Blizzard, please adopt Lucio's exploit as a feature.

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I don't know about you guys, but in competitive I've seen quite a few Lucios act like they're Tracer or Genji with the wall-ride speed bonus, only to wind up dead.

On the other hand, I've seen Lucios get top 4 in deathmatch because all they do is abuse the ridiculous speed you get from chaining wallrides to bounce around the map at the speed of light.
No. If they want to repower Lucio by increasing his speed boost off of walls, then sure, whatever. If they want to make it "skill-based", then give it a timing sweet spot.

However, the previous "mash jump as quickly as possible on a wall for extra speed" exploit needs to die and stay dead.
10/11/2017 09:05 AMPosted by SeraphLance
No. If they want to repower Lucio by increasing his speed boost off of walls, then sure, whatever. If they want to make it "skill-based", then give it a timing sweet spot.

However, the previous "mash jump as quickly as possible on a wall for extra speed" exploit needs to die and stay dead.


It's pretty annoying when people who don't play a certain hero give their opinions on them as though people should listen

This change to lucio is what clinches it, Overwatch is getting uninstalled tonight when i get home
10/11/2017 04:43 AMPosted by realmzjetter
I'm sure Genji and Widowmaker players felt the same way.

But you know what? You're special, you play a frog. You should get everything you want.

Blizzard giving Lucio or Mercy any version of their exploits should mean they give Widowmaker and Genji versions of theirs.


I don't understand how it's an exploit. Everyone can do it regardless of what button you jump with.
10/11/2017 09:05 AMPosted by SeraphLance
No. If they want to repower Lucio by increasing his speed boost off of walls, then sure, whatever. If they want to make it "skill-based", then give it a timing sweet spot.

However, the previous "mash jump as quickly as possible on a wall for extra speed" exploit needs to die and stay dead.


"Mash jump as quickly as possible" is not how it worked......
10/11/2017 02:59 AMPosted by Rokon
It is apparent that this exploit only served to make Lucio an appealing, enjoyable, and more importantly, viable healer. The speed he gained from the wallride allowed him to engage and disengage at will, making him a Healer with some offensive capability and aggression. I'm sure you have data that suggests this may pose a problem, but please look at the feedback for Lucio, or rather, the lack thereof.

Nobody had an issue with Lucio. Why? He was, arguably, the most balanced hero in the Support class, and possibly in the game. His healing and speed auras were small, and still are, but it was fine because the mobility and speed offered from wall-riding allowed him to get to heroes in a pinch, and with great practice, allowed him to be a hard to hit target. This also meant that it opened up opportunities to flank and take advantage of his Soundwave, allowing his team to take advantage of the enemy's forced repositioning or the numbers disadvantage if Lucio managed to get an environmental kill. It also gave him the opportunity to escape heroes like Genji, Tracer, D.Va and Mei. By taking advantage of the backwards wallslide, he could retreat to his team and combat a flanker, essentially peeling for himself.

Lucio's kit relies pretty heavily on his ability to wallride because that speed allowed him to get into position as needed, and to be able to piggyback heroes who needed it, to get back into the fight quicker. He is a welcome hero in any comp, and his wallride complimented a faster paced comp.

Do what Quake did, Blizzard. Adopt this bug the same way Quake adopted Rocket Jumping from DOOM, as well as bunny hopping and circle strafing. Nobody here likes the current state of Lucio, and the ones who don't know about it, would likely enjoy Lucio even more once they learn how to take advantage of it.

Nobody said Lucio needed love and attention. They said Mercy and Ana needed it. It's true. They need more love than Lucio does. He is a capable healer, and the forums are a testament to that.

Actually, I made a video a little while back when the bug was in the PTR. Lucio's speed boost bug made him feel much more smooth and fluid as a hero, but now he feels really heavy.

https://youtu.be/ACttfYtkEUI?t=1m7s


Our plan is to add some of the additional speed boost without requiring players to bind an ability to mousewheel, macro or spam.
10/11/2017 04:52 AMPosted by Schnibbi
How can you guys all be so confused?

Lucio not getting speed boost after jumping off a wall is a BUG

The fix that Geoff mentioned was that they removed the exploit where you could spam the jump button while riding of a wall to get a multiple stacked speed boost even though you just ride off of one wall. This could be archived my macros (which pressed the jump button super fast in a short amount of time) or by binding your jump button to the mouse scroll wheel which archives the same as a macro.

That's it. Nothing more, nothing less.

Lucio will still have his speed boost when he jumps of the wall, just like on the live server but not the glitchy super boost jump off a wall by exploiting a bug where you can acumulate multiple speed jumps off one single wall.

For normal Lucios who didn't exploit anything, everything should be fine.


You did not need to use mouse wheel or macros to do this. This is affecting every Lucio player regardless of what button you use to jump.
10/11/2017 09:15 AMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
10/11/2017 02:59 AMPosted by Rokon
It is apparent that this exploit only served to make Lucio an appealing, enjoyable, and more importantly, viable healer. The speed he gained from the wallride allowed him to engage and disengage at will, making him a Healer with some offensive capability and aggression. I'm sure you have data that suggests this may pose a problem, but please look at the feedback for Lucio, or rather, the lack thereof.

Nobody had an issue with Lucio. Why? He was, arguably, the most balanced hero in the Support class, and possibly in the game. His healing and speed auras were small, and still are, but it was fine because the mobility and speed offered from wall-riding allowed him to get to heroes in a pinch, and with great practice, allowed him to be a hard to hit target. This also meant that it opened up opportunities to flank and take advantage of his Soundwave, allowing his team to take advantage of the enemy's forced repositioning or the numbers disadvantage if Lucio managed to get an environmental kill. It also gave him the opportunity to escape heroes like Genji, Tracer, D.Va and Mei. By taking advantage of the backwards wallslide, he could retreat to his team and combat a flanker, essentially peeling for himself.

Lucio's kit relies pretty heavily on his ability to wallride because that speed allowed him to get into position as needed, and to be able to piggyback heroes who needed it, to get back into the fight quicker. He is a welcome hero in any comp, and his wallride complimented a faster paced comp.

Do what Quake did, Blizzard. Adopt this bug the same way Quake adopted Rocket Jumping from DOOM, as well as bunny hopping and circle strafing. Nobody here likes the current state of Lucio, and the ones who don't know about it, would likely enjoy Lucio even more once they learn how to take advantage of it.

Nobody said Lucio needed love and attention. They said Mercy and Ana needed it. It's true. They need more love than Lucio does. He is a capable healer, and the forums are a testament to that.

Actually, I made a video a little while back when the bug was in the PTR. Lucio's speed boost bug made him feel much more smooth and fluid as a hero, but now he feels really heavy.

https://youtu.be/ACttfYtkEUI?t=1m7s


Our plan is to add some of the additional speed boost without requiring players to bind an ability to mousewheel, macro or spam.
:DDDDD
>lucio is arguably the most balanced support
>has been S-tier since launch
10/11/2017 09:15 AMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
10/11/2017 02:59 AMPosted by Rokon
It is apparent that this exploit only served to make Lucio an appealing, enjoyable, and more importantly, viable healer. The speed he gained from the wallride allowed him to engage and disengage at will, making him a Healer with some offensive capability and aggression. I'm sure you have data that suggests this may pose a problem, but please look at the feedback for Lucio, or rather, the lack thereof.

Nobody had an issue with Lucio. Why? He was, arguably, the most balanced hero in the Support class, and possibly in the game. His healing and speed auras were small, and still are, but it was fine because the mobility and speed offered from wall-riding allowed him to get to heroes in a pinch, and with great practice, allowed him to be a hard to hit target. This also meant that it opened up opportunities to flank and take advantage of his Soundwave, allowing his team to take advantage of the enemy's forced repositioning or the numbers disadvantage if Lucio managed to get an environmental kill. It also gave him the opportunity to escape heroes like Genji, Tracer, D.Va and Mei. By taking advantage of the backwards wallslide, he could retreat to his team and combat a flanker, essentially peeling for himself.

Lucio's kit relies pretty heavily on his ability to wallride because that speed allowed him to get into position as needed, and to be able to piggyback heroes who needed it, to get back into the fight quicker. He is a welcome hero in any comp, and his wallride complimented a faster paced comp.

Do what Quake did, Blizzard. Adopt this bug the same way Quake adopted Rocket Jumping from DOOM, as well as bunny hopping and circle strafing. Nobody here likes the current state of Lucio, and the ones who don't know about it, would likely enjoy Lucio even more once they learn how to take advantage of it.

Nobody said Lucio needed love and attention. They said Mercy and Ana needed it. It's true. They need more love than Lucio does. He is a capable healer, and the forums are a testament to that.

Actually, I made a video a little while back when the bug was in the PTR. Lucio's speed boost bug made him feel much more smooth and fluid as a hero, but now he feels really heavy.

https://youtu.be/ACttfYtkEUI?t=1m7s


Our plan is to add some of the additional speed boost without requiring players to bind an ability to mousewheel, macro or spam.


I'm very confused on what this "spam" wallriding thing is. Because even with very few inputs it is no longer possible to stack momentum each time you jump off a wall. I could do this by tapping spacebar at a somewhat slow pace. Are you aware that this is quite possibly different?

This is effecting his speed regardless of the use of any control
10/11/2017 09:21 AMPosted by Steveck
10/11/2017 09:15 AMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
...

Our plan is to add some of the additional speed boost without requiring players to bind an ability to mousewheel, macro or spam.


I'm very confused on what this "spam" wallriding thing is. Because even with very few inputs it is no longer possible to stack momentum each time you jump off a wall. I could do this by tapping spacebar at a somewhat slow pace. Are you aware that this is quite possibly different?

This is effecting his speed regardless of the use of any control

I played several hours Monday night, and several hours last night, as Lucio. I noticed no difference in how I play, or how his speed boost or wall-jump momentum gain functions. He played the exact same both games.

If anything, it felt more consistent and controlled last night, meaning I actually did better because he did what I was expecting him to do.
So Lucio players can get his exploit for fun, but other hero mains can't get past exploits for the sake of fun? >____>

Now before you rage and insta-downvote me, I'm trying to make a point......I'm pretty sure the DBs who used the Mei-in-the-ceiling exploit during the Xmas event, were having fun being little jerk-offs to the rest of us. But their fun didn't lessen that what they were doing was using an exploit that wasn't intended.......so yeah, exploit is an exploit. The dev response is 100% on point though, adding something in-game that doesn't require exploiting couching/spam tactics is the way to go.
Taking this out of the game would be a PRIME example of what modern day Blizzard is suffering from.

Fixing this would lower Lucio's skill ceiling - and that sucks.

Star Craft was fun because of all the exploits you had to master. Even the pros would make obvious mistakes (in 20/20 hindsight or if you are watching as a spectator).

Blizzard games can be mastered by pros... and that is a good reason why they are boring to watch.

If Blizz removes the high skill cap mechanics, exploit or not, the game will continue to be boring. This among many other problems with the core design of the game.
thanks jeff
10/11/2017 09:31 AMPosted by MrE
Taking this out of the game would be a PRIME example of what modern day Blizzard is suffering from.

Fixing this would lower Lucio's skill ceiling - and that sucks.

Star Craft was fun because of all the exploits you had to master. Even the pros would make obvious mistakes (in 20/20 hindsight or if you are watching as a spectator).

Blizzard games can be mastered by pros... and that is a good reason why they are boring to watch.

If Blizz removes the high skill cap mechanics, exploit or not, the game will continue to be boring. This among many other problems with the core design of the game.


So your argument is Blizzard are bad at making games because they made a less broken game? Genius.
So Lucio players can get his exploit for fun, but other hero mains can't get past exploits for the sake of fun? >____>.


YES. And add more to the other heroes. Who wants a watered down esport? Who wants a competitive game that can be mastered?

You are asking to water down a character who has dynamic mechanics.

This sort of attitude toward balance is what is making Overwatch so dam boring to me.
You didn't have to spam though :(

The mechanic behind wallskimming is a doubletap motion, where you attach to a wall then detach from the wall between 0.20s and 0.45s but any input before 0.20s is ignored.

You can do it with literally 2 pushes of the jump button if your timing is correct.

It's a known thing going back to last year. I mean before Lucio 2.0 it didn't give the "Super Boost" but the mechanics behind the wallskim haven't changed, all that changed from Lucio 1.0 and 2.0 was the speed boost.

But suddenly it REQUIRES a Macro, spamming or Mouse Wheel.

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills here. Everyone is in such a frenzy to give their 2 cents even if they don't know what they are talking about.
On PTR he is a little better right now. I don't use mwheel or a macro or anything like that. I've got 1000 hours on Lucio and for me it's just down to timing and execution. I feel like my feet were chopped off on Live as Lucio. He feels like he weighs 100% heavier.

On PTR he DOES have a notivible slightly larger boost coming off walls. It feels better. It still feels like I'm 100% heavier. He doesn't get the same sort of 'air' coming off walls as he used to, which is ruining specific wallrides and rollouts Lucio used as their bread and butter. Now, when Lucio starts to build some momentum, he feels like he gets nudged off the wall by some small invisible particle, or a window, or general wall-clutter. When that happens, and he doesn't attach correctly (because you were mid-wallride and the only place you could attempt to attach was say a stupid window-shutter), he loses all momentum and drops like a stone.

Even on PTR he absolutely does not feel as fun to play. His wallrides feel puzzling, clumsy, clunky ans slow, when his identity is supposed to be speed and wallriding. I know this was not meant to be a nerf to Lucio players, but it feels very much like one. I know and appreciate the Dev team are working very hard on this, and I definitely am aware of their efforts. Lucio players became too reliant on what we know know was a bug, but we all thought was a feature of his kit; I thought those harder wallrides were the payoff for getting skillful at Lucio; I wasn't aware I was taking advantage of an 'exploit' or anything. But since you've removed the ability to do that, you've effectively lowered your boy's skill ceiling dramatically.

I think one of the very biggest and toughest differences on Live AND PTR right now is that somehow Lucio does not feel like he connects with the wall well at all. Lucio 1.0 had a similar feeling, where you kind of felt like you had to fight the wall to get a good solid connection sometimes, and I am so disappointed to find that's back. Wallrides that used to be possible, that had nothing to do with the wall jump-off speed, are now only possible when you leave a wall, WHIP your camera around to look DIRECTLY AT the wall you intend to attach to. Only then will Lucio connect to that wall correctly. In the past, you were able to leave a wall, and angle yourself to the new wall, all while keeping the camera pointed in whatever direction you wanted so you can continue your actions of shooting, callouts, whatever. This is crippling, especially when it is hard to get a feel for when or why it is happening. I certainly can't turn to look directly at EVERY wall I intend to skim along, but I feel like that's the only way to guarantee that I'll make that connection. Lucio was able to connect to the wall from his flank, it felt like, and now that rarely seems to happen anymore.
10/11/2017 09:34 AMPosted by Isperion
10/11/2017 09:31 AMPosted by MrE
Taking this out of the game would be a PRIME example of what modern day Blizzard is suffering from.

Fixing this would lower Lucio's skill ceiling - and that sucks.

Star Craft was fun because of all the exploits you had to master. Even the pros would make obvious mistakes (in 20/20 hindsight or if you are watching as a spectator).

Blizzard games can be mastered by pros... and that is a good reason why they are boring to watch.

If Blizz removes the high skill cap mechanics, exploit or not, the game will continue to be boring. This among many other problems with the core design of the game.


So your argument is Blizzard are bad at making games because they made a less broken game? Genius.


That is correct. Much of Blizzard's design has become stale because it is not flexible with these sorts of things. Everything core game-wise feels like it was designed by a committee, not a small group of video game enthusiasts.
10/11/2017 09:15 AMPosted by Jeff Kaplan
10/11/2017 02:59 AMPosted by Rokon
It is apparent that this exploit only served to make Lucio an appealing, enjoyable, and more importantly, viable healer. The speed he gained from the wallride allowed him to engage and disengage at will, making him a Healer with some offensive capability and aggression. I'm sure you have data that suggests this may pose a problem, but please look at the feedback for Lucio, or rather, the lack thereof.

Nobody had an issue with Lucio. Why? He was, arguably, the most balanced hero in the Support class, and possibly in the game. His healing and speed auras were small, and still are, but it was fine because the mobility and speed offered from wall-riding allowed him to get to heroes in a pinch, and with great practice, allowed him to be a hard to hit target. This also meant that it opened up opportunities to flank and take advantage of his Soundwave, allowing his team to take advantage of the enemy's forced repositioning or the numbers disadvantage if Lucio managed to get an environmental kill. It also gave him the opportunity to escape heroes like Genji, Tracer, D.Va and Mei. By taking advantage of the backwards wallslide, he could retreat to his team and combat a flanker, essentially peeling for himself.

Lucio's kit relies pretty heavily on his ability to wallride because that speed allowed him to get into position as needed, and to be able to piggyback heroes who needed it, to get back into the fight quicker. He is a welcome hero in any comp, and his wallride complimented a faster paced comp.

Do what Quake did, Blizzard. Adopt this bug the same way Quake adopted Rocket Jumping from DOOM, as well as bunny hopping and circle strafing. Nobody here likes the current state of Lucio, and the ones who don't know about it, would likely enjoy Lucio even more once they learn how to take advantage of it.

Nobody said Lucio needed love and attention. They said Mercy and Ana needed it. It's true. They need more love than Lucio does. He is a capable healer, and the forums are a testament to that.

Actually, I made a video a little while back when the bug was in the PTR. Lucio's speed boost bug made him feel much more smooth and fluid as a hero, but now he feels really heavy.

https://youtu.be/ACttfYtkEUI?t=1m7s


Our plan is to add some of the additional speed boost without requiring players to bind an ability to mousewheel, macro or spam.

Then why did you lie? Why did you say 'It's just a bug'?

The 'exploit' has sat for MONTHS and nobody's done anything about it, ever. Why only fix it 7 months down the line, when every half decent Lucio player has adapted to it?

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