Misconception about tanks

Competitive Discussion
Why do people think that tanks shouldn't do damage? As of now, especially after the roadhog nerf, no tank can reliably 1 shot characters. The new Dva actually has to hit every missile on the direct + left click on close range to burst anyone down, and this has to be done to sacrifice the mobility and d-matrix, and such a maneuver would result in Dva's mech being lost.

People often associate tanks with walls. This is false. Stop expecting tanks to not be able to hurt you at all and for you to endless pummel them for ult charge.
Having tanks who can one hit kinda defeats the whole purpose of being a tank. DPS = high damage with low health. Tanks = sustained damage with high health.

If you have a character with tons of health and the ability to one hit ... that's not a tank ... that's a god.

Tanks have always been the aggro class meant to soak large amounts of damage for their team. Healers always heal the tanks. DPS always kills the baddies.
People expect tanks to be a giant "hit me sign".

They look at Reinhardt and think that they all should be like that. Hence why a lot of the player base hates playing tank out of the other classes.

The idea of tanks being the real initiators instead dps/picks is foreign to most of the OverWatch Playerbase.

Reworking Mercy and Lucio from being healbots is a good first step to making the game more of a real shooter. Changing the tanks to be less of "Hit-Me signs" as well is the next step.
<Removed by forum moderator for toxicity>

So a tank should not only have more health than anyone plus armor or shields, but they should have Doomfist punches as well? What would the point be for the entire DPS group then? That's just stupid.
Tanks are probably one of the most lethal things in this game if you try to duel them. Thinking tanks cannot do enough damage to nearly instantly waste anything other than another tank means you aren't running into any decent tanks.
Overwatch is as much of a MOBA as it is a shooter.
Hence why the classes and their functions are the same as MOBA/MMO classes.

This isn't a "just spawn and kill people" arena shooter. There's strategy ... there's classes. It takes more then aim. That's what made it different to many people coming from other FPS games.

Not every class or character is going to be built to be able to 1v1 every other class or character. That defeats the purpose entirely.

Tanks are SUPPOSE to be "giant hit me" signs ... that's why they've been called tanks for decades. They're "built like tanks" ... meaning they take alot of damage.

That is their role ... that is their purpose.
08/25/2017 02:24 PMPosted by jtgsz
Tanks are probably one of the most lethal things in this game if you try to duel them. Thinking tanks cannot do enough damage to nearly instantly waste anything other than another tank means you aren't running into any decent tanks.


Actual tanking is one of the most important and least understood jobs in OverWatch.

People hate the class because they don't have the tactical understanding to use it properly. Many die often without really doing anything besides filling a 2x2x2 slot and making their team feel unrealistically safe.

People forget the larger healthpool comes with a significantly larger hitbox, that makes a tank much easier to hit and focus down than a normal dps character.

That ease of focus and hit means a tank is much more reliant on their team than normal DPS.

08/25/2017 02:30 PMPosted by harkypoo
Overwatch is as much of a MOBA as it is a shooter.
Hence why the classes and their functions are the same as MOBA/MMO classes.

This isn't a "just spawn and kill people" arena shooter. There's strategy ... there's classes. It takes more then aim. That's what made it different to many people coming from other FPS games.

Not every class or character is going to be built to be able to 1v1 every other class or character. That defeats the purpose entirely.

Tanks are SUPPOSE to be "giant hit me" signs ... that's why they've been called tanks for decades. They're "built like tanks" ... meaning they take alot of damage.

That is their role ... that is their purpose.


Tanks are more like punishers for certain types of behavior. They have the hit me aspect to them, but each of them is designed to punish a specific type of behavior.

Roadhog - Punishes poor positioning

Zarya - Punishes high thoughtless high amounts of damage

Winston - Punishes Choosing to use too many low hp characters or leaving low hp characters in vulnerable positions

Reinhardt - Punishes attacking from one angle and expecting a easy hit at your team (Ex. Snipers or other not taking flanks)

Dva - Punishes spammy burst damage that is often shot without thought

Orisa - Punishes groups of too tightly formed heroes, as well as thoughtless Rein Charges/Doomfist attacks

They are characters that force tactical decisions from the enemy team. They are not just hit-me signs. They are "Hit-me at your own risk" signs.
Tanks in Overwatch create space for their team to exploit.

It's too bad most players don't know how to do this.
08/25/2017 02:45 PMPosted by Takoyakisan
Tanks in Overwatch create space for their team to exploit.

It's too bad most players don't know how to do this.


And how would you say they do that?

"Creating space" is well and good as a phrase, but you create it by making an area/circumstance the enemy can't step into or use without the possiblity of being punished, right?
08/25/2017 02:45 PMPosted by Takoyakisan
Tanks in Overwatch create space for their team to exploit.

It's too bad most players don't know how to do this.


Agreed. Positioning with tanks is extremely important. An over-extending tank almost always cost you a team fight. It's the least forgiving class and why they are so important. Bad tanks get EVERYONE killed. Good tanks make everyone's life much easier.
Tanks + 1 shot damage= complete meta change and no reason to play any character but tank or healer.
08/25/2017 03:00 PMPosted by harkypoo
08/25/2017 02:45 PMPosted by Takoyakisan
Tanks in Overwatch create space for their team to exploit.

It's too bad most players don't know how to do this.


Agreed. Positioning with tanks is extremely important. An over-extending tank almost always cost you a team fight. It's the least forgiving class and why they are so important. Bad tanks get EVERYONE killed. Good tanks make everyone's life much easier.


Have you ever thought that if tanks are supposed to be as you say which are giant hp, punching bags - than why not just go close to Rein or swing around the side?

That 2000 hps barrier is only 2 dimensional and can be passed with minimal trouble. Is it his 75 hp swing that makes most people think twice about that? Hence what creates the actual space.

That is how tanks create space. They give the enemy teams circumstances that punish them if they try certain tactics.
This thread is kunda fuumnny. Tanks, in all games, do massive damage. They sacrifice hitbox size, mobility and in most cases abilities. Have you guys ever played a game that has different size enemies. Guess who you never walk up to... do I even have to say it.

Also it's not a dps slot, it's an attack slot. Its more like a job description. It has nothing to do with dmg output.
08/25/2017 02:45 PMPosted by Takoyakisan
Tanks in Overwatch create space for their team to exploit.

It's too bad most players don't know how to do this.

This is it right here. Tanks in any game whether that's OW or WOW are meant to open space DPS and be heal batteries for supports.

By initiating you draw attention. Winston Dva and Rein can do this.

By being a frontliner you make space.
Rein and Orisa can do this.

By redirecting damage you keep your squishies alive. Zarya and Dva do this.

Tanks are not meant to sit there and just soak damage so that DPS have free reign. Tanks draw and absorb and redirect fire so that DPS and Supports have space to operate.

Look at an MMO tanks get up in the face of monsters and draw attention. They try to make sure the boss hits them and not their squishier allies. That doesn't mean tanks don't deal damage.

Any good tank player worth his/her health in weight does not just go and sit in front of the enemy and hope they shoot him/her. They get in their face and make sure they shoot them.
<Removed by forum moderator for toxicity> No where in his post does white knight say that every tank should be able to one hit. He just claims that post roadhog NERF none of them can. Two different statements.
Honestly, it boggles my mind that we need to have a discussion on what a tank is in gaming.

The term has been around for decades and means now what it meant back then.

"A tank (also known as a meat shield) is a style of character in gaming, often associated with a character class. A common convention in real-time strategy games, role-playing games, fighting games, multiplayer online battle arenas and MUDs, tanks redirect enemy attacks or attention toward themselves in order to protect other characters or units. Since this role often requires them to suffer large amounts of damage, they rely on large amounts of vitality or armor, healing by other party members, evasiveness and misdirection, or self regeneration.[1]"

Ever played a MMO? Ever went "bossing". What happens? Tank aggros, takes boss damage, healer heals tank, and dps deals the majority of the damage to kill thus said boss.

The definition is the same on Blizzards wiki, as it is on Wikipedia, as it on any website which defines "tanking" within games..

Skip to Overwatch and once again you have the same. Tanks are meant to minimize damage to support characters and provide lanes of attack. They focus and soak damage. They aren't suppose to be the nuclear warhead, they're the guidance and anti-air system.

To argue this is the same as arguing water is not wet. Good grief ...
08/25/2017 02:56 PMPosted by Bradly
08/25/2017 02:45 PMPosted by Takoyakisan
Tanks in Overwatch create space for their team to exploit.

It's too bad most players don't know how to do this.


And how would you say they do that?

"Creating space" is well and good as a phrase, but you create it by making an area/circumstance the enemy can't step into or use without the possiblity of being punished, right?


Adding to what you had.

To me it is more or less giving an area that your team can freely enter without fear of punishment OR an even matchup.

Main:
Rein - A 2000hp wall that can close the gap then you can A) combo with Lucio speed to fly through a choke unscathed or B) get close enough that now you have 300/200 angry German man with a 75/hit hammer swinging.

He also has the ability create a distraction via charge, which flankers can go in directly with or the rest of the team can follow up on because your opponents are now divided their attention between the two.

Winston - Similarly to Rein charge, create a diversion that your opponents now have to deal with, giving your team the opportunity to follow up by going in. Due to how mobile he is, he is also a great first responder to attack/defend.

Off:
Roadhog - The Anti-Space. 20m radius around him that is his space. Anyone that enters used to respect it. Who knows wtf he is now.

D.Va - Saving low hp teammates. Boop->punch->shotguns for quick burst damage to scare off targets. Just her presence with DM ensured opponents to be smart about their ULTs.

Zarya - Watch Dog until 40 then frontline with supports watching her. Higher charge = faster Grav = faster teamwipes. When she started to glow she became more of a threat.

Utility:
Orisa - Anchor style. Create an area that's for her and defense heroes. Not incredibly mobile, she works best to control a certain area.

All tanks have an offensive kit for a reason. A fast moving Rein coming in Hammer swinging is more of a deal with me now threat than one that's sitting casually behind his shield as long as your team is setup and ready to support.

08/25/2017 03:20 PMPosted by harkypoo
Honestly, it boggles my mind that we need to have a discussion on what a tank is in gaming.

The term has been around for decades and means now what it meant back then.

"A tank (also known as a meat shield) is a style of character in gaming, often associated with a character class. A common convention in real-time strategy games, role-playing games, fighting games, multiplayer online battle arenas and MUDs, tanks redirect enemy attacks or attention toward themselves in order to protect other characters or units. Since this role often requires them to suffer large amounts of damage, they rely on large amounts of vitality or armor, healing by other party members, evasiveness and misdirection, or self regeneration.[1]"

Ever played a MMO? Ever went "bossing". What happens? Tank aggros, takes boss damage, healer heals tank, and dps deals the majority of the damage to kill thus said boss.

The definition is the same on Blizzards wiki, as it is on Wikipedia, as it on any website which defines "tanking" within games..

Skip to Overwatch and once again you have the same. Tanks are meant to minimize damage to support characters and provide lanes of attack. They focus and soak damage. They aren't suppose to be the nuclear warhead, they're the guidance and anti-air system.

To argue this is the same as arguing water is not wet. Good grief ...


Tanks in Guild Wars never just sat and soaked up damage. They were doing damage in the process. Usually by method of returned damage to dealers or they gained stacks whenever they attacked. Sure there are tanks that just soak damage with all the mitigation skills possible, but the most effective ones were the ones that helped in the killing not the ones that just went in hit a few skills then went to go drop a deuce for the duration of the fight.
Tanks were meant to distract the enemy team by redirecting fire to them, disrupting team formations and strategies with displacement abilities (Primal Rage, Whole Hog, Mini Grav, Charge, etc.), hold objectives efficiently, and provide methods of sponging and preventing damage to your allies or yourself (barriers, Fortify, Matrix, large health pools, etc) .

They're a strategic utility that excel to an incredible extent when given lots of healing.

For example: I play lots of Orisa, and there have been times when I have been the center of attention for 3 to 4 of the enemy players, I get pocket healed by my 2 supports and keep a 1v4 battle going for well beyond a minute while my DPS and other tank finish everyone off. I may get kills on occasion, but I keep the focus and aggro away from my supports and DPS by presenting myself as more of a threat than I actually am to the enemy team, THAT is how a true tank performs.

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