Is there anyway to justify dual snipers?

Competitive Discussion
12/12/2017 03:46 PMPosted by OMeiGA
Im starting to report it, and autolocking DPS to prevent it. I've become what I hate to prevent what I hate most.


Eventually you will become an instalocking Hanzo main. Because the way to avoid a bad Hanzo on your team is for YOU to be that Hanzo.
12/12/2017 04:18 PMPosted by Oatmeal
12/12/2017 03:05 PMPosted by Tootheddirk
We saw a few dual sniper comps in owl preseason... Junkertown offense is justifiable.


Are you comparing pros to plat widow/hanzos who miss 9/10 shots? Lol.


I'll have you know!, I only miss 2/3 of my shots!!
I've had some fun games with 3dps comps with junkrat+double sniper. The mine throws people in the air and if the widow is decent she can pick these targets that are often in her one body shot hp range. Hanzo offers mobile anti-tank damage and crowd control on top of junkrat's grenades, too. The idea was basically that I rustled their jimmies with junkrat, hanzo got tanks and widow had easy pickings on a deorganised defense. All the while we had 3dps that were hard to hit being able to use cover efficiently or standing far back. This probably mostly works vs slow defensive teams that try to turtle up, dive would take this apart.
I mean it just depends. I has a hanzo and widow on my team the other day and they had the enemy team on lock. They did what they where suppose to do we ended up winning the game because of them doing so well.
The main issue with dual snipers, or even single sniper, is the skill of the player using them. Most people think they are a god with a sniper and have a 20% accuracy.
It all depends on rank.

Yes, I said it.

Sub platinum shouldn't even be allowed to select snipers. They can play McRee to get snap-to-head hitscan skills. They don't have to select duo sniper.
12/12/2017 02:49 PMPosted by pzero24
You're crazy to tilt no matter what. Tilting does not help the team. It usually just makes everyone pissed off and guarantee's a loss. So for everyone's sake, just keep your cool man. It's just a game after all. Unless you are getting paid to play it, stop worrying so much about it.


To be fair unless the enemy team goes full potato a double sniper team does tend to mean a guaranteed loss with probably half of the team angry.

12/12/2017 02:41 PMPosted by polishpimp
Am I crazy to tilt if I see a widow and hanzo dual lock on my team?


Honestly I just point out in chat that we're going to have to play around picks because double sniper is so reliant on it and that you probably can't push in until your team has 2+ picks on the enemy team. More often than not one of the snipers will realize how dumb it is and how much pressure there will be for them to perform and they switch off. All without you criticizing anybody.
12/12/2017 02:41 PMPosted by polishpimp
Am I crazy to tilt if I see a widow and hanzo dual lock on my team?


Just imagine what Flow3r + Wraxu would do as a duo.

Yeah, I just pooped a bit in my pants as well.

Play the game, worry less about others unless something is going wrong then fix it.
12/13/2017 07:49 AMPosted by CultofZAL
12/12/2017 02:41 PMPosted by polishpimp
Am I crazy to tilt if I see a widow and hanzo dual lock on my team?


Just imagine what Flow3r + Wraxu would do as a duo.

Yeah, I just pooped a bit in my pants as well.

Play the game, worry less about others unless something is going wrong then fix it.
The problem is neither were doing a thing and wouldn't switch. It dont really matter. I am going to consider it typical end of season trolling seeing as both of them were rocking heroes after many matches with a really low win rate
12/13/2017 07:49 AMPosted by CultofZAL
12/12/2017 02:41 PMPosted by polishpimp
Am I crazy to tilt if I see a widow and hanzo dual lock on my team?


Just imagine what Flow3r + Wraxu would do as a duo.

Yeah, I just pooped a bit in my pants as well.

Play the game, worry less about others unless something is going wrong then fix it.


I think it's fair to say that you should give basically any team composition a shot. Like I said in my previous post i'm willing to play with double sniper. But with that said I think a problem that other games (except for like csgo) don't have is the ultimate economy. Creating a team composition that's very strange and won't tend to work very well most of the time and then switching when it does go badly isn't as so simple as "Well, now we have a more standardish team composition so we should do better.". Often by the time this happens you've had 1-2 teamfights where your team probably hasn't done well and besides feeding the enemy team ultimate charge you're also resetting your own on every character that you switch. This often leads to the enemy maintaining a dominating position in the game because for the next 1-2 team fights you're at a dramatic ultimate disadvantage and by the time things even out you're 4+ teamfights into the game without accomplishing much. Meaning that you're operating at a significant handicap in terms of how much time you need to make up for.

For any CSGO players imagine you're playing CSGO and your team decides it wants to play in a way strange way. Which costs your team the first 5 rounds. This results in a dramatic economical advantage for the enemy team that you'll feel for the rest of the first half of the match. This doesn't mean you shouldn't have an open mind but it should be recognized that things aren't completely reset if you're switching after team fights have happened.

This doesn't mean that you shouldn't allow people to play what they want but it has to be recognized as a problem.

p.s. Obviously though this is much less true for KOTH than other game mode because the game will have 3 hard ultimate economy resets.
Widow hanzo can be good, especially if the other team is running widow, hanzo can pretty much give Widow constant wall hacks
12/13/2017 05:53 AMPosted by KiloCycle
It all depends on rank.

Yes, I said it.

Sub platinum shouldn't even be allowed to select snipers. They can play McRee to get snap-to-head hitscan skills. They don't have to select duo sniper.


You realize this would make Plat the noob sniper rank, right?
I love how a lot of responses here are justifying how sometimes it does work, sometimes the pros can really do it... I guess hope springs eternal.

2750 and below snipers are so damage inconsistent that having two makes it so your DPS is a non-presence.

Am I saying to tilt? No, in fact that may be gratifying for them. But if you're Platinum or below, lets just say you shouldn't be tanking or healing for duo snipers either. Go Soldier or Roadhog and make your own way. That way you won't feel like a fool for trying to work around sociopaths who refuse to work with a better comp when the loss inevitably comes 75-85% of the time.
12/13/2017 09:00 AMPosted by REDACTED
I love how a lot of responses here are justifying how sometimes it does work, sometimes the pros can really do it... I guess hope springs eternal.

2750 and below snipers are so damage inconsistent that having two makes it so your DPS is a non-presence.

Am I saying to tilt? No, in fact that may be gratifying for them. But if you're Platinum or below, lets just say you shouldn't be tanking or healing for duo snipers either. Go Soldier or Roadhog and make your own way. That way you won't feel like a fool for trying to work around sociopaths who refuse to work with a better comp when the loss inevitably comes 75-85% of the time.


Ensuring that they are completely useless isn’t really that path to victory. I guess if it makes you feel less foolish, then that’s the important thing, right?

You are right, it usually won’t work out. Such is life. 40% of your matches will be unwinnable anyway, so just take the loss and move on. But for me, I’d rather give myself the best chance for success, even if it’s a low chance.
12/13/2017 09:09 AMPosted by Awesomelaser
Ensuring that they are completely useless isn’t really that path to victory.


As a community the forums has already declared that things like this doesn't matter. What matters is that you're trying to win regardless of the context of your team. This has been demonstrated by the OTP threads these days. You can't condemn a tank player for going dps to try to do more consistent damage when his team has gone double sniper. Going further every justification of how well snipers can do (top level players) have very little tank support.

12/13/2017 09:09 AMPosted by Awesomelaser
You are right, it usually won’t work out. Such is life. 40% of your matches will be unwinnable anyway, so just take the loss and move on. But for me, I’d rather give myself the best chance for success, even if it’s a low chance.

His primary argument is that you're statistically better off trying to go dps yourself and making plays than staying as a tank and hoping that double sniper will make a big enough play consistently enough to enable your team to work. Because let's be honest double sniper requires big plays to succeed.

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