Lack of Blizzard response on lower ranks (Season 8)

Competitive Discussion
To start this right off the bat, I am personally not feeling the same excitement as the more higher tiered players are. I am feeling glad that they are getting something that should benefit their games, but I am personally stuck down below Diamond and I am personally not sure how these changes help benefit the rest of the ladder.

That's what bugs me so much. There isn't really an explanation as to how this benefits those who are Platinum and below. Only theories as to how it helps us from players who think they know when really it's just theorycrafting. Not to mention that they said that they are limiting the skill variance between teams and yet they are going to keep the SR gap the same. (1K for Bronze-Diamond, 500 for Masters, and 250 for GM which is recently changed)

Again, not saying that these changes aren't impactful. They certainly are impactful for those players who are in the Top 28%, but as for everybody else? We're kind of left with uncertainty as if nothing changed or if it's actually going to get worse because of these changes.

There are theories being thrown around that this is going to make the border of Plat-Diamond so bad as it would be filled with throwers, One-Tricks, Smurfs, etc. I also heard that these changes are good for the lower ranks because it would "move" the Smurfs to those higher ranks where they belong and keep them out of the lower ranked games, but that's also a theory.

The main takeaway from this is that we do not know what exactly Blizzard intended for the lower ranked players with these changes. They haven't explained how it benefits us; only explained about the higher ranked play. Other than the fact that they didn't lessen the SR gap for Bronze-Diamond to be 500 instead of 1,000, this is what drives me crazy the most. Blizzard, I really would love to know your thoughts about this. How does this benefit the rest of us? Does it actually help or does it just gives us nothing and it forces the community into a Caste system, making us play the game differently on playing for stats like it always has been instead of playing for the win?

Because right now, this Personal SR system is part of the toxicity problem and why there are so many DPS players since trying to get good stats as Tanks is really friggin' difficult as you're competing for those same stats with your fellow DPS and Support mains if you're Roadhog.
The Plat-low diamond will be a Hell next season. No way it is gonna work, the correct move is use role selection with scoreboard in the games, because you can track your teammates and enemies. But if they use a simple scoreboard it will not work to, this thing need to be complex.

And for the groups. I think they should use 500 SR diference, but with and avarege SR win/loss. Because is not fair that 2 or more ppl that always plays together won’t be able to play always together. And Blizzard should track ppl for elo job.
12/10/2017 06:26 AMPosted by Fellen
The Plat-low diamond will be a Hell next season. No way it is gonna work, the correct move is use role selection with scoreboard in the games, because you can track your teammates and enemies. But if they use a simple scoreboard it will not work to, this thing need to be complex.

And for the groups. I think they should use 500 SR diference, but with and avarege SR win/loss. Because is not fair that 2 or more ppl that always plays together won’t be able to play always together. And Blizzard should track ppl for elo job.


I do think it is time for an actual scoreboard, but I really do think that people shouldn't be able to see who has what medals in the middle of a match as it doesn't tell the full story of what's going on and not to mention Gold medals are just worthless to begin with. It just leads to confrontation and toxicity.
Good post man. The force win and losses that people see will continue, people will not be happy imo. but I will stay positive, maybe it is fix
12/10/2017 06:45 AMPosted by AlexNight
12/10/2017 06:26 AMPosted by Fellen
The Plat-low diamond will be a Hell next season. No way it is gonna work, the correct move is use role selection with scoreboard in the games, because you can track your teammates and enemies. But if they use a simple scoreboard it will not work to, this thing need to be complex.

And for the groups. I think they should use 500 SR diference, but with and avarege SR win/loss. Because is not fair that 2 or more ppl that always plays together won’t be able to play always together. And Blizzard should track ppl for elo job.


I do think it is time for an actual scoreboard, but I really do think that people shouldn't be able to see who has what medals in the middle of a match as it doesn't tell the full story of what's going on and not to mention Gold medals are just worthless to begin with. It just leads to confrontation and toxicity.


That is why I think it should be a complex scoreboard. Sometimes I play as a healer and I started to get solo ults so I basically I watch the game for more than a minute. And that is not total fair to put in a score board just show how many times I die, but if I play soldier and lost a 1v1 against the other every time yeah it should be bad. And need to show things like Dmg block if you are playing with a Rein. Like they you see your stats not only Dmg, healing, kills and deaths.

Yesterday I play a game as a healer that our junk was blaming me and the other healer to not get enough heals. And being toxic and abusive in the chat.
In a point that our tank that was a Hog, asking him to stop that because he was gold Dmg, but bronze healing. And wasn’t our foult.
With a scoreboard that will never happens.
This is a big F.U to lower tier flex players, when i'm flexing to that solo tank or solo heal i'm not gonna get the stats of a ... main player so i get less sr for a win and lose more sr for a loss. I was allready playing way less comp after S5's troll fest, and now blizzard kinda says ''nah team comp in lower tiers dont matter, go ahead play what ever you want the less meta the more reward'' and to make it even more impossible for you to climb the ladder we get the the trolls who will drop from the higher ranks... good luck. Competitive died with season 4 for me.
12/10/2017 06:26 AMPosted by Fellen
The Plat-low diamond will be a Hell next season. No way it is gonna work, the correct move is use role selection with scoreboard in the games, because you can track your teammates and enemies. But if they use a simple scoreboard it will not work to, this thing need to be complex.

And for the groups. I think they should use 500 SR diference, but with and avarege SR win/loss. Because is not fair that 2 or more ppl that always plays together won’t be able to play always together. And Blizzard should track ppl for elo job.


Just a scoreboard in the games or at the end of it would do wonders
Look. plats and below will STAY THE SAME so if u are good enough then u will climb thanks to the bonus performance sr gain! if u are stuck in there NOW then u will be stuck next season too unless u improve!
12/10/2017 07:53 AMPosted by ŎŖȈŜǞĊȖȐŜȄ
Look. plats and below will STAY THE SAME so if u are good enough then u will climb thanks to the bonus performance sr gain! if u are stuck in there NOW then u will be stuck next season too unless u improve!


With selfish play maybe, but if you solo tank or solo heal you're the first to die.
So i should just play the 5th or 6th dps?
12/10/2017 06:11 AMPosted by AlexNight
To start this right off the bat, I am personally not feeling the same excitement as the more higher tiered players are. I am feeling glad that they are getting something that should benefit their games, but I am personally stuck down below Diamond and I am personally not sure how these changes help benefit the rest of the ladder.

That's what bugs me so much. There isn't really an explanation as to how this benefits those who are Platinum and below. Only theories as to how it helps us from players who think they know when really it's just theorycrafting. Not to mention that they said that they are limiting the skill variance between teams and yet they are going to keep the SR gap the same. (1K for Bronze-Diamond, 500 for Masters, and 250 for GM which is recently changed)

Again, not saying that these changes aren't impactful. They certainly are impactful for those players who are in the Top 28%, but as for everybody else? We're kind of left with uncertainty as if nothing changed or if it's actually going to get worse because of these changes.

There are theories being thrown around that this is going to make the border of Plat-Diamond so bad as it would be filled with throwers, One-Tricks, Smurfs, etc. I also heard that these changes are good for the lower ranks because it would "move" the Smurfs to those higher ranks where they belong and keep them out of the lower ranked games, but that's also a theory.

The main takeaway from this is that we do not know what exactly Blizzard intended for the lower ranked players with these changes. They haven't explained how it benefits us; only explained about the higher ranked play. Other than the fact that they didn't lessen the SR gap for Bronze-Diamond to be 500 instead of 1,000, this is what drives me crazy the most. Blizzard, I really would love to know your thoughts about this. How does this benefit the rest of us? Does it actually help or does it just gives us nothing and it forces the community into a Caste system, making us play the game differently on playing for stats like it always has been instead of playing for the win?

Because right now, this Personal SR system is part of the toxicity problem and why there are so many DPS players since trying to get good stats as Tanks is really friggin' difficult as you're competing for those same stats with your fellow DPS and Support mains if you're Roadhog.


Players below diamond are very unreliable. The players in low ranks have lot issues with them would not be solved by removing performance based Sr system. A win|loss system isn’t going to improve bad aim, poor positioning, lack of communication, 10 year olds squeaky voice, no awareness of sorroundings, dumb ideas, playing heroes completely the wrong way. Example: gold level Winston chasing tracer while ignoring the widow maker that is sniping his supports.

In the higher ranks, it’s easier to just focus on winning when everyone knows their roles and focusing on the objectives. In gold rank people don’t know that they are playing the game wrong. The support player who is trying to solo heal as Zen doesn’t grasp how detrimental his decision is to the rest of the team. That his heal are too slow in the heat of battle and that his tank players would most likely have to retreat to find med pack. Saw this crap all the time in gold. It’s the reason I’m stopped maining Winston. You can’t trust them to have your back even when they are trying to help you.

Without performance SR to help ya climb away from these players, the one trick ponies and trolls will be the least of your problems. The worst players are the ones who aren’t conscious of all the poor decisions th that they are making.
You have to read between the lines, Blizs responds is pretty clear:

Git Gud.

Specifically if your good enough you can get to diamond, where all thats important is winning the game.

I will admit I an not good enough (yet...) - time for you to do the same.
12/10/2017 07:53 AMPosted by ŎŖȈŜǞĊȖȐŜȄ
Look. plats and below will STAY THE SAME so if u are good enough then u will climb thanks to the bonus performance sr gain! if u are stuck in there NOW then u will be stuck next season too unless u improve!


The thing about the SR system is that you're competing with not only your team, but the enemy team as well on stats. It's not easy going for stats as a main Tank or even as a Tank in general that isn't Roadhog. You have to play in a manner that forces you to be less on the offensive and if you try to get more stats, it usually means you're not doing things like putting your shield up less often which is more important for the DPS that are better at securing kills than you as a Tank.
12/10/2017 07:53 AMPosted by ŎŖȈŜǞĊȖȐŜȄ
Look. plats and below will STAY THE SAME so if u are good enough then u will climb thanks to the bonus performance sr gain! if u are stuck in there NOW then u will be stuck next season too unless u improve!

Its impossible to climb without a six stack team of reliable players fyi.
12/10/2017 10:03 AMPosted by Gibberish
You have to read between the lines, Blizs responds is pretty clear:

Git Gud.

Specifically if your good enough you can get to diamond, where all thats important is winning the game.

I will admit I an not good enough (yet...) - time for you to do the same.


Or perhaps it could be... "we care about the pros, popular content creators and streamers who we've now noticed have started complaining about competitive play and as such might have an impact on our reputation for newcomers who may buy the game". ;)

The fact there's been no reasoning given so far for why platinum and below still remains untouched in a number of ways, such as the SR gap for players in some tiers in groups still remaining at a ludicrous 1000 SR, isn't really a good sign at all that they care about platinum or lower.
TBH, each rank has its own specific problems, including Masters and GM. It's just that I really don't believe that Masters and GM have it so rough when they only have to deal with people that are within their SR range which is 500 for Masters and 250 for GM. With everywhere else though, you see a large variation in terms of quality on not only your team, but the enemy team as well. This is largely due to the 1,000 SR gap and that personally is my biggest frustration with this mode.

I know I sound like a broken record when it comes to this (And I'm sorry about that), but I can't help but feel disappointed that Blizzard didn't change the SR gap for Bronze-Diamond for Season 8.
You have to consider why the performance-based SR system exists in the first place. It is designed to more quickly calibrate people to the correct SR. So, if you are way better than your SR, you will consistently dominate individually and will gain more SR on wins and lose less SR on losses. You will climb quickly.

At what ranks is this most important? Lower ranks. These are the ranks where smurfs can farm easy wins most egregiously. Without performance-based SR changes, smurfs would climb substantially less quickly, and therefore would basically wreck substantially more games before getting to their true rank.

Yes, smurfs exist at higher levels too, but I think the logic is that once you get diamond and above, a smurf isn't really wrecking the game, because the smurf isn't SO much better than everyone else that it just makes the game trivial. In that situation, it's worth prolonging how long smurfs stay below their real rank in order to have the benefit of encouraging real team play as opposed to stat padding.
Yes that's all well and good, but what about the issues like one tricks trying to stat pad the performance based system instead of working as a team? If smurfs are really the reason behind this, which I have doubts on, there are quite a few other ways they could go about tackling that.

One good idea which was mentioned recently was to have it so the first X many matches ever played on competitive, or perhaps that season, are performance based SR (after that it's non-performance based SR).
12/10/2017 12:53 PMPosted by MagicTurtle
You have to consider why the performance-based SR system exists in the first place. It is designed to more quickly calibrate people to the correct SR.


Funny, I always thought that was the job of the placement matches.

The main problem with performance-based SR is that it rewards one-tricks and punishes hero-switching, which I've heard should be considered an important element of the game.

And as for the 1000 SR group cap: that is just bad as well. Wanna play with your friends? Play Arcade or QP. In comp, even at lower ranks, the limit should be 500 SR max, better yet 250 for all tiers.

Also, role select: please make it happen.
I was really excited about the SR change up until the moment they said it would only affect diamond and above. I would really like to play Overwatch competitively, but I really don't want to have to slog through literally 2K SR to get to a point where people are actually motivated by winning instead of just cheesing the SR system to climb.
I hope they bring the new sr system to low ranks too.
They first might want to look at how it going to work on live so they decide diamond+.

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