Lucio PTR Bug Pushed To Live

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10/10/2017 10:42 PMPosted by Dart
PTR updated, according to Bill Warnecke, Lead Software Engineer on the Discord, there are Lucio Momentum changes!

Updating now to test!

When people say "Blizzard doesn't care", just remember a guy worked after after hours to address your guys' whining.
Hey folks we just pushed an updated PTR (1.16.0.0.40484) which includes Lúcio and Mercy changes. Geoff Goodman will post specific patch notes tomorrow. Please use this thread for additional feedback, cheers!
10/10/2017 10:47 PMPosted by Bill Warnecke
Hey folks we just pushed an updated PTR (1.16.0.0.40484) which includes Lúcio and Mercy changes. Geoff Goodman will post specific patch notes tomorrow. Please use this thread for additional feedback, cheers!


What about Ana's unscoped shots not using the right hitboxes?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMT4tMYIqyQ&feature=youtu.be

From here;
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20759258752
10/10/2017 10:47 PMPosted by Bill Warnecke
Hey folks we just pushed an updated PTR (1.16.0.0.40484) which includes Lúcio and Mercy changes. Geoff Goodman will post specific patch notes tomorrow. Please use this thread for additional feedback, cheers!


Thank you, Bill. I was getting really worked up initially.

Now, about that "additional feedback", and pardon me if this is off topic, but people are reporting that Ana's unscoped shots got a reduced hitbox. If that's true, can we see a fix on that, too? Please and thank you.
10/10/2017 01:38 PMPosted by Geoff Goodman
Let me clarify whats going on here.

Previous to this update, there was a bug that made it possible to input multiple jump commands very quickly while riding on a wall to trigger a super boost. This was only possible by binding mouse wheel to jump or potentially some other macro program to simulate this.

This exploit is now fixed, so those that were using it will notice it doesn't work anymore. This doesn't affect anyone who was using Lucio normally, only those that were abusing this bug.

That said, we are looking at possibly increasing his wall boost speed in the future to bring some of this back in a more reasonable way, but we wont be re-introducing this bug.

ooof i don't even use scroll wheel cause I'm on console but i still figured out a way to do it. Good to know I wasted 3000 comp points and 100 hours of lucio gameplay
Wow i can't believe this went live... i was super excited for the Halloween event and i was ready to buy tons of lootboxes for cool skins but i think this clinches it, i think it's time to uninstall this game now
10/10/2017 10:47 PMPosted by Bill Warnecke
Hey folks we just pushed an updated PTR (1.16.0.0.40484) which includes Lúcio and Mercy changes. Geoff Goodman will post specific patch notes tomorrow. Please use this thread for additional feedback, cheers!


The wall-ride change is not the same from what it used to be, if we acknowledge the fact that it was a exploit using double bind to jump faster. I think its need to buff the wall-ride speed from 20% to 30% with the purpose of compensating cause now its way difficult to stack speed. Meanwhile its understandable, without the double bind the mechanic feels extremely clucky and it requires a buff to be subpar to the old lucio.
Never bothered using it because it made it harder to aim while scrolling the wheel. Glad I didn't get used to it so I don't have to go through the pain of adjusting
Alright, after like 20 minutes of testing.

Made a quick and dirty gfycat, yes there is definitely acceleration stronger than live for attaching and detaching from walls.

https://gfycat.com/FrayedFortunateLeopard

BUT, it's about half the strength as it is on live. You can see it by the angle you get launched at. But since it's a 30FPS video (sorry bad PC), you'd probably be best to test it. You can definitely feel something though.

Tested about a half dozen Lucio Rollouts, can't do them. Could be human error, but in talking with some other Lucios, they are also having a hard time.

All other advanced techniques like Ramp Sliding, Bunny Hopping, Late Jumping, etc are unchanged.

Much better than live, but still worse than previous. Upping the intensity of the boost would be nice, but if it has to stay like this. I could live with this.
Why don't Blizzard just make that Lucio bug an actual feature? Quake normalized Rocket Jumping which originated from DOOM. They also took quirks from the engine like bunny hopping and air strafing and normalized them for future games, like TF2.

It's obvious Lucio was in an exceptional spot, being incredibly balanced for what it was worth. Slow AoE healing but offered immense mobility to get to players.
10/10/2017 10:47 PMPosted by Bill Warnecke
Hey folks we just pushed an updated PTR (1.16.0.0.40484) which includes Lúcio and Mercy changes. Geoff Goodman will post specific patch notes tomorrow. Please use this thread for additional feedback, cheers!


I gave Lucio a try, and while I appreciate the fact that the matter is being acknowledged, it only feels moderately better than live. His movement still feels sluggish and he feels like there is lead in his skates, just not as bad as live. Is there a way to somehow 'limit' how much this 'bug' can be 'abused'? The issue was on 144 tick servers so far as I am aware. If you can get a max velocity of X on the 144 tick and a former max velocity of Y on live, would it be possible to impose a cap on movement speed for Lucio universally at velocity Y regardless of servers? (unless modified in the custom games menu) I don't want to complain without at least providing a solution I think may work, and I am no programmer or game developer.

It has been a hard few weeks as a support/Lucio main. I am so distraught about the whole situation I'm just gonna log off the forums as at this point as I will only be restating what has already been said.

If I made any mistakes or if things aren't clear, I apologize as I am getting tired.
10/10/2017 01:38 PMPosted by Geoff Goodman
Let me clarify whats going on here.

Previous to this update, there was a bug that made it possible to input multiple jump commands very quickly while riding on a wall to trigger a super boost. This was only possible by binding mouse wheel to jump or potentially some other macro program to simulate this.

This exploit is now fixed, so those that were using it will notice it doesn't work anymore. This doesn't affect anyone who was using Lucio normally, only those that were abusing this bug.

That said, we are looking at possibly increasing his wall boost speed in the future to bring some of this back in a more reasonable way, but we wont be re-introducing this bug.
Are you actually, seriously trying to use this as an excuse?
10/10/2017 10:47 PMPosted by Bill Warnecke
Hey folks we just pushed an updated PTR (1.16.0.0.40484) which includes Lúcio and Mercy changes. Geoff Goodman will post specific patch notes tomorrow. Please use this thread for additional feedback, cheers!

Lucio gets a boost for about 0.5 of a second, probably less, and then just drops like a hammer. He's still incomparable to before the halloween patch. Please just revert the bug and we'll all forget this ever happened
Honestly I think that the Lucio just needs to go back to the exact way he was before. He's been like that for practically half the games entire lifetime, and nobody has ever complained about it. Players have gotten used to it playing as lucio, playing against lucio, OverwatchEU Twitter posted a video about it and how fun and amazing it looked and encouraged players to try it out themselves. It became one of the most fun aspects of Lucio's kit, and made him a very fun and interesting hero to watch as a spectator (just look at DSPStanky). Taking out something like that just feels wrong.

Onto more buff-type solutions, I don't think that anything would come close to being effective as simply recreating the same "bug" but maybe applying some sort of speed limit to how much speed you could gain per wall-jump (because of how higher tick servers could allow for more inputs and as such, more speed). However, keep it so that you could conserve your speed and build a bit more by skipping on walls, this could encourage players to think about interesting paths they could take off walls in order to get to where they need to be fastest, as opposed to just going off a wall once and then just slamming the mouse wheel to B-hop and keep the speed that they've gained.

The other thing is that simply making the default speed-boost higher is that the original "bug" wasn't about reaching top-speed, it was more about control, and I used mousewheel for jump for this very reason. The number of jump inputs determining your speed-boost allowed for so much control over lucios wall ride that it felt very natural and great once you got used to it. You could simply scroll down a single click or two, or press space to gently drop off of a wall, or you could scroll down as much as you could to try to get enough speed to make a large jump between 2 platforms. Rather than slamming down my scroll-wheel as fast as possible, I often found myself instead making more calculated motions, trying to scroll just fast enough so that I could have enough speed to land exactly where I wanted and not overshoot or undershoot my walljump. It was exactly this kind of control that made Lucio fun to play, If it were just the speed, the game would be full of Lucio's accidentally throwing themselves off of cliffs because they went too fast for their own good. It was really fun and rewarding to be able to quickly speed over to a wounded ally by skimming from wall to wall, but also still having enough control over yourself that you would be able to stop when you reach them and keep them in the circle without having to touch the ground.

Honestly I think that good lucio's should be allowed to reap the advantages that the "bug" supplied. It wasn't a cheap exploit that allowed for free aimlock or anything like that. It was a technique, and it was probably one of the, if not THE, hardest technique in the game to master.

From a player standpoint, I also think that the old way where it was a kind of optional thing was great as well. I mean, its a very difficult thing to control, and I'm sure some of the new, and lower skilled players will not enjoy playing it if lucio turns into some sort of ticking time bomb to them, where jumping off of the wall at the wrong point could send them hurtling uncontrollably towards the enemy team, and they likely won't have the skills necessary to recover and escape from that situation either. If you're worried about people using Macros having an unfair advantage, they wouldn't. The old speed-boost was as much about control as it was about the speed itself, meaning that scroll-wheels (something that most everyone likely has on a mouse) are more effective than using macros would be. You don't even need scroll-wheels either, I think that DSPStanky used right click as his jump bind.

I hope that you'll read through this and hopefully take some of my thoughts or ideas into account when deciding what to do with Lucio.

Thank you,
Amaterasu
EDIT: I posted this after only reading page 1. After reading the above updates that the OW guys may be re-implementing the momentum gain for Lucio, I'm prepared to retract my rage below and apologise - when it goes live. This going live during the halloween event will dictate whether I still buy those lootboxes though.

Given I had no idea I'd posted on these forums prior to now, consider this my first time going to the effort of posting.

After a single match playing Lucio without this 'bug' you leg go on for so long, I can say with near certainty I won't be playing nearly as much of him in this state, if any. He was by far my most played hero in all modes, and his jump mechanics were what made him so incredibly fun to play.

I know I'm merely one player out of many, many thousands, however this simple mechanic that could only really be abused for great advantage by much more skilled players than myself was an incredibly large aspect of why I enjoyed playing Overwatch so much. With it gone, I can see my interest in this game greatly diminishing, and I have completely gone back on my plans to purchase a reasonable amount of lootboxes for this event.

I strongly suggest you re-implement this bug "officially"; though again, I'm just one relatively average player of thousands.

My 2c
10/10/2017 01:38 PMPosted by Geoff Goodman
Let me clarify whats going on here.

Previous to this update, there was a bug that made it possible to input multiple jump commands very quickly while riding on a wall to trigger a super boost. This was only possible by binding mouse wheel to jump or potentially some other macro program to simulate this.

This exploit is now fixed, so those that were using it will notice it doesn't work anymore. This doesn't affect anyone who was using Lucio normally, only those that were abusing this bug.

That said, we are looking at possibly increasing his wall boost speed in the future to bring some of this back in a more reasonable way, but we wont be re-introducing this bug.


Did ANYONE think Lucio's movement was a problem at all, really? Even just one person, one SINGLE person. Not jumping about and being hard to hit in general, but the boost jumping off walls. An extremely fun, highly engaging, skillful aspect to his kit that has been in the game for months now with seemingly little to no complaint, why the HELL was this ever meddled with?! Why remove it, why NOW? You gave Lucio a !@#$ing rocket pack and let him run wild, then cut the fuel lines. You might as well make him walk now.
I wish I could downvote this post, but OF COURSE you disabled ratings on it.
10/10/2017 11:40 PMPosted by ErisFreya
10/10/2017 01:38 PMPosted by Geoff Goodman
Let me clarify whats going on here.

Previous to this update, there was a bug that made it possible to input multiple jump commands very quickly while riding on a wall to trigger a super boost. This was only possible by binding mouse wheel to jump or potentially some other macro program to simulate this.

This exploit is now fixed, so those that were using it will notice it doesn't work anymore. This doesn't affect anyone who was using Lucio normally, only those that were abusing this bug.

That said, we are looking at possibly increasing his wall boost speed in the future to bring some of this back in a more reasonable way, but we wont be re-introducing this bug.


Did ANYONE think Lucio's movement was a problem at all, really? Even just one person, one SINGLE person. Not jumping about and being hard to hit in general, but the boost jumping off walls. An extremely fun, highly engaging, skillful aspect to his kit that has been in the game for months now with seemingly little to no complaint, why the HELL was this ever meddled with?! Why remove it, why NOW? You gave Lucio a !@#$ing rocket pack and let him run wild, then cut the fuel lines. You might as well make him walk now.
I wish I could downvote this post, but OF COURSE you disabled ratings on it.
I was actually thinking just a few days ago, Lucio is in an absolutely perfect state and is one of the best designed heroes in the game. They've killed him. Might not play the game any more
What makes it even better is this "bug" was explicitly mentioned in the 1.10 patch notes for Lucio's rework, months ago. Literally no one complained. But yeah let's give people even less incentive to play supports. GeethxBlizzard.

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