been it.

I wish they'd be more transparent about the system. If we knew exactly how it worked, the conspiracy theorists wouldn't be able to blame everyone but themselves for their ELO hell.
You almost seem to be an exception to the rule. From my brief, roughly 30 minutes of browsing profiles of vocal Mercys out here, those suffering from disparate gains to losses all seem to strictly heal, such as yourself. Battle Mercys like me and a few others I've looked at that get more kills, consequently, more on-fire rating, don't appear to be as negatively impacted.

I don't know what Blizzard is doing here, but they really need to revisit this issue since there appears to be a bit of an outcry.
It could be that some are affected and some aren't, and maybe that's leading to confusion for Blizzard in the first place. I think there is enough evidence out though that a lot of people ARE being affected, at some time and for some reason.
You see the many amounts of people claiming that the games are one sided and you are ether put on the team that slaughters or the team that is slaughtering, you know it is HIGHLY likely that 60% or more of your games you just so happened to be put on the team that did very very well.

You literally just got lucky. no question about it and your pure arrogance is not helping your case any.
04/14/2017 12:53 PMPosted by portrub
You see the many amounts of people claiming that the games are one sided and you are ether put on the team that slaughters or the team that is slaughtering, you know it is HIGHLY likely that 60% or more of your games you just so happened to be put on the team that did very very well.

You literally just got lucky. no question about it and your pure arrogance is not helping your case any.

This thread is about SR gains for supports, not climbing. At least understand what the thread is about before showing everyone how upset you are that you can't climb.

As for support SR gains I personally have not noticed any problems as Ana (getting +30 -20 average). I don't really know for mercy since I haven't played her much, although my couple of wins with her gave the same SR as Ana/Rein.
It depends on how you play. Mercy really shouldn't be using her blaster unless she's completely alone. If there's a dps to fly to and dmg boost you do that.

Getting to Masters maining mercy is almost pure luck, yeah you may get some blaster kills once in a while but you really should be focusing on healing. For the most part if you get a 3, 4 or 5 res it doesn't matter if your team manages to piss away the chance you gave them.

I've gotten to Masters solo queueing as support since November, but it's almost all luck as to whether or not you win, and once you drop down to diamond again it's Elo hell downhill from there, requiring luck once again to get back up.

As a support its your job to make sure the people that should be killing the enemy team stay alive; your dps can't kill? You don't win.
04/14/2017 12:58 PMPosted by Dreaddnaut
It depends on how you play. Mercy really shouldn't be using her blaster unless she's completely alone. If there's a dps to fly to and dmg boost you do that.

Getting to Masters maining mercy is almost pure luck, yeah you may get some blaster kills once in a while but you really should be focusing on healing. For the most part if you get a 3, 4 or 5 res it doesn't matter if your team manages to piss away the chance you gave them.

I've gotten to Masters solo queueing as support since November, but it's almost all luck as to whether or not you win, and once you drop down to diamond again it's Elo hell downhill from there, requiring luck once again to get back up.

As a support its your job to make sure the people that should be killing the enemy team stay alive; your dps can't kill? You don't win.


But how is 100 games 50% win rate luck though? It's not like I went on some mad streak and now I'm gonna crash. I gain more points than I lose so climbing is inevitable as long as this holds true.

As far as getting lucky with capable dps teammates - you can say the same for other roles. If I fail with rez more than enemy Mercy, we lose. If enemy Rein blocks shatter and our Rein doesn't, we lose.

I've definitely had games where my actions secured victory, and I've had games where I cringed because I knew I made us lose. Everyone on the team can have meaningful impact.

Btw, I see you main Zen. I was SR71 in Season 1 as Zen main. I had massive impact. I killed a lot and nullified many Genji ults. Come on man, don't be bitter! You're contributing, you can make a difference. If your dpsers are slightly worse than enemy dps you can still win!
ive played a lot of Mercy on my climb from ~1500 to ~2400 and I have not noticed any strange SR gains or losses. Just my personal experience though.
I think you might simply be a better support than all the complainers out there.
04/14/2017 01:21 PMPosted by Snakes
I think you might simply be a better support than all the complainers out there.


But people like you say support is easy, so how could there be a good or bad support? White knights are not going to help anything.
04/14/2017 01:22 PMPosted by Zaximus
04/14/2017 01:21 PMPosted by Snakes
I think you might simply be a better support than all the complainers out there.


But people like you say support is easy, so how could there be a good or bad support? White knights are not going to help anything.


LoL please quote where I said support was easy.

Here's a secret... Really good players play support.

Really bad players play support too.

Which ones deserve to gain more SR for wins? The good ones, right?
I'm starting to think that there isn't a support SR issue but rather the game just places heavy importance on individual performance. So you can gain a lot of SR as Mercy if you do really "well" with her. As of late it seems to get on fire you have to rez a few people. So the more you rez the more likely you are to be awarded extra SR for a good performance.

I'm still wondering how heal vs damage boost affects how the game views your performance
I still don't get how you can have under 50% winrate and go up 355 sr.. what kind of stupid system is that and one gets 60% winrate and barely moves up.
04/14/2017 12:42 PMPosted by putka
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It's still possible to climb with support heroes.

But the problem is that the game thinks you didn't contributed much because you weren't that much on fire because the recently changed onfire system prevents healers from generating fire for healing and assisting.

It punish healers with less SR if you win and you'll lose more SR if you lose a game.

This makes it harder for Healers to climb because basically they end with less SR if the win 2 games and lose 1 game. Again, climbing is possible, but it's only harder than it should be.

That's the bug.

Btw, I see you main Zen. I was SR71 in Season 1 as Zen main. I had massive impact. I killed a lot and nullified many Genji ults. Come on man, don't be bitter! You're contributing, you can make a difference. If your dpsers are slightly worse than enemy dps you can still win!


Need to be alive to nullify genji ults. I'm not talking less than average teammates, I'm talking teammates where the Winston will wait for the team to engage and hop onto the supports. I tell the team Every. Single. Push. That the Winston will be on the supports and nobody pays attention.

Most games I'm shot calling my discords only to have them fall on deaf ears. I'm telling the team we need to kill soldier on high ground and nobody listens.

This is all just the cherry one top despite when I do fantastic healing out healing the mercy or Ana on my team, and getting a good amount of elims with a bunch of assists (50-60% participation). Supports can get stuck in ELO hell easier than anybody else; especially mercy as a proxy support.

The game is weighted towards dps because the geniuses at blizzard haven't found a way to actually gauge teamwork into the metrics that they believe to determine skill. The bad dps are always going to be able to stay at higher ranks until the matchmaker learns what actual good team play looks like.

Maybe then supports will get the appreciation they deserve.
04/14/2017 12:48 PMPosted by Baalzevuv
You almost seem to be an exception to the rule. From my brief, roughly 30 minutes of browsing profiles of vocal Mercys out here, those suffering from disparate gains to losses all seem to strictly heal, such as yourself. Battle Mercys like me and a few others I've looked at that get more kills, consequently, more on-fire rating, don't appear to be as negatively impacted.


I think you hit the nail on the head there. Here's my theory: assuming that the ratio of being on fire is one of the deciding factors for SR gain, "battle Mercies" will get much more fire for kill participation than Mercies who choose to damage boost instead (since assists don't give meaningful fire% anymore). This also explains why Mercies in lower ranks might struggle more than those in higher ranks: people will generally take more unnecessary damage due to bad positioning (not to mention solo healing), so a Mercy usually won't have the luxury of having free time to take potshots with her pistol and earn fire from kills. (People in lower ranks also have worse aim, and those who can aim go for Ana rather than Mercy, so attempting to shoot people as Mercy is generally less useful to the team than boosting a teammate.)
04/14/2017 01:27 PMPosted by xJAE14x
I'm starting to think that there isn't a support SR issue but rather the game just places heavy importance on individual performance. So you can gain a lot of SR as Mercy if you do really "well" with her. As of late it seems to get on fire you have to rez a few people. So the more you rez the more likely you are to be awarded extra SR for a good performance.

I'm still wondering how heal vs damage boost affects how the game views your performance


I'm thinking along these lines too, but the thing is that rezing is a very subjective thing to be monitoring for fire gain. What I mean is that sometimes it does make sense to rez just one player and other times it's better to let them fight it out and hold on to the rez, or just let them die and rez them all together. There can't be a blanket rule about rezing since it's very situational, so it can't be heavily relied upon to objectively judge whether a mercy player is "good" or not. This is one issue with a system that seems to be "rewarding" or favouring ult usage frequency.

Another issue is that the current system seems to also be rewarding and favouring damage (whether it's assisting/boosting an ally, or inflicting damage on an enemy yourself) over healing. I don't think there are loads of people who can't see how that is absurd in the case of supports. I certainly think that supports who excel at both should be rewarded, but if you are the only healer (which can be a viable comp) then your primary purpose is exactly that; healing. You should not be penalized for that. Imagine being the only healer and focusing on damage instead of healing.

The final point is that this is just speculation on my part based on what I have read on these threads, which primarily comes from other players. If this is indeed how the system works, is it unreasonable to expect that such a huge shift would at least be announced? I think that more transparency on how the system works is needed. If the system is such that it can be easily abused if more information is revealed, then it's better to question whether it's a good system to use in the first place. I can't see how leaving the community to speculate on this is any better. I hope these issues are addressed soon.
Maybe this is true.

But at best this makes me think the system is even more broken.

A mercy with 49% win rate climbs while a mercy with a 55-60% win rate falls.

Something is definitely wrong with the above picture.

Seems like the person in this case was rewarded for using their blaster. Sure it helped them with personal SR. But it made their team lose more than they won. A system shouldn't punish players who can consistently win 55%+ and then reward players who win less than 50%. What's the point then?
By the way guys.. on the subject of "battle Mercies". I really don't advise doing that for several reasons.

If I as a Mercy start peeking and shooting at enemies, I can be destroyed instantly. This is wildly irresponsible behaviour. As soon as Mercy goes down, this is communicated to the team and everyone dives in with ults.

Even if I don't get killed, my reaction time to heal my team will be much slower. Let's say your team is all full hp, and you pull out your blaster cause you have nothing to do. Someone might get focused and maybe you don't notice cause you're too busy blasting. And even if you instantly notice, you'll still react slower than if you're always beam-on.

The only way I normally do "damage" is by boosting from behind cover. Mercy is priority target #1. 80% of my gameplay is mind games with enemy dps and monkies.

Now I do kill my share of flankers but those are desperate situations when I'm cornered or have no one to fly to, which, in a way is usually failure on my part.

If you focus moderately on doing damage as Mercy, you'll be losing more games in the long run which will negate any "fire-related SR bonus" from dealing damage, if that's even the case and not just guesswork. Winning is still the best way to climb.

https://www.youtube.com/user/Blinky2099

Go watch this top 500 Mercy guy play. He also has a lot of strategy videos explaining his decisions and thought process.
04/14/2017 02:19 PMPosted by Chronos
Maybe this is true.

But at best this makes me think the system is even more broken.

A mercy with 49% win rate climbs while a mercy with a 55-60% win rate falls.

Something is definitely wrong with the above picture.

Seems like the person in this case was rewarded for using their blaster. Sure it helped them with personal SR. But it made their team lose more than they won. A system shouldn't punish players who can consistently win 55%+ and then reward players who win less than 50%. What's the point then?


No, I'm not a dps Mercy, those were some other people they talked about. By the way guys, my On Fire stat on Overbuff is only 3.3%, lower than most people. My average game fire time is just 26 seconds. I think the general public is a bit mislead on the importance of fire time for SR.

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