[Feedback Thread] Mercy Updates - Jan 30, 2018

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02/17/2018 04:07 PMPosted by SaintBoot
02/17/2018 02:10 PMPosted by Hanallua
I'll give proper feedback rather than make suggestions for change; maybe it would be more constructive than my first post here.

So, Valkyrie now feels lackluster. I see the use of it (in pushes, it does the job pretty well) so it's become more of a proactive ult, but in a "fun" pov it's boring. Valk has always been a bit underwhelming but the previous 2 insta reses made it feel more heroic. Now it lacks the fun and impacting aspect it used to have.

The duration nerf was needed. 20 seconds sometimes made me look at my screen like "still not over?? I'm getting tired here". I still get those moments sometimes (as someone said earlier, battle mercy valk are often bored; I'm one of those).

I don't mind the res as it is, as it's challenging, but I'd definitely prefer it to be earned or locked in ult. You'd differentiate a good Mercy from an average or bad one.

Just to note: hide and res was just switched around from mythical/niche to mandatory. Although the amount of times I'd res in front of people and they'd just either ignore me or miss my head altogether... (then again I'm just in gold, although I spend most of my time in QP since I don't like comp all that much)

Bunny hop is amazing. It actually low key makes me keep playing Mercy because her mobility is super super fun. Which is why Valk pales in comparison; it's less rewarding.

Anyway, I hope the devs are still reading the threads.


The problem is people here HAVE done what you just did, and 3 mega topics later and 30,000 replies and still no devs giving feedback TO the feedback.


Yeah, I know. I've been reading the threads for a long time. I probably wasn't clear when I said I'd give feedback rather than suggestions to change; what I meant was related to a previous post of mine in which I made suggestions for change precisely (I actually first made a thread, bc i figured suggestions and feedback weren't the same, but it wss locked and i was redirected here :( )

So i meant that perhaps starting with feedback of my experience would be better before sending in my suggestions. Not that I actually thought the devs would look at my suggestions but I guess it nevers hurts to try (and dream...)

That being said, it's discouraging when every thread regarding Mercy, even those that are not feedback threads but suggestions thread, gets locked and redirected here. Idk if the devs are actually reading or not, they said they were, but it does feel a lot like "let's keep the unhappy mercy mains here in a tidy little thread so they don't flood our forums and let's let them talk to themselves until they get quiet"
02/17/2018 06:27 PMPosted by WhateverAlex
Quick reminder to everyone that they probably won't be transferring this to the new forums, since they find Mercy to be in a "good place".

We'll probably be forced to deal with this snoozefest of a hero since her pickrate is okay. Maybe in 6 months will they think about changing her.


What's it gonna be? I heard people mentioning a new forum but what does that mean? every thread here will be erased?? D:
Just wondering if Valkyrie is ever going to get a voice line to notify the team that it's charging or on cooldown?
"My ultimate Valkyrie is ready"
"I'm ready to use Valkyrie"
"Valkyrie is charging"
02/17/2018 08:40 PMPosted by Hanallua
02/17/2018 06:27 PMPosted by WhateverAlex
Quick reminder to everyone that they probably won't be transferring this to the new forums, since they find Mercy to be in a "good place".

We'll probably be forced to deal with this snoozefest of a hero since her pickrate is okay. Maybe in 6 months will they think about changing her.


What's it gonna be? I heard people mentioning a new forum but what does that mean? every thread here will be erased?? D:
New format entirely. It'll be a new website I'm pretty sure, or new section of the Battle.net forums. Nothing will be transferred over, and they will redirect every new thread here to the other forum.
02/17/2018 09:02 PMPosted by Macster
Just wondering if Valkyrie is ever going to get a voice line to notify the team that it's charging or on cooldown?
"My ultimate Valkyrie is ready"
"I'm ready to use Valkyrie"
"Valkyrie is charging"
You really think they'd put that much work into Mercy? They not only left us with a 30 second cooldown ability that doesn't let us notify teammates of its cooldown, but they just straight up wiped her previous ultimate alert lines.

They just wanted to make Mercy less annoying for the DPS crowd, and to have her pickrate in an okay condition. There is no consideration of QoL for Mercy players anymore.
I'm a pacifist myself, who loves helping people. Everytime I see someone in need in this game, I rush to their side to help them, even at my expense. Problem is, with her being as slow as she is now, during rez, I am just a burden on my team where once I was a blessing.

I can't send my consultation fee if I am not exactly earning it, now can I?
If we're thinking of nice QoL changes for Mercy outside of ressurect.

I think if guardian angel had the knockback and damage properties of D.va's boosters it could help Mercy escape bodyblocking and make some interesting plays.

I find it kinda dumb sometimes when I try to fly to an ally and the enemy bodyblocks me.
02/17/2018 09:55 PMPosted by Aqur
If we're thinking of nice QoL changes for Mercy outside of ressurect.

I think if guardian angel had the knockback and damage properties of D.va's boosters it could help Mercy escape bodyblocking and make some interesting plays.

I find it kinda dumb sometimes when I try to fly to an ally and the enemy bodyblocks me.
The fact that her GA will still fly you into a wall for 2 seconds instead of just stopping is pretty dumb.
Quick question: Would it be bad if Mercy's rez now had no cast time?

The big issue previously was that she had too many rezzes, moved too fast, and overall just provided too much. But now, with no extra rezzes whatsoever, would the one instant cast rez be so bad?

Personally, if it was instant cast, I would be fine with Mercy. My main issue was the interruption of her mobility and losing fluidity in gameplay by using your one big ability. But without that, I think her gameplay would feel solid.

Nevermind the lackluster ult at that point, at least we're having fun.
https://youtu.be/NT6iatOfwLU?t=1364
02/17/2018 11:03 PMPosted by Alexaction
https://youtu.be/NT6iatOfwLU?t=1364
If only that video wasn't so irrelevant to the actual argument. Try again.
02/17/2018 09:42 PMPosted by SaintBoot
I'm a pacifist myself, who loves helping people. Everytime I see someone in need in this game, I rush to their side to help them, even at my expense. Problem is, with her being as slow as she is now, during rez, I am just a burden on my team where once I was a blessing.

I can't send my consultation fee if I am not exactly earning it, now can I?
This isn't true though. I understand that getting nerfed sucks and it may have been more fun before with the ability to reverse a whole lost team fight. But to say Mercy is a burden on the team is the sort of hyperbole that makes the Devs and the community at large dismiss the complaints.

Is the game worse or better after the last patch? It is better...

I hope they find a happy medium with Mercy engagement but the reality is that all the current Mercy players complaining about the lack of fun compared to 1.0 were gleefully playing Mercy before the recent nerfs...which were essentially tweaks the current live kit. How does a less powerful version of the same kit equate to the notion that she is "not fun"? I think the real issue is that it sucks to get nerfed. I'm a DVA main. Been there. They eventually worked it out...And there may be more nerfs in the future. I don't know. It is what it is.

That said, its a losing battle to say that a needed nerf equates to a requirements to revert to a version of Mercy that the Devs intentionally moved away from due to legitimate issues it introduced to the game.

Let's recap on the Mercy you guys are clamoring for:
An ultimate that didn't require line of sight, that made Mercy invulnerable instantly after she hit Q that could rez the entire team after legitimately getting outplayed and losing a team fight. People like to talk about ult economy but the reality is we don't get to pick and choose so easily how we win team fights. On the second capture point with 30 seconds left the supposed counter play is to save your ults? Well if you lose the team fight outright holding back you just lose the game. Very counter intuitive if you ask me(and Blizzard apparently).

Let's talk about "just kill her", "click on her head" etc: The aforementioned invulnerability and rezzing through walls aspect completely destroys this argument. Just kill someone who is invulnerable to all damage? Who you doesn't have to be in shooting lane to completely overturn her team's failed team fight? Absurd.

I sympathize with the FACT that Mercy's had to strategize to pull off their big rez. But the bottom line is there was ZERO counter play once she hit the button. There was zero counter play if she was behind a wall. And the 2cp maps were a joke with Mercy present. You COULD ACTUALLY KILL HER and have her respawn in time to win the game outright with a mass rez on 2cp with very little counter play.

It was fun for you guys...it took strategy...but it was bad for the game. I know its hard to take and I would agree in your shoes...but Blizz made the right move. The game is much more interesting now than it was then.
Well if everyone would just stop playing her they would have to fix her. But if you guys keep her pick rate up they will leave things as they stand. Iv switched off of her and play Moria now as I dont want anything to do with that what ever it is they replaced Mercy with.
And we're really eager to hear, we want to hear what the Mercy players have to say and we want to hear what people who have played on the receiving end of that team-wide resurrect feel and how they feel about Valkyrie


Well guess what Jeff I really dont like the path you have chosen with taking Mercy. Her fun factor has been stripped away from being the hero she once was into a flying spectator heal bot whose power and impact towards an ultimate fight has been stripped away so she's left with a measly above amp'd crossfade healing to her entire team. What makes her more different then a Lucio pick he has way more to his kit and has way more fun tools that he can utilize and be effective with. Plus an ultimate that has the potential to deny multiple ultimates.

We feel like Mercys will feel a lot more engaging to play than standing around the corner, hiding, waiting for that moment to press the ultimate


Well you fixed that problem Mercy doesn't need to hide around the corner waiting to push her ultimate, but now she needs to fly into the skybox so she doesn't get killed by the enemy team.

The other thing that we've been hearing frequently from Mercy players is "Hey, Mercy doesn't have an alternate ability."


Which the developer team just needed to have a look and see what the core problem with Mercy's kit was and the design flaw they found was Mercy would hide behind a wall and use her Mass Resurrect to counter ultimates.

What I concluded from that was. Mercy's kit was super defensive "Healing and Resurrecting her dead team" maybe we should give her an ability that contributed to teamfights more. We've created this prototype for Mercy called "Valkyrie" maybe if we toned it down to fit as an ability it would help her to make more plays and open up new ways to utilize this alternate ability which they have been asking for maybe providing some good teamfight potential on a short active time and since it's pretty powerful on a longer Cooldown timer.

The next issue we've found was... Mercy is the only support hero (with the exception of Ana and Moira) that didn't have her ultimate blocked by barriers. Thinking about it this way, would it be fair for us if we allowed McCree to shoot people through barriers with his ultimate? Hmm... Probably not a good idea if it was. So maybe if we changed her Resurrect so that it was blocked by barriers maybe it would be a little more counterable? The next main issue was that it doesn't need to utilize LOS to cast her ultimate, which was the main issue of her design flaw so maybe we should've tried adding a LOS requirement so Mercy couldn't hide and Resurrect. We've noticed that Mercy's Resurrect is instant and there is no room for counterplay. So maybe if we added a cast time of about 1.75 seconds so it becomes Q push --> voiceline --> (1.75 second) --> Resurrect enemies would have a moment to react to Mercy's ultimate. Since this seems a little unfair to the Mercy player let's have it so that she can push Q and lock onto however many people she see's and if she can dive past the enemy barrier before her cast time goes off she will be rewarded with a Mass Resurrect. That would make her ultimate fair, balanced and counterable to both sides.

The other thing is, that on the receiving end, like, let's say you're on a team that puts a lot of effort into getting a full team wipe. You use a Zarya Graviton Surge and maybe have Pharah rain justice from above on top of that. (See how he only used this example, because this is the only combo of ultimates that can't be outhealed by Zenyatta.) You wipe out the entire enemy team, it's pretty disheartening to have Mercy just erase that moment with a full team rez. So we felt like her Resurrect was something that needed to be addressed.


So why didn't you look at how the Resurrect worked initially and see how you could erradicate the problem all together? The problem was it wasn't counterable, it didn't have downsides to using it, and it was instant. So taking what I told you why couldn't you have made adjustments to how the old ultimate worked. We could throw that back onto you and say, as a Mercy player I don't find it fair that I was damage boosting my Genji using blade but Zenyatta was outhealing his damage. I dont think it's fair that Lucio can use Beatdrop on his team that got earthshattered and was about to be hit by Junkrat's tire only to be denied completely. We put a lot of effort into getting a full team wipe only to be denied by a Lucio ultimate. Now the ball is in your field. The argument, "well it can be countered" will never hold true because Mercy wasn't ever given a chance to have some counterability to her ultimate.

We are complaining that her kit as it stands is unfun. Sure as it stands on Live she is balanced but that's because you are giving her an underpowered ultimate that has no drawbacks upon using it by offsetting it with an ability that has a lot of drawbacks and is really powerful. So keeping that in mind wouldn't it make sense to have her ultimate full of drawbacks and counterability options for the enemy team and have an ability that Mercy can use freely without drawbacks. Wouldn't that help in making the hero more fun and diverse? Feel free to PM me if you would like some feedback I know I can help make Mercy fair and balanced for both sides if you take the time and respond to me! I just don't want my hero to be this way, because it just doesn't feel right having such an underpowered ultimate be the cause of an ability that is super powerful. When the two of them should be flipped.
02/17/2018 05:22 PMPosted by AkiraNasuki
Again Raw Healing can only do so much... If the player isn't taking much damage just boost them... Mercy's healing is so strong, as long as they don't take too much, just damage boost them all the way. In a One on One fight the boosted player should win.


Before this all I usually didn't use dmg boost, so the amount were laughable as much as her On Fire. But sometimes I've got a feeling players are afraid of using it. Sure, I can have 500 dmg amplified, or even 1000 (happened once), but it also can be 100, because no one took advantage of my support.

02/17/2018 05:53 PMPosted by SaintBoot
<span class="truncated">...</span>

No its actually 7 Megathreads.


Then that's much worse.


And also the "no to revert" were posted in a different, random thread. That speaks a lot.

02/17/2018 10:17 PMPosted by WhateverAlex
Quick question: Would it be bad if Mercy's rez now had no cast time?


Yes. That made the whole must-pick mess.
02/18/2018 12:50 AMPosted by Nicolas
Yes. That made the whole must-pick mess.


He did make it clear though, considering all the other nerfs, it may not be so bad. I mean instant rezzing doesn't help much since you're a much easier target now, but there would at least be something going for that ultimate.
I'd rather avoid another toxic wave because of that.
Valkyrie needs an instant res and maybe a little more speed. If that happens, she will be more engaging and exiting to play, imo.

The Mercy fanbase is obviously not happy at all; so it shouldn't be considered a successful rework quite yet. But if these changes are made; I think we could cap off the rework.

If she's a little strong then I think a cool nerf would be to decrease the distance on the beams in Valkyrie, but with the extra speed. That way Mercy has to be a bit closer to the fight but also has the speed to hopefully survive it.
Can we try letting mercy shoot and use her beams during a ult or long distance Rez or letting other characters fly. Lol fly reaper
Here are something i feel that it will improve Mercy a bit, the rework failed so lets just try something a bit better.
Mercy's Valkyrie remove cooldown of Guardian Angel
Also her heal / damage boost isnt interrupted when casting Valkyrie (she holds up her staff during the cast time which stop her heal and db )
When using Valkyrie, her beam connect range will be as long as beam extended range. Additionally, her beam will stay connected 1s longer after losing LoS

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