Mercy Changes Testing on the PTR - 10/31

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when i tried out mercy on ptr i didn't realize rez was changed and i honestly thought my game crashed because it looked like she just froze and i couldn't do anything and of course i died immediately.
the casting time + nerfed movement speed feels not great at all. it honestly makes me feel like they regret making a rez ability.
it's definitely something im gonna have to get used to and work around.
Hello. I'm mercy main, who is playing in high master/low gm (gm last season). 202 hrs all competitive seasons, 52 quick play.

So first of all I want to say that these res changes are ridiculous. As I see it will really hurt mercy in all ranks. But as for master and higher we have dps-players that have not bad aim at all. And they can easily kill mercy fast if she is standing in one place. So on high ranks mercy is "mountain goat" (as Targaras said). She needs to always move fast, fly + res + jump + fly and continue moving, or she will be killed (especially in group fight). As I see this nerf gonna kill her, just because she has to stay in one place for 2 second and any good dps with voice communication or even solo can kill her.

The second point why these res changes will kill her is her ult. Now her ult is very weak and cannot protect her team from any other ult from enemy team. If her team gets in grav they will almost certainly be dead even if mercy is not in grav she can't do much against it. Also she cannot outheal focusing damage so it will mean that her team will die one by one if enemies are smart enough. So res now compensates for disadvantages of her ult. Also on mercy 1.0 you needed to ask your team to "die together", now you ask them to stick together, because you ult will be useless otherwise.

So in my opinion res should stay as it is on live or if devs want to fix problems with "switch from mercy and switch back to reset cd" they need to think about ticking cd after switch. Or as many other suggested let mercy to "earn her resurrect", it will also fix problem of having resurrect at the beginning of game.
So played the PTR Mercy a bit. I have to say, the two things together are a bit much. However, I get what you were trying to go for here.

My suggestion is this. Let's keep Mercy being the complete support hero. She is nearly useless alone, but becomes quite formidable with teammates.

So let's focus on that, as that is a core part of her character.

1) Dump Rez as an ability
2) You get two Rezzes with Valk like you do today still. Basically the Ultimate is unchanged. Well, you lose the 2 rez charges when Valk ends. This makes the usage of Valk even more strategic I think.
3) Replace Secondary Ability with a "Teleport to Teammate" ability. (You can't Teleport to Teammate while Valking, that's why you fly and GA so fast, do that :) )

I'm not sure if this is a menu where you choose, or it's a heuristic where it chooses the "safest" teammate or maybe the "furthest" teammate (that would be...interesting...when you teleport to a flanking Genji :) ), but this would really be in line with her character, that she is there to support her teammates.

I like the menu one personally because it means you have to choose, and it gives people hunting Mercy a chance to kill her before she just vanishes, but I get that may be really hard to implement.

This teleport ability solves a few problems, such as when Mercy is spawn camped or singled out. If this has ever happened to you as a Sombra or Tracer it feels NOT GOOD. You basically have to wait for a Teammate to come save you.

Teleport to Teammate also feels like a Mercy ability. She's able to fly around to her teammates, so why not teleport or a super fast Guardian Angel across the map?

And, it really emphasizes what Mercy is about, being with her Teammates.

Anyway, I don't think Rez is really balanceable except as an Ult, leave it there, just the way it is today.

That's my 2 cents :)
11/06/2017 01:45 PMPosted by jasonwocky
I remember when Resurrect required her to stand stationary and without invulnerability, and kept her teammates immobile for 3 full seconds. Every part of that was patched out gradually, because using Resurrect meant virtually certain death for her, and frequently for her team. This change will be a return to that.


Except back then it was her Ultimate. Now it's not, and it should stop being as impactful as one.

Mercy used to have mass Rez for the end of a fight. What this patch has shown is that tempo rez at the start of the fight is just as strong, and it needs a real nerf. Not just an accounting trick where Mercy "earns" her 30s res by hiding behind a shield and holding left click, which is what she is already doing anyway. The "resource bar" proposal does nothing to change the fact that Mercy will remain 100% the most important priority target at all phases of every match of Overwatch, and that's a BS situation for the rest of the heroes to live in.

Mercy needs a hard nerf. Not because she deserves to be underpowered. But because the game cannot withstand another competitive season with her being so ridiculously overpowered. If this nerf is truly too much, she can be given buffs later. As this latest patch has shown, there's no way to really understand the balance implications of a change until it's on live for awhile.


Putting a resource meter on her Rez forces her to actively participate. If you kill a target before she can get any real healing on them, it delays obtaining Rez. In otherwords it rewards proper target prioritization with delaying Mercy's rez.

Having Mercys Rez on a resource meter stops her from having it early in the game. That combined with making it dependant on how much she is contributing means it is a direct hard nerf to the reliable availability of Rez.

Mercy's kit has always been poor return wise purely because it was made as a means to let her get her Rez, and has been balanced around her Rez being so insanely powerful. If Rez takes a hard nerf, she overall will need a hard buff to everything else just to make her not feel anemic and woefully under equiped. If they do that though, then her pistol becomes too powerful, or her damage boost brings back one shots again, or she becomes so slippery movement wise that no one can kill her, or has too much health/regen to be killed.

Even with her entire kit being on the bleeding edge of being too powerful, she still is almost completely undesirable without her Rez because all of those abilities do not change the fact that she does very little else besides reliable healing at lower potential than the other main healer, high mobility to allow fluid use of Rez, and self healing to patch herself up from a complete lack of any other way to do so and the expectation she will get pinged with shots because she has such a high value skill that she is a high value target.

My suggestion has and will continue to be either a resource meter for Rez that you have to build, or keep her Rez on a set timer that also requires building a resource meter that determines how much health the target comes back with. The resource meter tied to health the target is Rezed with creates a need for Mercy to be aware of the environment more then before to prevent the target from instantly dying again, and it should have a minimum to use the skill so that you are FORCED to be involved and supporting but has clear benefit when doing more of it, and has a maximum value (something like 200) so that you have to be engaged and doing stuff to earn the Rez, you can't bring back a full health tank for insane sustainability, and retain a recast timer so that it absolutely cannot be used more than a certain frequency but due to the resource bar can absolutely still be unavailable if you are not doing your job and are instead off hiding somewhere.

On top of this, it can be set so that a 75-100 hp Rez is all that is available after 30 seconds of straight healing so that it overall is far weaker return wise, but if you bank the Rez and save it for a key moment you can get more value out of it.

The idea of a minimum/maximum limit on a resource bar that revives a target with respective health in addition to a recast timer solves literally every ones problems with Rez.

Unless the real problem people have with Rez is that people don't want Mercy to be able to Rez. At that point the only solution is to admit ones bias and admit the source of that persons discontent is that they just hate Mercy because she is Mercy.
Gonna give my feedback on this patch because I have no where else to vent.

The new Mercy is just simply AWFUL not only was her play style totally wrecked but it completely ruins her as a hero. I've played her for 300+ hours climbed my way from plat to master. I accepted the "2.0" changes and honestly started to think she was perfectly balanced.. then this.

Why!? Who complained so much that you thought she needed another nerf!? Seriously, her play style is all about being swift and in motion and this stupid idiotic (words that would get me permabanned) idea of slowing her down in the crisis of a battle is the furthest thing from that. Not only was she a high target during 1.0 but after 2.0 her rezes were more frequent and thus her presence was more noted by the dps. NOW the DPS are literally getting their hand held trying to kill the Mercy!! ITS INSANE!!! I played a few matches, didn't have much of a issue (yet) but the first time I rezzed I thought my game was crashing! It literally feels like a bug, simply awful. BLIZZARD you are single handily destroying Mercy with each new patch you release.

I'm scared to even just look at the forums because I'm scared I'm going see "Mercy patch" knowing that whatever I'm about to read is going to force me to change the way I play my favorite hero. I know other true Mercy mains who like me accepted the 2.0 changes will absolutely hate this I'm sure they have already voiced their opinions and I'm here to stand with them. "Valkyrie has no rez cooldown to help balance though" that's BS! If you're truly playing Mercy right 2 rezzes was the perfect amount because you shouldn't be letting more than 3 people die otherwise you should loose that fight.

This easily tops the most ridiculous thing to happen to Mercy since all these changes. I can't believe this got approved by whatever board/group has to approve patches. Explain to me how you guys thought slowing down a primary healer with no ways of defending herself so much that the blind could kill her was a good idea.Could of made the rez cooldown a minute or anything else please I don't care just get rid of this movement penalty I feel like Mei's following me. I love Blizzard you guys do awesome work but you can't always cater to the DPS especially like this it's just straight madness.

Thanks Blizzard, no really... thank you for straight wrecking Mercy:(
Here's some things I think should be done to add a balance with these changes. I have made a post about it but I thought it would be a good idea to spread it around.

1. Reduced the movement slow down to either 50% or 25% maybe even 35% for middle ground. 75 is way too much and makes it impossible to save yourself. By doing so this would ensure you can run away but still have a higher chance of being killed.

2. Keep the cast time but set it to 1.25 seconds as this makes a balance of danger and a chance to get to safety.

And finally 3. When her resurrect is cancelled make it so that either she can use her resurrect again or add a 5 second cool down to make it fair.
If I have read well, the Mercy's situation is so terrible that I don't know if really Blizzard wants all Mercy players to fall down to bronze having a bunch of toxic dpss mains moking and yelling "You deserve that, !@#$ing scum" all the time around the game, subreddit, videos and forums, or what. They are making the character really unplayable.

Why I say this? It seems that even EeveeA, the #1 world Mercy has fallen out of t500 after all these changes. It's affecting all ranks, not only lowers. This rework has failed, just admit it, Blizzard. Revert and tweak. Add Valkirie as an E ability or do some kind of mix between current and old Mercy, but these blind nerfs must stop now. This rework must be reverted or reworked.

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20759179392?page=132#post-2636
An overkill, I'd say. Mercy is fairly easy to kill while she dives into the rez. Unnecessary.
Somebody found an interview with Jeff posted Nov 3. He makes some comments about Mercy.

Kaplan:
And we don’t want her to be the resurrect bot that’s just erasing kills.

Kaplan: I think it would be unfortunate if we got to that place, where we just gave up on the ability. I do think it’s really cool. It feels great to be resurrected. It’s such a play style change. At first, your first instinct — if you’ve played a lot of Mercy, your instinct is to play it the old way. You’ll guardian angel into some 6v1 and hit your button and be like, “Oh, that was a big mistake.” It takes a big adjustment. But once you do adjust, there’s some really cool gameplay now. Suddenly a Reinhardt shield or an Orisa shield or ducking behind the payload, these become very interesting strategic choices.


Can we talk about how genuinely mean it is to call the hero a Res bot? Like, even if you disagree with the style in which the hero is played, for someone who represents the game to call her something like that is pretty jerky. At least he's expressed that she'll continue to be tweaked though, as long as they perceive her state as problematic.

It's also very interesting how much focus is being placed on how it feels for everyone else when Res is used. It feels good to be ressed, so they just tweaked it so it only felt bad for the Mercy. I will admit, getting a normal 2sec Res off in PTR is satisfying, but only because I finally got to use the ability when every situation prior was a death sentence I didn't take. It doesn't feel good to crouch behind cover for 2 seconds even if that is the only way to use part of her kit. Even if it is a good strategic opportunity, it sucks to be hidden and stationary for that long when I want to be flying around healing.
i'm just going to keep saying it. don't nerf a thing about mercy. rez needs direct counter play.
dying with anna nade or discord on you makes you un-rezzable.
it makes zen and anna strong counters to mercy if used right.

also people, stop saying "im sick of my main constantly being changed" on one hand, and "her ult sucks and needs to be changed" or "revert rez back to being her ult, it was fine" on the other.
11/06/2017 04:23 PMPosted by Reverendpaqo
Putting a resource meter on her Rez forces her to actively participate.

A/K/A the reward Mercy for doing the thing she is already doing anyway plan.

If you kill a target before she can get any real healing on them, it delays obtaining Rez. In otherwords it rewards proper target prioritization with delaying Mercy's rez.

See how that works for you when you're trying to get past the first choke on any 2CP map. Hint: it won't.

Having Mercys Rez on a resource meter stops her from having it early in the game. That combined with making it dependant on how much she is contributing means it is a direct hard nerf to the reliable availability of Rez.

No, it's not. Because she's going to be building up that resource meter anyway, and "how much she is contributing" is simply a question of "how much she is holding down left click", whether it's for damage or for healing. Torbjorn doesn't get scrap from building turrets and shooting at stuff. He has to go gather it from the battlefield. Giving Mercy a "resource" for doing the same thing that every Mercy player is already doing is no sort of "direct nerf".

Mercy's kit has always been poor return wise purely because it was made as a means to let her get her Rez, and has been balanced around her Rez being so insanely powerful. If Rez takes a hard nerf, she overall will need a hard buff to everything else just to make her not feel anemic and woefully under equiped.

You're talking about Mercy 1.0. Mercy 2.0 is insanely overpowered at the moment. Everybody, including the OW devs but aside from a few Mercy mains, knows it. She needs a hard nerf. Then she might need a small buff. I'm fully prepared to believe that. But the nerf has to be shown to be hard enough first.

That said, I think her kit is silly. "Pure healer" is a silly archetype for Overwatch, and I think the game would be better overall if every healer was a hybrid. But a lot of people like it and as long as they can make it actually balanced, I don't have a problem with it.

The resource meter tied to health the target is Rezed with creates a need for Mercy to be aware of the environment more then before

So does the current PTR patch, only it's better, since she'll learn much faster what the difference is between good and bad rezzes. Good Mercies will still pull of great rezzes, and will get more SR because of it. Mercies that give up on E because they can't manage the risk and hold all their rez charges for Valkyrie will get less SR and fall, and that's awesome.

Unless the real problem people have with Rez is that people don't want Mercy to be able to Rez.

A lot of people don't like Rez. I agree with Jeff: it would be a shame to see it go, but it feels lousy from the other side. It needs to feel earned. Ultimately if it has to go, it has to go.

At that point the only solution is to admit ones bias and admit the source of that persons discontent is that they just hate Mercy because she is Mercy.

That's your opinion. I like Mercy; I always have. I played 1.0 more than any other support. But I don't like Rez very much. You consider those things one and the same, apparently, and so do some of your cohorts. That's your problem though, not mine. I personally think she can and should be a fun character to play, but that may or may not involve rez.
11/06/2017 01:45 PMPosted by jasonwocky
I remember when Resurrect required her to stand stationary and without invulnerability, and kept her teammates immobile for 3 full seconds. Every part of that was patched out gradually, because using Resurrect meant virtually certain death for her, and frequently for her team. This change will be a return to that.


Mercy used to have mass Rez for the end of a fight. What this patch has shown is that tempo rez at the start of the fight is just as strong, and it needs a real nerf. Not just an accounting trick where Mercy "earns" her 30s res by hiding behind a shield and holding left click, which is what she is already doing anyway. The "resource bar" proposal does nothing to change the fact that Mercy will remain 100% the most important priority target at all phases of every match of Overwatch, and that's a BS situation for the rest of the heroes to live in.

Mercy needs a hard nerf. Not because she deserves to be underpowered. But because the game cannot withstand another competitive season with her being so ridiculously overpowered. If this nerf is truly too much, she can be given buffs later. As this latest patch has shown, there's no way to really understand the balance implications of a change until it's on live for awhile.


I am not sure what we think will happen if Mercy is a popular healer choice in another comp season that will somehow break it? Like, Tempo Resses are strong because they fit the pacing of a match better than Mass Res. That doesn't mean the game is broken, it means a support can do her job better than before and make a fight easier for her team. Yes, that involves making the fight harder for the enemy, but each team has that same advantage and I didn't see anyone really doing any better or worse for having/playing Mercy. It just changed the meta. Now, if you want to suggest that is what is breaking things, then say that, but it would apply to the Ana meta, the Lucio/Zen meta, and every other meta that gets forced on us by hero changes as well.

I am also not sure why having the main healer be the number one priority target is not fair for other heroes? If Mercy isn't the priority, it will be Ana or Zen. The healers are the priority first, and that is how it works. Mercy's priority over other supports is to prevent Res, because that is how you counter that ability: by prioritizing her. It's the same with other heroes, but usually to a lesser degree: "kill the Zarya, she has high charge" for example.
There's a lot of comments to go through, so apologies if this suggestion has already been brought up. The idea of adding a cast time is something I'm fine with, it gives Mercy more think about when it comes to deciding when/who to raise and also less pressure on them when their team demands them to do a poor move (I get tired of people salting because I decided not to raise them when they're all the way in enemy territory, far from the team).

But, I think other areas should be considered as the added cast time, slow movement, enemies being able to cancel the rez, on top of a very long CD time for resurrect makes it very punishing and I feel in the long run, won't be fun to play around with.

If a cast time is added, with the slow movement and enemies being able to cancel it hindering you, lower the CD time on Resurrect to compensate please.
11/06/2017 05:14 PMPosted by Enigmandi
I am not sure what we think will happen if Mercy is a popular healer choice in another comp season that will somehow break it?

"A popular healer choice" you say. How amazingly drole. Mercy 1.0 was "a popular healer choice" in something like 60% of games. Phrasing a hero that's picked 99.5% of the time, on both sides, in all tiers of competitive and pro play as "a popular hero" is pretty much the understatement of the year.

Many people that are playing Mercy actually hate playing Mercy. They do it anyway because a) she's OPAF and b) SR loss is painful. Can you not see how problematic that is for the game?

Sorry, I had to stop reading the rest of your argument after that one. "What will happen if she is a popular healer choice" again, indeed. SMH.
11/06/2017 04:57 PMPosted by dethpandemic
i'm just going to keep saying it. don't nerf a thing about mercy. rez needs direct counter play.
dying with anna nade or discord on you makes you un-rezzable.
it makes zen and anna strong counters to mercy if used right.

also people, stop saying "im sick of my main constantly being changed" on one hand, and "her ult sucks and needs to be changed" or "revert rez back to being her ult, it was fine" on the other.


I worry about those abilities, with their short cds, making Res unusable. I think it's an interesting idea that creates a kind of rock-paper-scissors between the supports, but it would need a lot of tweaking and I am not sure the community would be happy about it since people would actually have to play support [/sarcasm].

In regards to the second, I can translate: "Stop changing my main to things I don't like, I want 1.0 back, don't change her unless it is to that." Which is understandable, people enjoy her a certain way and are now sad that they may never get to play Mercy in that way ever again. It is truly really sad when you can't play the game the way you used to love, but I think there is a lot of potential to find joy in the character moving forward, we just need to use our resources here in the forums properly and productively.
11/06/2017 05:19 PMPosted by jasonwocky
11/06/2017 05:14 PMPosted by Enigmandi
I am not sure what we think will happen if Mercy is a popular healer choice in another comp season that will somehow break it?

"A popular healer choice" you say. How amazingly drole. Mercy 1.0 was "a popular healer choice" in something like 60% of games. Phrasing a hero that's picked 99.5% of the time, on both sides, in all tiers of competitive and pro play as "a popular hero" is pretty much the understatement of the year.

Many people that are playing Mercy actually hate playing Mercy. They do it anyway because a) she's OPAF and b) SR loss is painful. Can you not see how problematic that is for the game?

Sorry, I had to stop reading the rest of your argument after that one. "What will happen if she is a popular healer choice" again, indeed. SMH.


Lucio has been an S tier hero every season but one. Are we gonna pretend like that is balanced? I am saying that a portion of a single season is not going to destroy it. That is an overstatement. Balance is coming, we don't need to pretend like the game will spontaneously explode because Mercy is the must-pick instead of Ana. She became meta for the first time in a long time, it was just overdone at the start, since she wasn't tuned properly.

You still haven't presented an argument, unless you count 1.) stating she is OP with no support for why or in what ways and 2.) generalizing that people hate playing her. I have heard more positive feedback on this newest iteration than I ever did for Mercy 1.0. Her popularity may have increased because she is more fun. Reinhardt was a necessary hero for a while, but didn't see a rise in usage until Ana could nano him and he could actually have fun and kill things. People who didn't play Mercy before are now playing her and enjoying it. I haven't seen any poll or anything to accurately judge the overall %, but for the most part, feedback seems to be more positive than negative.
11/06/2017 05:26 PMPosted by Enigmandi
Lucio has been an S tier hero every season but one. Are we gonna pretend like that is balanced?

Are we gonna pretend like Lucio has had anywhere near even a 50% pick rate in Bronze through Diamond for the past year? In Grandmaster he barely broke 60%. Once again I can't even get past your first two sentences.
11/06/2017 05:26 PMPosted by Enigmandi
You still haven't presented an argument, unless you count 1.) stating she is OP with no support for why or in what ways and

I don't need to, since the developers seem to agree with me. Hence the patch. I guess your job is to prove that she's not OP with support for why and in what ways.
I haven't seen any poll or anything to accurately judge the overall %, but for the most part, feedback seems to be more positive than negative.

ROFL. Half of the Mercy mains downvoting me want her reverted altogether. I think you might want to put together that poll.
The cast time with the movement reduction WITH the interruption WITH the complete CD timer on res is wayyyy too far.

I agree with what's been said before, and in this thread that res should be, and should have always been, changed to a resource meter and part of her ult kit. Making it a resource meter forces her to engage to charge her res, gives her enemies ample time to understand her res potential, as well as allowing her the potential to make big plays when played smartly.

PTR Mercy has none of these capabilities. She can't make plays. She can only follow her teammates around and do what their positioning allows her to do.

Honestly, I only bought this game for Mercy. I only played this game for Mercy. And now, I have a shell of what used to be Mercy. I don't know how much longer I can enjoy this game. Compound that with the fact that I feel like no one at Blizzard cares what the support players have to say, only what the DPS players think is unfair.

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