Season 5 needs a SR reset

Competitive Discussion
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04/17/2017 09:21 AMPosted by AkiraHim
Streak system made everything in S1 to S4 all over the places, now they removed the streak system (most of it), there should be a SR reset
If streak was also being considered in the MMR formula (which it is still remain mysterious), blizzard should recalculate MMR for everyone as if there is no streak for placement matches after the SR reset


No, GTFO
04/17/2017 11:19 AMPosted by Isaac
Even GM players want SR Resets.
Mainly because you can accumulate SR every season.
This is why you here high octane players ranting about how only season 2 rank matters. Because season 3 and 4 is inflated SR. Just do resets every two seasons, people who deserve a rank will get to that rank. I don't think the problem of GMs/Top500 playing against lower ELO will be much of a problem, most of the really good players will be back on top after a week or so.


they do?
Overwatch is still a relatively new game. I am certain it will go on for a lot longer.

There have already been a few hiccups that Blizzard has admitted to - Mercy SR gains being lower and a number of issues already being changed like Streak impacts being reduced. Also the boosting and people currently using low tier comp as a proving ground also distorts the system. A number of prominent youtubers are even questioning the value of the system. Everyone has heard of Your Overwatch and one of their members consistently gets put in platinum despite having an alt that maintains a master rating. He raises his main to diamond, but Blizzard's system keeps putting him down to platinum. His alt stays in Master. It does not fall out. There is your anomoly. Not everyone rises as they should and not everyone falls as they should. The system is not perfect. It is smart, but it has flaws.

Lets face facts, the system is flawed.

I think the question is not whether there should be a reset, but when will the reset happen and how hard of a reset will it be.

Over time the flaws in the system will become more and more appearent and eventually the matches will become even more and more unbalanced. Flaws work this way. The longer it takes to reset the damage, the harder the reset needed to fix it.

So you should be asking yourselves, should Blizzard do a slight reset each season that is more fluid to allow people to shift into ranks closer to their true skill level yet still close to their current SR, or should it wait until these flaws compound and we discover more issues and a hard reset is required again.

People worry about "Chaos" but we returned to a "sense of normalcy" within 2 seasons.

Comp is going to need a reset. What type is really the question.
It's not needed. I like keeping my progress and setting goals every season. Higher ranks would suffer from this being paired with golds and such. This is a horrible idea and should not happen. Season 5 needs a rework on how SR is gained and loss instead.

Also !@#$ decay!
04/18/2017 03:32 AMPosted by Unhek
04/17/2017 10:27 AMPosted by SilentKiller

They are never going to do an SR reset. Why would they?
1. It is completely unfair to anyone who has ever climbed to a higher rank in competitive, which is a pretty large portion of people I would guess.
2. If MMR doesn't get reset too then it would result in completely unbalanced games where people are playing with people way better than them, or vice versa.
3. If MMR does get reset it seems pointless to put a bunch of diamonds/masters/GM players in gold or below, then have them all climb up again playing against other diamond/master/GM players.
4. All the low rank players that are in bronze/silver claiming they are better than their rank are still going to be disappointed because they will still be unable to climb out of their rank, even with an SR reset that happens to place you in gold. This is because you are where you are because you belong there.


1.
Nonsense, if the system works they will climb up again easily, and many of them even make new accounts on purpose just so they can climb again. This is a non issue.

2.
MMR should get reset

3.
That is the point, a reset would show if this indeed happens or not.
I believe it won't because I have multiple accounts that vary drastically in terms of SR.

4.
If this is true the reset will prove it, if not, we can finally maybe figure out the reason why you have very very bad players way up in masters.


"very very bad players in masters" who are you to say this? Do you honestly think that you will make it to masters (and stay there) if you are bad? Like...do you HONESTLY think that?
04/17/2017 11:30 AMPosted by SilentKiller
04/17/2017 11:22 AMPosted by IrVayne33
Well what I really want to say it...could blizzard reset ranks of players who ask for it? Like I want a reset. So don't messed up the other guys. Give a guy down in silver or bronze a chance to get back up. Sometimes they're just great players who just stuck with matchmaking errors.


This is still unfair to people. Say a bronze player wants a reset because he is so sure that he is better than bronze, but he actually isn't. He gets placed in high gold, and is now going to ruin every game he's in until hes back to bronze because he isn't a gold player, hes a bronze player. That sucks for everyone that gets placed with that player on their team.


I understand where you're coming from but..would that really matter? Any player or new player could just buy the game repeatedly and still have that same effect in competitive. Or am i wrong?
04/17/2017 09:28 AMPosted by SilentKiller
Resetting everyone's sr history is a terrible idea. Would you like to play against GM players in gold?
It could be a chance to see if their system really works. If it really does everybody will be put exactly where they need to be within the first week, or two at most. If GMs are playing with Silvers and Golds it would just go to prove that their system is broke. It would be the ultimate stress test on the system and would prove/disprove many theories.
SR/MMR reset will result in clusterbuck centered around mid Gold for several weeks. Prepare for "Placement on Steroids" with every player in every match is a Wildcard ranging from Bronze thrower to GM. Unlimited complains on every forum about wildly unbalanced matches, hackers, trolls - what we basically have now but multiplied tenfold.

Then better players will slowly climb (fighting mix of Diamond/Master/GM at every rank past Gold) with a ton of grind. Weaker players will be instantly thrown down, struggling to compete with opponents of level they've never seen before and dragged even further by even worse teammates that would suffer the very same fate - for high rank players there are really no difference between Bronze and low Gold.

Several weeks in, the dust is settled and everyone basically where they were before. Some players will move up or down a tier, but these will be mostly edge cases who already float near pivotal points (1900/2400/2900 etc).
04/18/2017 07:29 AMPosted by cluelessgame
04/17/2017 09:28 AMPosted by SilentKiller
Resetting everyone's sr history is a terrible idea. Would you like to play against GM players in gold?
It could be a chance to see if their system really works. If it really does everybody will be put exactly where they need to be within the first week, or two at most. If GMs are playing with Silvers and Golds it would just go to prove that their system is broke. It would be the ultimate stress test on the system and would prove/disprove many theories.


I don't think you quite understand the issue. If everything is reset then it's very possible many high level players will end up in those lower ranks BECAUSE they have a good chance of facing a few GM's himself since it is now a randomized bag of marbles. Reset would do nothing with harm now that the game has been out for 1 year and there are such different levels in skill. Reset only makes sense for 1v1 games.
04/18/2017 08:16 AMPosted by kimchipotato
<span class="truncated">...</span>It could be a chance to see if their system really works. If it really does everybody will be put exactly where they need to be within the first week, or two at most. If GMs are playing with Silvers and Golds it would just go to prove that their system is broke. It would be the ultimate stress test on the system and would prove/disprove many theories.


I don't think you quite understand the issue. If everything is reset then it's very possible many high level players will end up in those lower ranks BECAUSE they have a good chance of facing a few GM's himself since it is now a randomized bag of marbles. Reset would do nothing with harm now that the game has been out for 1 year and there are such different levels in skill. Reset only makes sense for 1v1 games.
I am not saying a total reset of SR+MMR, I am saying a reset of SR only, and recalculate MMR (not set it back to zero) if necessary, people with high MMR would assume they have higher ranks, match with people also high in MMR in placement by default and they are placed around plat or diamond instead of high gold and vice versa for lower MMR players
...

I don't think you quite understand the issue. If everything is reset then it's very possible many high level players will end up in those lower ranks BECAUSE they have a good chance of facing a few GM's himself since it is now a randomized bag of marbles. Reset would do nothing with harm now that the game has been out for 1 year and there are such different levels in skill. Reset only makes sense for 1v1 games.
I am not saying a total reset of SR+MMR, I am saying a reset of SR only, and recalculate MMR (not set it back to zero) if necessary, people with high MMR would assume they have higher ranks, match with people also high in MMR in placement by default and they are placed around plat or diamond instead of high gold and vice versa for lower MMR players


Then it's still the same as how it works now. If you were bronze, you play with bronzes and you will be placed in bronze. So what you're saying now is that the system is just fine and that it has to stay this way.

So what's your point?
04/18/2017 08:36 AMPosted by StRode
...I am not saying a total reset of SR+MMR, I am saying a reset of SR only, and recalculate MMR (not set it back to zero) if necessary, people with high MMR would assume they have higher ranks, match with people also high in MMR in placement by default and they are placed around plat or diamond instead of high gold and vice versa for lower MMR players


Then it's still the same as how it works now. If you were bronze, you play with bronzes and you will be placed in bronze. So what you're saying now is that the system is just fine and that it has to stay this way.

So what's your point?
to make people with higher MMR get out of the ELO hell by placement matches and correct the flaws in the pass 4 seasons
04/17/2017 09:28 AMPosted by SilentKiller
Resetting everyone's sr history is a terrible idea. Would you like to play against GM players in gold?


Yes, and it'd be for all of one game, if even that.

Seriously, people panic about the smallest things. There WAS a season 1, and it worked out fine after two weeks. There may have even been QP skill referenced for placement, who knows? But the game certainly hadn't been out for long.

The only thing people worry about is if they grinded through the 2 wins needed for every one loss on the way up, they think they earned something (I just did this for the last 500 points by the way). It didn't. The SR system is broken. But if you are good, you'll still end up good after a short time, and if you're bad you'll still be bad.

But everyone bad will have at least one less excuse. So if you are good, you should actually really be behind this more.
...

Then it's still the same as how it works now. If you were bronze, you play with bronzes and you will be placed in bronze. So what you're saying now is that the system is just fine and that it has to stay this way.

So what's your point?
to make people with higher MMR get out of the ELO hell by placement matches and correct the flaws in the pass 4 seasons


It still doesn't work that way. If someones aim is good while he is in silver, it does not mean he belongs in diamond+. They need to improve the Overwatch skills and not the Avarage FPS skills in order to climb. This isn't CoD. In Overwatch aim is overall only about less than 20% of your skill depending on the hero you play. The other 80% is about positioning, formation, communication, strategies, et cetera. The TEAM ASPECTS of the game are the most important ones in Overwatch. That's why pro players are pro players and people with just a gold portrait aren't. A silver with good aim would be CRUSHED in diamond, cause he doesn't understand a crap about the team aspects of the game.

PS: ELO hell doesn't exist
04/18/2017 08:44 AMPosted by StRode
...to make people with higher MMR get out of the ELO hell by placement matches and correct the flaws in the pass 4 seasons


It still doesn't work that way. If someones aim is good while he is in silver, it does not mean he belongs in diamond+. They need to improve the Overwatch skills and not the Avarage FPS skills in order to climb. This isn't CoD. In Overwatch aim is overall only about less than 20% of your skill depending on the hero you play. The other 80% is about positioning, formation, communication, strategies, et cetera. The TEAM ASPECTS of the game are the most important ones in Overwatch. That's why pro players are pro players and people with just a gold portrait aren't. A silver with good aim would be CRUSHED in diamond, cause he doesn't understand a crap about the team aspects of the game.

PS: ELO hell doesn't exist
in this case just look at all those tanks and supports that got stuck in lower ranks because all those dpses lack of overwatch knowledge left in lower ranks after decent dpses already climbed up with a dps favoured SR gain system.
...

It still doesn't work that way. If someones aim is good while he is in silver, it does not mean he belongs in diamond+. They need to improve the Overwatch skills and not the Avarage FPS skills in order to climb. This isn't CoD. In Overwatch aim is overall only about less than 20% of your skill depending on the hero you play. The other 80% is about positioning, formation, communication, strategies, et cetera. The TEAM ASPECTS of the game are the most important ones in Overwatch. That's why pro players are pro players and people with just a gold portrait aren't. A silver with good aim would be CRUSHED in diamond, cause he doesn't understand a crap about the team aspects of the game.

PS: ELO hell doesn't exist
in this case just look at all those tanks and supports that got stuck in lower ranks because all those dpses lack of overwatch knowledge left in lower ranks after decent dpses already climbed up with a dps favoured SR gain system.


Bullcrap. I main tanks and healers as well and why can I climb and others can't?

The awnser is simple: they're just not good enough.
04/17/2017 09:28 AMPosted by SilentKiller
Resetting everyone's sr history is a terrible idea. Would you like to play against GM players in gold?


I would love to play with / against gm players, or at least players equal to my level. Even if i had my !@# kicked it would be awesome to see how they played and if playing with them how they worked the maps.
<span class="truncated">...</span>to make people with higher MMR get out of the ELO hell by placement matches and correct the flaws in the pass 4 seasons


It still doesn't work that way. If someones aim is good while he is in silver, it does not mean he belongs in diamond+. They need to improve the Overwatch skills and not the Avarage FPS skills in order to climb. This isn't CoD. In Overwatch aim is overall only about less than 20% of your skill depending on the hero you play. The other 80% is about positioning, formation, communication, strategies, et cetera. The TEAM ASPECTS of the game are the most important ones in Overwatch. That's why pro players are pro players and people with just a gold portrait aren't. A silver with good aim would be CRUSHED in diamond, cause he doesn't understand a crap about the team aspects of the game.

PS: ELO hell doesn't exist


Okay, what about the youtuber from Your Overwatch that maintains an alt in Masters+ but keep getting pushed down to Platinum each season because the MMR has them stuck?

They can grind on their own, but the system does not recognize they can play and thrive in higher tiers.

Can you honestly say that he is where he belongs? Does he belong in Masters+ or Platinum?

Do you want him to try and grind his account still in Plat and potentially skew those matches?

You could call him an anomaly.

We have evidence of some flaws in the system that Blizzard has openly admitted to.(Low SR gains from Mercy and other supports, streak system that went too far, etc)

Can you honestly say these flaws won't eventually compound and create a more skewed system where more of these anomalies become more frequent?
04/18/2017 09:06 AMPosted by StRode
...in this case just look at all those tanks and supports that got stuck in lower ranks because all those dpses lack of overwatch knowledge left in lower ranks after decent dpses already climbed up with a dps favoured SR gain system.


Bullcrap. I main tanks and healers as well and why can I climb and others can't?

The awnser is simple: they're just not good enough.
have you ever matched with low gold to silver DPSes players?
04/17/2017 09:28 AMPosted by SilentKiller
Resetting everyone's sr history is a terrible idea. Would you like to play against GM players in gold?


Why not this is how it works in other games that have resets.

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